Datcon hours meters in Robinsons.
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Port Townsend,WA. USA
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I think flight time and maintenance time is suppossed to be clocked for actual flight (off the ground). But most schools sign your log for the time used (master on) that they charge out to the student. It would hard to charge for 1.1 hour and sign the log 1.0 hour.
The previously mentioned school also charged for ground training, which is common I suppose. But they would bill me for the instructors time while I performed the preflight everytime. That really angered me. The preflight check list was about 6 pages and takes about 15 min. Then the post flight ground instruction was usually about 5 min and the charge was 30 min(to include the preflight).
Shop around.
Another freelance instructor gave me 3 hours of ground for free. Go for a freelance if you can.
The previously mentioned school also charged for ground training, which is common I suppose. But they would bill me for the instructors time while I performed the preflight everytime. That really angered me. The preflight check list was about 6 pages and takes about 15 min. Then the post flight ground instruction was usually about 5 min and the charge was 30 min(to include the preflight).
Shop around.
Another freelance instructor gave me 3 hours of ground for free. Go for a freelance if you can.
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Paris, Fort Lauderdale
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On the first R44 the hobbs was working on the oil pressure as on the R22. It was later changed for the collective activated.
The FAA stated that only the flight time is the way to mesure helicopter time.
Then it is authorized by a lot of FSDO to have the R22's hobbs modified to be collective activated as on the R44. However do not expect to have the factory endorse it...
As an owner I prefer this solution as nobody needs to cheat on the cool down time
As a customer I have more for my money.
As an operator/CFI I hate it as I can charge less and log less hours...
The FAA stated that only the flight time is the way to mesure helicopter time.
Then it is authorized by a lot of FSDO to have the R22's hobbs modified to be collective activated as on the R44. However do not expect to have the factory endorse it...
As an owner I prefer this solution as nobody needs to cheat on the cool down time
As a customer I have more for my money.
As an operator/CFI I hate it as I can charge less and log less hours...
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Aus
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On the Airservices Australia website there is a description of "Flight Time" reguarding log books
This states; "In the case of a helicopter, whenever helicopetre rotors are angaged for the purposes of a flight, the time will be included in the flight time"
http://www.airservices.gov.au/pilotc...ps/logbook.pdf
This states; "In the case of a helicopter, whenever helicopetre rotors are angaged for the purposes of a flight, the time will be included in the flight time"
http://www.airservices.gov.au/pilotc...ps/logbook.pdf
Join Date: Jan 1999
Location: Australia
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The R22 Maintenance Manual - Section 3 - paragraph 3.002 states:
later in the same section it states:
The R44 Maintenance Manual - Section 3 - paragraph 3.002 states:
Tinkicker...
It is the operator’s responsibility to maintain accurate time-in-service records of the airframe and life-limited components. An hourmeter activated by engine oil pressure is standard equipment in the R22 helicopter and is an acceptable means of recording time-in-service.
The approved overhaul intervals and the fatigue service lives listed in the Airworthiness Limitations Section are based on FAA Advisory Circular 20-95 which assume that 10.5% of the operating time will be in autorotation, runup, or shutdown. Therefore, if an hourmeter activated by the collective control is used to record the time-in-service, the values recorded must be multiplied by 1.12 when determining replacement times for life-limited components, engine and airframe overhaul periods, and other periodic inspection requirements.
It is the operator’s responsibility to maintain accurate time-in-service records for the airframe, engine, and life-limited components. An hourmeter activated by engine oil pressure is standard equipment on earlier R44 helicopters and is an acceptable means of recording time in service. Later helicopters are equipped with an hourmeter activated by a combination of oil pressure and up collective; the hourmeter will record time only when engine oil pressure exists and the collective is raised.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: South East England
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Thanks for all your answers guys looks like we,ve opened up the proverbial "can of worms".Seems like it would be a good idea when choosing a helicopter school to establish exactly what the datcon is recording as well as the notional rate.Could make a huge difference given the amount of time helcopters spend on the ground and apparently cheapest may well not be.Caveat emptoir
Join Date: Aug 2000
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I have just been catching up on the tech logs for my R22. We have done 60 hours in the last 10 weeks in a total of 120 flights. This is an average of only 30 mins per flight. Assuming a 5 minute startup/warmup and a 5 minute shutdown/cooling period per flight, that means we have spent 20 hours out of 60 on the ground with the collective down and the Datcon ticking away. So if it was being charged out on the basis of the Datcon that would be a lot of pennies for doing not very much.
