Precision aerial crane work using mirrors
Howcanwebeexpectedtoflylikeeagles
whensurroundedbyturkeys
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 202
Likes: 0
From: Scotland
Hello Capn Notarious,
I've trialled a video camera & screen and it doesn't work. You need 3D vision.
Most of the underslinging I have done has been with a crewman in the back, both long line and short line (AS332L). We eventually justified getting a bubble door which made all the difference. We were no more accurate than flying the load blind but we were much quicker. Still prefer to have a crewman in the back as an extra pair of eyes which have better all round vision below the aircraft.
I can well understand why the full time underslingers prefer direct vision rather than mirrors but I have seen some very good mirror pilots.
I've trialled a video camera & screen and it doesn't work. You need 3D vision.
Most of the underslinging I have done has been with a crewman in the back, both long line and short line (AS332L). We eventually justified getting a bubble door which made all the difference. We were no more accurate than flying the load blind but we were much quicker. Still prefer to have a crewman in the back as an extra pair of eyes which have better all round vision below the aircraft.
I can well understand why the full time underslingers prefer direct vision rather than mirrors but I have seen some very good mirror pilots.
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 564
Likes: 0
From: Chilliwack, BC Canada
Tec, I'm not sure of your experience level, or if you've ever been in North America, but you may not realize just how much of this VR work goes on over here.
On any given Summer day, I can easily spend a 9 hour day on a 150' line. It becomes second nature if you do enough of it....others I know LIVE at the top end of a line, think of 500 + hours a year doing just that...nothing else.
Believe me, I can hit a spot consistantly, and fast, because I HAVE TO. If I don't or can't, my competitor can.
One job last year had 100 - 1,500 Lb loads in to a jobsite, all on a 150' line, and on an 8 minute turn-around, rain, fog, snow, whatever. the site was deep in the trees, and we actually stacked (lumber) loads on top of loads, no room otherwise.
What I do in general charter is NOTHING compared to Seismic and Logging pilots. A good logger will do 2-3 minute turns all day on the end of a 200+ ft line, ...10 hours a day.
On any given Summer day, I can easily spend a 9 hour day on a 150' line. It becomes second nature if you do enough of it....others I know LIVE at the top end of a line, think of 500 + hours a year doing just that...nothing else.
Believe me, I can hit a spot consistantly, and fast, because I HAVE TO. If I don't or can't, my competitor can.
One job last year had 100 - 1,500 Lb loads in to a jobsite, all on a 150' line, and on an 8 minute turn-around, rain, fog, snow, whatever. the site was deep in the trees, and we actually stacked (lumber) loads on top of loads, no room otherwise.
What I do in general charter is NOTHING compared to Seismic and Logging pilots. A good logger will do 2-3 minute turns all day on the end of a 200+ ft line, ...10 hours a day.
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 447
Likes: 30
From: Europe
(heliswiss is going at the moment to hongkong, ordered to slingload amazing construction parts)
Look at Kamov HB-XKE, it has a huge bubble window on the left side. Below it, they have a little instrument panel for TQ and so on. They fly VR AND use the mirrors. Whatever works best in that particular moment.
I made the experience that old pilots rather use mirrors and young pilot VR.
What I do not understand is, that you can convert the AS350 to be flown from the left side with a bubble window. But have only seen one of them in Alaska. Never in Europe. Where is the problem?
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 506
Likes: 1
From: Europe
Rotorbee
seems to me as the same i wrote on the first part of this thread.
A AS 350 to be flown from the left side is an optional kit (incl. 1 additional seatplace in front) from EC. The number of AS 350 with this kit is limited, mostly used by tour operators. But there is also a bubble door on the right side of the a/c available.
Look at Kamov HB-XKE, it has a huge bubble window on the left side. Below it, they have a little instrument panel for TQ and so on. They fly VR AND use the mirrors. Whatever works best in that particular moment.
To have mirrors doesn't mean to forget VR. The pilot could use both methods and choose the best in one moment.
... There are not so much helicopters with side instruments....
... There are not so much helicopters with side instruments....
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 447
Likes: 30
From: Europe
When Longlining how does the pilot know when the load starts to swing?
If you look out of the windshield and you can see the load - it swings
If you look out of the side window and you can see the load - it swings
If you look down and you can't see the load - it probably swings
If you look through the roof window and you can see the load - don't worry anymore if it swings or not.
Tecpilot:
I know it is an optional kit, but in the AS350 it helps a lot to sit on the left side. I just wonder why nobody is doing it in europe.
Ok, in the B3 the floor window is bigger, but still...
Wasn't there a kit to move the pilots seat more to the right?
Crazy load?
I have a friend who flew logs for a log cabin around. Each about 15 feet long. He flew one after the other with a 206 .... A CESSNA 206. Legal, but it looks weird.
If you look out of the windshield and you can see the load - it swings
If you look out of the side window and you can see the load - it swings
If you look down and you can't see the load - it probably swings
If you look through the roof window and you can see the load - don't worry anymore if it swings or not.
Tecpilot:
I know it is an optional kit, but in the AS350 it helps a lot to sit on the left side. I just wonder why nobody is doing it in europe.
Ok, in the B3 the floor window is bigger, but still...
Wasn't there a kit to move the pilots seat more to the right?
Crazy load?
I have a friend who flew logs for a log cabin around. Each about 15 feet long. He flew one after the other with a 206 .... A CESSNA 206. Legal, but it looks weird.
Last edited by Rotorbee; 25th February 2005 at 11:33.
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 491
Likes: 3
From: Iceland
few Q to 407 Driver, when you do your VR sling, are you still sitting in the right hand seat? or do you have left seat provision? Bubble windows? or are the normal high visibility windows good enough?
don't want to hi-jack this thread but it was turning into long-line thread
don't want to hi-jack this thread but it was turning into long-line thread
