Rotorheads A haven for helicopter professionals to discuss the things that affect them

EC120

Old 26th Jul 2011, 08:52
  #581 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Europe
Posts: 549
What good will it bring? Heavy engine, less reliability and more noise.

The technology used is expected to yield a power-to-weight ratio between those found on trucks and those found in diesel-equipped racecars.
120 has a power to weight ratio of 0,29 hp per kilogram, a 650 hp "diesel racecar" - Audi R10 has 0,70 hp per kilogram.

I guess it all depends on what sort of truck they are talking about

Might as well try hamster power.
Phoinix is offline  
Old 26th Jul 2011, 16:45
  #582 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 36
More noise!?
Less Reliability?
Heavier? You got me

Reduced fuel burn, lower cost per hour, less expense at overhaul, more Tq,, and less risk of a ship-crippling un-contained failure are not good things that will come from using diesel?
OEI-Dave is offline  
Old 26th Jul 2011, 18:31
  #583 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Europe
Posts: 549
Less reliability in terms of more moving parts.
Thermal efficiency of diesel engine is around 32%, whereas turbine engines are at 40%+. With same fuel caloric value that is less power / more fuel.

More torque is hard to benifit from when the transmission is the limiting factor.


I doubt it will be all that cheap, maybe at first. Looking at diesel cessnas, at first maintenance was very cheap but now its getting more expensive than conventional engines.
Phoinix is offline  
Old 26th Jul 2011, 19:08
  #584 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 36
Agreed. However, a diesel (or any recip) uses that energy differently than a turbine. A turbine may have a better thermal efficiency than a reciprocating engine. But the smaller turbines use up to 50% of that energy to keep the engine running. Which is not very efficient. Recip engines loose less power to keep the engine alive. If given the same amount of fuel the recip engine will make more power.

As far as cost. I can see diesels getting expensive but I hardly think it will surpass the cost of a turbine. Of a gas engine, maybe. But a gas engine that would make enough power to lift the planned Eurocopter would not be feasible and or economic.
OEI-Dave is offline  
Old 27th Jul 2011, 00:49
  #585 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: the cockpit
Posts: 1,081
Hi all,

Does anyone operate an EC120 with a medical fit or role? Or know of a link to any EMS EC120?
helmet fire is offline  
Old 27th Jul 2011, 01:53
  #586 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 32
Hi Nellycopter,

Sorry for the delay in answering.
I was referring to the MR Head Lead Lag Dampers above. The weights under the floor are the Cabin Anti-Vibrators, sometimes called the Hammers.
As they are very frequency sensitive, sometimes they will not dampen out the 3 per as well as they can/should if the NR has drifted from nominal.
Have you had a track and balance carried out recently?

Rigidhead
Rigidhead is offline  
Old 6th Feb 2012, 13:14
  #587 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: canada
Posts: 80
If anyone is interested, if you want to operate below 0 degrees C with a S/N ship below 1412 I think and using fuel with no anti ice additive. you can get the fuel pump screen modded up to a -618 at the overhaul shop.vs buying a new one. this and modding the fuel inlet screen on the line on the firewall, will allow you to go to -15.
lamanated is offline  
Old 19th Apr 2012, 12:19
  #588 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: canada
Posts: 80
another headsup
check your ground wire on the battery, they will break at the base from being disconnected all the time, Ours lasted 2000 hrs.
lamanated is offline  
Old 19th Apr 2012, 12:22
  #589 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: canada
Posts: 80
Heads up for EC120 people

went to hook the battery cable up today and noticed it was almost broken through at the bottom connection, the ship has 2000 hrs. takes a second to look at..
lamanated is offline  
Old 29th May 2012, 20:43
  #590 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: canada
Posts: 80
another thing to look for, the LH engine door rear saddle that the rubber rests in, the mounts rivets will loosen up. also the aft nav light will vibrate and wear the contact on the spring inside, so if your going through bulbs, look inside at the contact...
lamanated is offline  
Old 29th May 2012, 20:52
  #591 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Near the bottom
Posts: 1,340
All good stuff lamanated - keep 'em coming
toptobottom is offline  
Old 19th Mar 2013, 19:37
  #592 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: canada
Posts: 80
Was reminded today of the 7 day run to maintain oil film and fuel wetting of components , and a log book entry to back it up, any failure to do it, ie storage or heavy maintenance rendered it unservicable, you can vent it up to 3 times but then it goes back for overhaul.
potential sellers and buyers and reps are told to look for these entries .. or steer clear of ship as its 60K min charge to have a look at it otherwise.
lamanated is offline  
Old 19th Mar 2013, 20:49
  #593 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Hawaii, USA
Posts: 18
SN 120?

Anyone out there flying SN 120?
Flew it many years ago, just wondering what is is doing now?
Thanks~
EX-PJ is offline  
Old 26th Mar 2013, 23:33
  #594 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Europe
Age: 48
Posts: 70
Ec120 Patrulla Aspa

Ejército del aire. Descargas
Milo C is offline  
Old 27th Mar 2013, 03:10
  #595 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: n/a
Posts: 76
Just wondering if anyone else has heard that EC are thinking of making a EC120C, which will have a beefed up transmission. I know the pilots that fly them have been wanting it for years, but I've heard this rumor from more than one source.

What else would you like to see on a 'C' model?

NiB
Never in Balance is offline  
Old 27th Mar 2013, 04:18
  #596 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Depends on the day!
Posts: 116
A cheaper price.
PhlyingGuy is offline  
Old 27th Mar 2013, 06:58
  #597 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Near the bottom
Posts: 1,340
A MRGB that doesn't corrode itself to dust after 10 years
toptobottom is offline  
Old 27th Mar 2013, 10:53
  #598 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: England & Scotland
Age: 60
Posts: 1,411
TTB - is there a story behind that last post?
John R81 is offline  
Old 27th Mar 2013, 20:02
  #599 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: anywhere
Posts: 3
Hi All,
I'm looking for an nice low hours Colibri. Year 2008 and up, preferably based in the EU. Should anyone be interested in selling please PM me.
Best,
kingrat is offline  
Old 28th Mar 2013, 20:00
  #600 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Near the bottom
Posts: 1,340
TTB - is there a story behind that last post?
I know of several EC120s that have been through their 12 year inspection. All have suffered from varying levels of corrosion on the MRGB. Sometimes, this can be repaired by the (appropriately authorised) maintenance company, but in my case, it's so bad that it can't be repaired. A replacement from EC will cost in the region of €77,500

I heard of one E120 that was 4 years old with just 450 hours and it had suffered MRGB corrosion to a level that meant a replacement.

It seems to be a design or production problem with the 120.
toptobottom is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.