airsickness
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2003
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From: Midlands
airsickness
Simple question really,
I have my PPL(A) but suffer the occasional bout of airsickness on particularly bumpy days in the usual 152's etc.
I am very keen to go rotary however and was wondering how badly turbulance affects the robinson r22. Anyone care to comment?
Regards Obs cop
I have my PPL(A) but suffer the occasional bout of airsickness on particularly bumpy days in the usual 152's etc.
I am very keen to go rotary however and was wondering how badly turbulance affects the robinson r22. Anyone care to comment?
Regards Obs cop
Joined: Nov 2002
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From: floating around
In the initial stages you would probably be to focused on flying the machine to even think about anything else, the handy thing about helicopters is there are lots of places to land to spill your guts.
If worse comes to worse, pick a spot out in the distance and think happy thoughts!
Make sure you bring a sick bag just in case, pukeing over the instruments could get you into serious trouble.
You will never know unless you try.
If worse comes to worse, pick a spot out in the distance and think happy thoughts!
Make sure you bring a sick bag just in case, pukeing over the instruments could get you into serious trouble.
You will never know unless you try.
Joined: Sep 2002
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
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From: Great South East, tired and retired
It rarely happens when YOU are flying, mostly when the instructor is doing something, and you are looking inside instead of at the horizon.
Helicopters tend to punch through the turbulence better than light-wing-loading planks, so you will be affected a bit less, but the manoeuverability of a helo means you can be thrown around more than a plank.
Win a bit, lose a bit - but don't lose it on the panel or the instructor's lap.
Helicopters tend to punch through the turbulence better than light-wing-loading planks, so you will be affected a bit less, but the manoeuverability of a helo means you can be thrown around more than a plank.
Win a bit, lose a bit - but don't lose it on the panel or the instructor's lap.
Joined: Mar 2002
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From: Queensland Australia
My feeling has always been that helicopters don't suffer anywhere near as much as fixed wings from turbulence.
But even so I knew a bloke who had to quit his training because he got airsick at 1 hour after taking off. He could almost set his watch by the regular time frame.
But overall it doesn't seem to be as much of a problem for helicopters. Most of the affects are rotational in the horizontal plane rather than than rolling as the machine weather cocks and I think that is less disturbing on the middle ear where all the conflicts occur which cause the sickness.
But even so I knew a bloke who had to quit his training because he got airsick at 1 hour after taking off. He could almost set his watch by the regular time frame.
But overall it doesn't seem to be as much of a problem for helicopters. Most of the affects are rotational in the horizontal plane rather than than rolling as the machine weather cocks and I think that is less disturbing on the middle ear where all the conflicts occur which cause the sickness.
Joined: Jan 1999
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From: Somewhere
I've been flying for over twenty years, and I still get sick in a 152!
While ten years of air ambulance has shaken any queasiness over things that would turn most peoples' stomachs, I have gotten motion sickness a few times in helicopters; once in a mountain pass with very high winds and I actually smacked my helmet against the window a few times, once in a S76 during a diving turn that the other pilot pulled out of as I was reaching between my feet for my dropped sunglasses, and even to this day, if its really rough, I'm in the soup and I've got my head down doing paperwork for too long, I start feeling green.
Keep your head up, eyes on the horizon, either the real thing or your ADI if you're IFR, and get some fresh air across your face. You may never conquer it, but with experience you'll learn when its coming on and know how to deal with it.
While ten years of air ambulance has shaken any queasiness over things that would turn most peoples' stomachs, I have gotten motion sickness a few times in helicopters; once in a mountain pass with very high winds and I actually smacked my helmet against the window a few times, once in a S76 during a diving turn that the other pilot pulled out of as I was reaching between my feet for my dropped sunglasses, and even to this day, if its really rough, I'm in the soup and I've got my head down doing paperwork for too long, I start feeling green.
Keep your head up, eyes on the horizon, either the real thing or your ADI if you're IFR, and get some fresh air across your face. You may never conquer it, but with experience you'll learn when its coming on and know how to deal with it.
Joined: Apr 2000
Aviation Qualifications: ATP+Mil
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From: EGDC
You can get yourself de-sensitised to airsickness but it is not a very pleasant experience. The RAF used to (and maybe still do) a de-sensitisation course which involved being strapped into a seat that was mounted on a hydraulic ram. The ram could reproduce any frequency of vertical oscillation that you were likely to experience in flight and you stayed in it until you were sick. The next day you got up, had breakfast and strapped in again; the process continued and the time between strapping in and puking increased (in theory). I know a few people who gat through flying training after going on this course, who otherwise could not have continued. The only problem one guy had was when he went on leave - after he came back to flying he was sick on the first trip and then he was OK again.
The teetering head on an R22 (yes Lu I know it's not strictly teetering) means it absorbs turbulence much better than semi-rigid rotor systems in more modern/advanced helos and it will certainly be better than a 152.
The teetering head on an R22 (yes Lu I know it's not strictly teetering) means it absorbs turbulence much better than semi-rigid rotor systems in more modern/advanced helos and it will certainly be better than a 152.
Joined: Mar 2004
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From: Perth
Usually, as you become more experienced, your airsickness will diminish. There are some (very few) people who cannot seem to shake it off though, but usually they do not fly more than a few flights before giving up. If you have a PPL it is highly unlikely that you fall into that category. Even for experienced pilots after a break from flying you can feel airsick if its bumpy or you're experiencing a bit of "g" (particularly negative). I have nearly 6000hrs and very occasionally still feel airsick after a few weeks off. If, during your training, airsickness is becoming an issue then there is medication that can be taken (usually for a week) that is compatible with flying. However you MUST obtain it through a specialist in aviation medicine and not your local GP. As far as RW airsickness is concerned you are probably not going to be affected so much in an R22 as a C152, because as the previous posts suggest, the rotor will absorb many of the bumps that a fixed wing will not. Above all, do not worry about it! it is part of the great experience of being a pilot! 
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2003
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From: Midlands
Thanks all for the advice.
I should have pointed out that I have actually done the RAF's airsickness desensitisation course, and what you missed out crab was the lovely fast jet section of the course in the School of Aviation Medicine hawks! Now that's fun. The thing is that the course desensitises, but only if you can keep regular exposure to the flying motion and stimuli.
I used to be an observer in the Fleet Air Arm and so spent much time in the pitch black rear of the mighty Seaking, with some problems. However, that is over 21000 lb of airframe whereas a robinson 22 is only 1300 lb.
It is rare that I suffer too many problems in a C152 when I am flying, but it was a bit boucy the other day (smacked my head off the door!) and out came the bag. Very disheartening to have to end a flight prematurely. I now have enough money to seek a PPL(H), but from your comments it seems likely that an average robinson should be better than a 152. The next thing now will be a trial flight. Can't wait.
Thanks all
Obs cop
I should have pointed out that I have actually done the RAF's airsickness desensitisation course, and what you missed out crab was the lovely fast jet section of the course in the School of Aviation Medicine hawks! Now that's fun. The thing is that the course desensitises, but only if you can keep regular exposure to the flying motion and stimuli.
I used to be an observer in the Fleet Air Arm and so spent much time in the pitch black rear of the mighty Seaking, with some problems. However, that is over 21000 lb of airframe whereas a robinson 22 is only 1300 lb.
It is rare that I suffer too many problems in a C152 when I am flying, but it was a bit boucy the other day (smacked my head off the door!) and out came the bag. Very disheartening to have to end a flight prematurely. I now have enough money to seek a PPL(H), but from your comments it seems likely that an average robinson should be better than a 152. The next thing now will be a trial flight. Can't wait.
Thanks all
Obs cop
Stormy
Joined: Oct 2003
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From: Australia, and I love it!!
I agree with Ascend Charlie that not doing the flying has caused me problems - in lighties and gliders. In both I'm fine if I'm flying.
I don't fly helicopters but have spent lots of time in them as a pax, and strangely haven't been past feeling mildly queasy despite some hairy rides and some long distance ones.
I don't fly helicopters but have spent lots of time in them as a pax, and strangely haven't been past feeling mildly queasy despite some hairy rides and some long distance ones.
Joined: Mar 2004
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From: ----------
I can only go on what I have experianced
I flew an R22 to Sywell some time ago (in the distant past) it was a nice warm day and a smooth flight I was collected and flown back in I think it was a TB10 and traveled back through the same air space but was bounced all over
I would only suggest it but I think you will find rotary far easiar to cope with.
As is mentioned ealiar in the tread if you are flying hands on you will be concentrating more on this than Air sickness.
Best of Luck.
Regards
Bravo 99 (AJB)
I flew an R22 to Sywell some time ago (in the distant past) it was a nice warm day and a smooth flight I was collected and flown back in I think it was a TB10 and traveled back through the same air space but was bounced all over
I would only suggest it but I think you will find rotary far easiar to cope with.
As is mentioned ealiar in the tread if you are flying hands on you will be concentrating more on this than Air sickness.
Best of Luck.
Regards
Bravo 99 (AJB)
The Original Whirly
Joined: Feb 1999
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 4,327
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From: Belper, Derbyshire, UK
I used to get airsick in C152s and similar, and still occasionally do, even when I'm flying, if it's really bumpy. It's almost never happened to me in helicopters; they're much much better in turbulence. The only time I remember was after doing the R44 conversion in the US, then doing the test to get the rating added to my licence in the UK. Strong winds, low cloud, rain, and the instructor making me do autos, confined area approaches etc etc in quick succession. When we'd finished he commented on how well I'd done despite only 5 hours in the type and difficult conditions...and I didn't think it was the time to tell him that I was feeling very queasy. 
Crazy Scandihooligan
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 482
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From: Damn, some mountain goat is nibbling my ear ;-)
Air sickness
I reccomend STUGERON.
Great for dealing with over enthusiastic instructers doing autos ;-)
Used it a great deal at sea, before becoming a helo pilot.. Works a great treat, without affecting the vestibular sytem.
Good luck
MD
Great for dealing with over enthusiastic instructers doing autos ;-)
Used it a great deal at sea, before becoming a helo pilot.. Works a great treat, without affecting the vestibular sytem.
Good luck
MD
Last edited by MD900 Explorer; 3rd April 2004 at 10:52.
Joined: Mar 2004
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From: coventry uk
hey obs cop, take a trial lesson and you will find theres so much to see from a 22 cockpit that airsickness doesnt really occur, as oppossed to the letterbox view from a 172, you get all round vision with a 22 so your senses dont tend to get decieved so much, if your in the midlands pop up to cov airfield and see us.
if you need advice on a good training school send me a p/m and well talk.
if you need advice on a good training school send me a p/m and well talk.
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 395
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From: Midlands
Had me trial lesson today,
Oh me god!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
No not airsickness, just how do you keep one of these things in some semblance of control!
Despite my best attempts at self induced hamfisted unco-ordinated flight, not even a hint of motion sickness despite loads of thermal activity. I can catagorically state that in the same hour in a cesspit 152 I would have felt decidedly dodgy and most probably would have got close to a chunder.
Now if I can get it to do what I want....................
Obs cop
Oh me god!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
No not airsickness, just how do you keep one of these things in some semblance of control!
Despite my best attempts at self induced hamfisted unco-ordinated flight, not even a hint of motion sickness despite loads of thermal activity. I can catagorically state that in the same hour in a cesspit 152 I would have felt decidedly dodgy and most probably would have got close to a chunder.
Now if I can get it to do what I want....................
Obs cop
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 409
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From: SE England
Obs Cop,
Glad you enjoyed the trial lesson - bit bloody addictive, isn't it? I'm not sure if it's just fun, or the determination to stop the damned helicopter doing it's own thing, but it certainly keeps you at it.
On the plus side, there are so many gaps round the doors on the R22 that there will always be a nice breeze blowing across your face to keep the queasiness at bay!
In the last four years I have only flown one person who felt a bit yucky and that was on a fairly warm, turbulent midday trip along H4, so perhaps with the benefit of hindsight it was to be expected.
Good luck with the course.
DBChopper
Glad you enjoyed the trial lesson - bit bloody addictive, isn't it? I'm not sure if it's just fun, or the determination to stop the damned helicopter doing it's own thing, but it certainly keeps you at it.
On the plus side, there are so many gaps round the doors on the R22 that there will always be a nice breeze blowing across your face to keep the queasiness at bay!
In the last four years I have only flown one person who felt a bit yucky and that was on a fairly warm, turbulent midday trip along H4, so perhaps with the benefit of hindsight it was to be expected.
Good luck with the course.
DBChopper
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 78
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From: Planet Earth
Obs cop
Many moons ago I got exactly the same problem. I went through my PPL OK but when I went to the Air Force and started learning aerobatics (Harvard T6-Texan) I got "that" problem.
Went to several kinds of drugs to aleviate the problem but no way. Then we find out that it was only when I did not have the commands and was somehow "G" related.
So the teaching way was changed. I got all kinds of explanations on the ground and then would go and try to do it on my own without interference of the instructor.
It worked so well that all those badly executed and uncoordinated aerobatics started to make the instructor sick
Well I got away with it and finished the course in a very good position. Later went to the choppers but I never had any kind of problem with those machines. I was trained in Alouette III's and the articulated heads and rotor flexibility greatly atenuated the effects of turbulance and I never had any problem. Those small piston helicopters I don't know. Never flew a single piston hour in my life
Many moons ago I got exactly the same problem. I went through my PPL OK but when I went to the Air Force and started learning aerobatics (Harvard T6-Texan) I got "that" problem.
Went to several kinds of drugs to aleviate the problem but no way. Then we find out that it was only when I did not have the commands and was somehow "G" related.
So the teaching way was changed. I got all kinds of explanations on the ground and then would go and try to do it on my own without interference of the instructor.
It worked so well that all those badly executed and uncoordinated aerobatics started to make the instructor sick
Well I got away with it and finished the course in a very good position. Later went to the choppers but I never had any kind of problem with those machines. I was trained in Alouette III's and the articulated heads and rotor flexibility greatly atenuated the effects of turbulance and I never had any problem. Those small piston helicopters I don't know. Never flew a single piston hour in my life
