bureaucracy and its costs
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 667
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From: Germany
bureaucracy and its costs
It's been almost a year now that they initiated JAR-FCL 2 in Germany. They try to convince us that it will make things easier. But all I can see is that everything is getting more and more screwed up and more expensive.
In September 2003 I passed my FI(H) checkride. In November I was due for my annual checks and simultaniously applied for a JAR-FCL2 licence.
The annual medical was €65 for the eye examination and € 200 for a blood donation.
For the issuance of the JAR-FCL licence I was charged €90 ( € 30 for the licence plus € 15 per type rating (4 there are)).
But what happened to my FI(H)???
No entry, no notification, no nothing....
I waited and waited and waited.... I wrote E-mails.... I wrote letters.... I tried to call... nothing...
Now, just the other week I finally received a brand new licence including the FI(H) and the TRI(H) entry for all single engine helicopters I hold a type rating for.... and an additional invoice... of €120 (€ 30 for the FI(H) and € 30 for each additional TRI(H).
I finally ended up in paying a total of € 475 (not considering the check-rides themselves).
If I have to pay that amount of money again next year I'll better stay home...
How much is it in England or else where????
In September 2003 I passed my FI(H) checkride. In November I was due for my annual checks and simultaniously applied for a JAR-FCL2 licence.
The annual medical was €65 for the eye examination and € 200 for a blood donation.
For the issuance of the JAR-FCL licence I was charged €90 ( € 30 for the licence plus € 15 per type rating (4 there are)).
But what happened to my FI(H)???
No entry, no notification, no nothing....
I waited and waited and waited.... I wrote E-mails.... I wrote letters.... I tried to call... nothing...
Now, just the other week I finally received a brand new licence including the FI(H) and the TRI(H) entry for all single engine helicopters I hold a type rating for.... and an additional invoice... of €120 (€ 30 for the FI(H) and € 30 for each additional TRI(H).
I finally ended up in paying a total of € 475 (not considering the check-rides themselves).
If I have to pay that amount of money again next year I'll better stay home...
How much is it in England or else where????
Joined: May 2002
Aviation Qualifications: ATP+Mil
Posts: 18,633
Likes: 1,072
From: Downeast
I do not ever want to hear how good it is on the Eastern Side of the Salt Water Divide....reminds me why I have no desire to renew my UK ATPL.
Renewing the US License requires a medical...total cost about $150. Total....done deal...out the door.
That assumes one remains current per FAR Part 61. For a regular working helicopter pilot...all checkrides are done as part of your work. Maintain IF currency by means of Hood or Actual then you are done.
Renewing the US License requires a medical...total cost about $150. Total....done deal...out the door.
That assumes one remains current per FAR Part 61. For a regular working helicopter pilot...all checkrides are done as part of your work. Maintain IF currency by means of Hood or Actual then you are done.
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 148
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From: Canada/around
In Canada:
$100.00 CAD to get the medical
$60.00 CAD to Transport Canada as an 'administrative fee'
they only charge for rating/endorsements when you intially have them added to the licence. $30.00 CAd each if I remember correctly.
$100.00 CAD to get the medical
$60.00 CAD to Transport Canada as an 'administrative fee'
they only charge for rating/endorsements when you intially have them added to the licence. $30.00 CAd each if I remember correctly.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 23
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From: SE
Oh you should all know how lucky you are.
In Sweden, the costs are as follows....
Issuing a PPL will cost
4 000 SEK (€437) for the practical skill test.
2 800 SEK (€306) for the PPL theory examn
4 320 SEK (€472) as fee for issuing the PPL licence.
A total of 11 120 (€1 215) for a PPL in fees.
A commercial licence will cost you a an additional fee of 20 000 SEK (€2 732).
Anyone who knows of fees higher than these?
In Sweden, the costs are as follows....
Issuing a PPL will cost
4 000 SEK (€437) for the practical skill test.
2 800 SEK (€306) for the PPL theory examn
4 320 SEK (€472) as fee for issuing the PPL licence.
A total of 11 120 (€1 215) for a PPL in fees.
A commercial licence will cost you a an additional fee of 20 000 SEK (€2 732).
Anyone who knows of fees higher than these?
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 364
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From: Just over there....no there.
'ello Spunk,
Nice to see I'm not the only one paying through the nose for incompetant senseless LBA burocracy!
Mine is up for renewal in April, I'm just wondering what they are going to charge me for swapping it for a JAA one
can't spell bureaucracy either any more, been here too long, time to go home
Nice to see I'm not the only one paying through the nose for incompetant senseless LBA burocracy!
Mine is up for renewal in April, I'm just wondering what they are going to charge me for swapping it for a JAA one
can't spell bureaucracy either any more, been here too long, time to go home
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,030
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From: Over here
My total cost is $0. The medical exam is $75, which is paid entirely by employer-provided medical insurance. There are no annual costs for a license in the U.S., nor for the initial issuance, other than the cost for the instruction and aircraft, and for the medical exam. The government gets nothing. Whether or not this is fair is an entirely different question.
Thread Starter
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 667
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From: Germany
Yo CyclicRick,
(is that you R.Y.?....) I can tell you how much it's gonna be...
It's going to be €30 for the JAA licence plus an additional € 15 per type rating. But don't apply on a Friday, they will charge an additional over-weekend-stay fee...
Frank
(is that you R.Y.?....) I can tell you how much it's gonna be...
It's going to be €30 for the JAA licence plus an additional € 15 per type rating. But don't apply on a Friday, they will charge an additional over-weekend-stay fee...
Frank
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 1,835
Likes: 3
From: Philadelphia PA
One of the things to appreciate if you are an FAA licence holder is that the FAA is mandated to provide the minimum legislation necessary for safety.
This means that any change in the rules must be open to comment by the public (individuals, associations, lobbyists, industry- all are the public), and if enough adverse comments are made, the FAA has to take that into account.
The FAA has to show that it's proposed actions are in the public interest.
Don't you wish that all other aviation authorities (and other government agencies) had this sort of mandate???
In another way to look at this- if they are going to start charging for the renewals, and probably lots of other things, then you should be able to demand that they meet the requirements that are imposed on those they regulate. So, if they send someone to do a check ride on you, you should be able to see that they are all properly trained, have the necessary ratings and currency, and so on. You should also be able to demand a level of service (i.e. turnaround time for renewals, access to regulatory personnel, etc.) that is commensurate with what you are paying for.
(One of the interesting things with the FAA is that since it's free, you really can't complain about the service....)
This means that any change in the rules must be open to comment by the public (individuals, associations, lobbyists, industry- all are the public), and if enough adverse comments are made, the FAA has to take that into account.
The FAA has to show that it's proposed actions are in the public interest.
Don't you wish that all other aviation authorities (and other government agencies) had this sort of mandate???
In another way to look at this- if they are going to start charging for the renewals, and probably lots of other things, then you should be able to demand that they meet the requirements that are imposed on those they regulate. So, if they send someone to do a check ride on you, you should be able to see that they are all properly trained, have the necessary ratings and currency, and so on. You should also be able to demand a level of service (i.e. turnaround time for renewals, access to regulatory personnel, etc.) that is commensurate with what you are paying for.
(One of the interesting things with the FAA is that since it's free, you really can't complain about the service....)
Avoid imitations
Joined: Nov 2000
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 15,110
Likes: 1,083
From: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
I wanted to obtain my UK ATPLH followed by my CPLA.
Because I was a military QHI & QFI, I was granted some written exam exemptions for which I was grateful.
When it came to make arrangements to sit and pay for the exams, I said I wished to take all those required for both licences, at the same time.
I was told I couldn't do this. The miserable B******s made me pay for the (same) written exams twice - Yes, the whole lot twice even though I wasn't allowed to sit them all!
Mine's the big palm tree by the lift at the Gatwick Belgrano Indoor Gardens.
Because I was a military QHI & QFI, I was granted some written exam exemptions for which I was grateful.
When it came to make arrangements to sit and pay for the exams, I said I wished to take all those required for both licences, at the same time.
I was told I couldn't do this. The miserable B******s made me pay for the (same) written exams twice - Yes, the whole lot twice even though I wasn't allowed to sit them all!
Mine's the big palm tree by the lift at the Gatwick Belgrano Indoor Gardens.
