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Comments on this landing welcomed

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Comments on this landing welcomed

Old 4th Mar 2015, 08:51
  #1 (permalink)  
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Comments on this landing welcomed

Apologies if this is in the wrong forum, but I am seeking the opinions of airline pilots.

I don't know if this video has been discussed here before, but it's led to a bit of 'difference of opinion', so the views of the experts on here would be welcome:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-NPkZRAS9Y

One point of view is that it should have been a go-around as the touchdown is very late so obviously too fast at threshold.

Another POV is that the extra speed was inevitable due the terrain and subsequent approach pattern, and holding off and 'floating' to bleed off the speed before touchdown was good airmanship.

What do Prooners think?
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 09:42
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It was a very late landing, but to be fair to the pilots the runway is ill equipped with touchdown or distance-to-go markers making a judgement far more difficult.
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 09:46
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Press-on-itis. That was a horrendous float, and looks like they used up well over half of the LDA whilst airborne. Can only imagine how quickly the end of the runway was appearing in the windshield. Bleed off speed on the ground, not by holding off.
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 09:48
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Should have been a GA, however if you've got no fuel perhaps stop at all costs was the aim.

Two straight from the Boeing FCTM.

Floating above the runway before touchdown must be avoided because it uses a large portion of the available runway. The airplane should be landed as near the normal touchdown point as possible. Deceleration rate on the runway is approximately three times greater than in the air.
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 09:51
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Floating is not good airmanship.. airliners only stop with the wheels on the ground and the brakes applied.
No need to be fair to the pilots.. they should have gone around. They were very very lucky to get away with it.
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 09:53
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Well, at least they all walked away from it !

Seriously, my admiration to the pilot. Maybe he should have gone round, but he got it down safely at what is an extremely difficult airport. Hats off to him !
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 10:26
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Bubbers 44 will have something to say about that!
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 10:29
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NO. Not hats of to him. Especially in difficult airports with short runways, you land in the touchdown zone or go around.
They stopped using maximum braking on a dry runway with nothing to spare.
So instead of hats of, I would say shame on them.
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 10:51
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Agreed, no hat's off.
Once if became obvious that they had floated past the touchdown zone they should have gone around.
They reached the end of the runway still at some speed and were extremely lucky to be able to turn off. Any number of variables, if different, could have caused an excursion.
A difficult approach should be managed correctly so as to achieve a touchdown at the correct point on the runway. It should not be used as an excuse!
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 10:57
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No admiration for the pilots, reckless press-on-itis.... go-around was the only option.... would like to have known how hot the brakes became afterwards
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 11:13
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Very sporty!

Had a landing like that downhill, learning to fly. Fortunately I had the CFI in the seat next to me insisting that I hold the stick fully back and brake firmly only after the nose wheel dropped. Stopped with a hundred yards to spare, but left to my own devices, would have gone through a row of parked aircraft and a hedge.

I learned that day just how quick you could stop once all three wheels were on the ground and the wing was fully stalled and how long you would float if you tried to follow the ground downhill.
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 11:26
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GOULI - sounds like the instructor should have initiated a go around.
As for the post in question - Hats Off yes ...... As he is marched into the chief pilots office for a bollocking!
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 11:30
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GA style, came in too fast. They simply blow it.

Hats off for the guys in video below. This is a routinely job:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x36oAfY6anM
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 12:37
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02 at Tegucigalpa is one runway you definitely don't want to overrun:

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Old 4th Mar 2015, 12:41
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They should show this during type & recurrency training.

Then ask why did the crew continue even though they knew it was risky and becoming more and more unsafe.
An interesting discussion should then begin.....

Learn from other people's mistakes, as you will not live long enough to make them all yourself.
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 12:42
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That should buff out.
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Old 4th Mar 2015, 13:02
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Foxmoth

A go around would have been much more risky with very low airspeed and trying to outclimb rising ground and a row of pylons. I learned a lot that day. Don't get yourself in that situation in the first place but if you do, deal with the situation calmly and logically. Make the right control inputs and let the plane do its stuff. The CFI was ex WW2 RAF, so when he gave instructions, I listened.
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Old 7th Mar 2015, 11:21
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Facts: LDA RW02 1664m/5459ft, elev 3306ft, PAPI 5.3 degrees, slight downslope.
Briefing: TEM?
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Old 7th Mar 2015, 11:34
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Who needs runway markings?? You either put the thing down ASAP after crossing the R/W threshold or you go around, period. That pilot burnt up far too much concrete, before touch down. If he was carrying the extra speed for the bank, there was plenty of time to get the excess speed bled off, between leveling the wings and before the touch down.
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Old 7th Mar 2015, 19:49
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I entirely agree with SOP monkey. That is quite atrocious.
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