FOD AT IAD
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FOD AT IAD
Delay after boarding at IAD yesterday evening gave me plenty of leisure in which to observe activity on the ramp at Concourse C. Immediately obvious was a mini whirlwind of trash drifting around the base of an adjacent jetway - plastic cups, bags, paper and general rubbish .
In the course of more than an hour - the delay was bag-related, was there a baggage slow down at IAD yesterday? - none of the ramp personnel or nearby flight crew seem to have thought it their business to get the mess cleared up.
UAL seem to take a positive pride in their disinterested style of cabin service but I'd always rather hoped they were more professional on operational matters. Quite apart from the safety aspects of a contaminated apron, this random observation suggests a culture in which loose trash around running engines is seen as somebody else's responsibility.
Anybody - especially from IAD/UAL - care to comment? Assuming, that is, you can take time off from making self-congratulatory in-flight videos!
In the course of more than an hour - the delay was bag-related, was there a baggage slow down at IAD yesterday? - none of the ramp personnel or nearby flight crew seem to have thought it their business to get the mess cleared up.
UAL seem to take a positive pride in their disinterested style of cabin service but I'd always rather hoped they were more professional on operational matters. Quite apart from the safety aspects of a contaminated apron, this random observation suggests a culture in which loose trash around running engines is seen as somebody else's responsibility.
Anybody - especially from IAD/UAL - care to comment? Assuming, that is, you can take time off from making self-congratulatory in-flight videos!
Have you seen anything in United's overall safety record lends itself to your analysis? If you do, please share the source of that criticism. As a travel writer, do you feel that qualifies you to pass judgement in the area of flight safety?
I fly for another airline, but commute on UA frequently to/from work and have never found a reason to doubt they have a good program in place and the appropriate culture of safety exists. There may be room for improvement inmthe cabin, and in some of the amenities in the narrow body fleet. I would think that would be more your area of expertise.
I fly for another airline, but commute on UA frequently to/from work and have never found a reason to doubt they have a good program in place and the appropriate culture of safety exists. There may be room for improvement inmthe cabin, and in some of the amenities in the narrow body fleet. I would think that would be more your area of expertise.
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Not passing judgement, West Coast, just making an observation. Ten years+ in support of military flight operations and a modest PPL has taught me that a lax attitude to FOD is inconsistent with a healthy safety culture. What conclusion would you have drawn..?
The difference being, I wouldn't have drawn a conclusion.
To make any claim about the operational safety or pretty much anything else about an airline that operates thousands of flights a day on a casual observation and not on appropriate data is baseless.
To make any claim about the operational safety or pretty much anything else about an airline that operates thousands of flights a day on a casual observation and not on appropriate data is baseless.
Last edited by West Coast; 4th Mar 2013 at 01:34.
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Well, sir, I yield to your superior knowledge - though I do wonder what the "appropriate data" in this case might be. My guess is that airport and airline policy on apron trash is pretty clear - any amount greater than zero is too much.
So I'm puzzled that the tone of your response seems both dismissive and defensive. Experience has shown that observation - even casual, amateur observation - has a value in flight safety. It's observation that leads to the thought "maybe we should keep this area clean" or even "maybe I should pick up some of this stuff before some paying customer thinks our standards are slipping."
I'm not suggesting UAL is unsafe. But whether you operate one flight or a thousand flights per day, how you do (or fail to do) the small things invites assumptions about how you do the big things. Smart airlines know this - and so do their employees. Just in the hour I was watching, at least a dozen staff ignored an obvious accumulation of FOD. That doesn't look good - and I'm surprised anyone, least of all a professional, would want to suggest otherwise.
So I'm puzzled that the tone of your response seems both dismissive and defensive. Experience has shown that observation - even casual, amateur observation - has a value in flight safety. It's observation that leads to the thought "maybe we should keep this area clean" or even "maybe I should pick up some of this stuff before some paying customer thinks our standards are slipping."
I'm not suggesting UAL is unsafe. But whether you operate one flight or a thousand flights per day, how you do (or fail to do) the small things invites assumptions about how you do the big things. Smart airlines know this - and so do their employees. Just in the hour I was watching, at least a dozen staff ignored an obvious accumulation of FOD. That doesn't look good - and I'm surprised anyone, least of all a professional, would want to suggest otherwise.
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My guess is that airport and airline policy on apron trash is pretty clear - any amount greater than zero is too much.
FODNews.com
In general, there's a committee of responsibility, which starts with the airport manager and includes the various tenants and airport users at commercial airports. Expert input comes from engine and aircraft OEMs and operators.
Just because ground crew are working a UAL flight doesn't mean that they are employed by that airline or that they're authorized to venture to adjacent gates on the ramp. It may not be a UAL issue at all, it may be a IAD issue, a training issue, a supervision issue, a union issue, any number of things. Could be any one of a number of policies in place for not venturing near an aircraft or gate one isn't actively servicing or picking up debris from a gate with a parked aircraft. Not to justify any of this, but frankly, I wouldn't know, and neither would you without making an inquiry directly. I've flown probably 4 flights in and out of IAD in as many years, so my sample size is a bit small.
One's view out of a scratched 15 x 30 cm bit of perspex is a snapshot, not a comprehensive view of airport operations. Genuine concern would probably be better addressed to the IAD airport manager in the form of a letter with a copy to the UAL operations supervisor with as much detail as you can manage.
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Quite clearly you believed there to be a problem, but not so big a problem that you felt it necessary to bring it to anyone's attention prior to departure.
Perhaps you are right. You were there. I wasn't. Someone who wasn't there can't make a judgment upon what you saw. Someone who doesn't know how operations are conducted at that airport can't make meaningful contributions toward rectifying any perceived problem.
Which is why it is baffling that you get exercised about it on PPRuNe, rather than to those people who are in a position to do something about it.
End of.
Perhaps you are right. You were there. I wasn't. Someone who wasn't there can't make a judgment upon what you saw. Someone who doesn't know how operations are conducted at that airport can't make meaningful contributions toward rectifying any perceived problem.
Which is why it is baffling that you get exercised about it on PPRuNe, rather than to those people who are in a position to do something about it.
End of.
