Do 737-800s Fall Over?
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Do 737-800s Fall Over?
Yesterday when flying back from Hamburg we were told by the 2 legged inflight entertainment systems that we were not allowed to sit in rows 1 & 2 "because it unbalances the aircraft, the pilot told us."
Apparently the "Row 1 & 2 rule" is "In the regulations, haven't you seen it"
Where is it in Chapter 25, I can't find it but I haven't yet looked up the subchapters Green Cheese (Structure of Moon) and Easter Bunny (Existence Of)
It must be a real bummer for Boeing to launch the 737-800 only to find that if you sit people in rows 1&2 the plane falls over. I'm surprised more operators haven't complained.
Who can shed light on this one?
Apparently the "Row 1 & 2 rule" is "In the regulations, haven't you seen it"
Where is it in Chapter 25, I can't find it but I haven't yet looked up the subchapters Green Cheese (Structure of Moon) and Easter Bunny (Existence Of)
It must be a real bummer for Boeing to launch the 737-800 only to find that if you sit people in rows 1&2 the plane falls over. I'm surprised more operators haven't complained.
Who can shed light on this one?
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Bull****
I think you have been had.
The only thing that comes near to what you are telling is that when an aircraft is very empty they will use "SEAT BLOCKING CARDS" to keep people of certain rows, this is as far as i know to keep the CG within limits.
But this will not only be rows 1 and 2.
Hope this helps
Grtz Stall
The only thing that comes near to what you are telling is that when an aircraft is very empty they will use "SEAT BLOCKING CARDS" to keep people of certain rows, this is as far as i know to keep the CG within limits.
But this will not only be rows 1 and 2.
Hope this helps
Grtz Stall
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A most perplexing story MIB 
As Rubik says, which way is it gonna fall??
Now the only thing I can imagine that might come close to an explanation, is something having to do with weight & balance.
It happens, on a very empty AC, that the FA's get told to make sure that nobody changes seat before take-off due W&B.
This would then have rather less to do with the aircraft falling over but rather with the seats you wanted to vacate, as this might shift the balance of the AC.
Hope this sheds some light on it for you, and rest assured that a 737-800 will not not fall over forwards when you occupy the first row.
Perhaps you should post this in the "questions" forum; there are kind people there, a few of whom are actually pilots on the 800 and they might be able to give you a conclusive answer.
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A 2 legged entertainment system
As Rubik says, which way is it gonna fall??
Now the only thing I can imagine that might come close to an explanation, is something having to do with weight & balance.
It happens, on a very empty AC, that the FA's get told to make sure that nobody changes seat before take-off due W&B.
This would then have rather less to do with the aircraft falling over but rather with the seats you wanted to vacate, as this might shift the balance of the AC.
Hope this sheds some light on it for you, and rest assured that a 737-800 will not not fall over forwards when you occupy the first row.
Perhaps you should post this in the "questions" forum; there are kind people there, a few of whom are actually pilots on the 800 and they might be able to give you a conclusive answer.
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A 2 legged entertainment system
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maninblack wrote:
Yesterday when flying back from Hamburg we were told by the 2 legged inflight entertainment systems
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I would just like to tell you that our hard working CC do not deserve to be patronized in this manner.
AAA out.
Yesterday when flying back from Hamburg we were told by the 2 legged inflight entertainment systems
-----
I would just like to tell you that our hard working CC do not deserve to be patronized in this manner.
AAA out.
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It's true
Flown many times with Ryanair, most recently on a flight from Malmo when the plane was far from empty and 1st 2 front and rear-most row of seats were blocked off.
I have no idea why, only ever experienced it with FR a/c.
I assume the poster is referring to Ryanair.
Regards
I have no idea why, only ever experienced it with FR a/c.
I assume the poster is referring to Ryanair.
Regards
Sounds like BS to me.
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I've noticed it before with Ryanair- I'd assumed it was to keep the emergency exits clearer for use in the event of...
Seems a sensible thing to do- maybe the wording is so the pax dont get frightened!
Seems a sensible thing to do- maybe the wording is so the pax dont get frightened!
ryan air CC will block seats in row 1 and 2 so that when they are empty and not busy they aren't stared at by anyoning pax.
They tell you its weight and balance so you don't ask anymore awkward questions.
Wobbers
P.S. I don't work for them
They tell you its weight and balance so you don't ask anymore awkward questions.
Wobbers
P.S. I don't work for them
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In our company the Purser (a.k.a. Head of the 2 legged inflight entertainment systems) sometimes claims the first row for herself. (mostly on near-empty stretches). Here, she can do some of her administrative duties during the flight, without blocking the pantry. It's not supposed to happen, but it happens !
I prefer the overwing seats myself !
I prefer the overwing seats myself !
Cabin crew get pissed off if they have to sit facing passengers, from their jumpseats, in row one. Maybe they didn't want anyone sitting there when there were empty seats elsewhere?
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A couple of points:
a) Looking for a slightly tail-heavy trim gives the optimum trim from a weight and balance perspective....aircraft slightly heavy so most fuel-efficient.
b) Some operators (including Ryanair I believe) use a 'standard seating plan' to simplify the load planning / load control process. For example, I believe Ryanair plan a particular baggage split (50%/50% for example, but I don't know the actual figs) regardless of how many bags are on board. The cabin crew then have a seating plan which will, for any given passenger load, identify which seat rows will be unusable. Saves all that faffing about with drop-line trim charts on a loadsheet.
Mike Oscar
a) Looking for a slightly tail-heavy trim gives the optimum trim from a weight and balance perspective....aircraft slightly heavy so most fuel-efficient.
b) Some operators (including Ryanair I believe) use a 'standard seating plan' to simplify the load planning / load control process. For example, I believe Ryanair plan a particular baggage split (50%/50% for example, but I don't know the actual figs) regardless of how many bags are on board. The cabin crew then have a seating plan which will, for any given passenger load, identify which seat rows will be unusable. Saves all that faffing about with drop-line trim charts on a loadsheet.
Mike Oscar
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I can't think of a tech reason for this, but can think that it might poss give the FA's a little more room to move on a low load sector, or avoids pax staring into the galley/jumpseat area.
Whatever the reason may be, what ultimately is the issue? - presumably the contract between the customer and the carrier is for transportation, by air, in a seat to the destination specified. It would appear that these conditions were complied with.
If certain seats on board are blocked off by crew for any reason whatsoever then that is not the business of passengers to query such in a fit of pique because they can't have what they want.
If I sound a little tense it is because I resent being described as "two-legged IFE". Working in the cabin I have to smile, tolerate and accept a level of abuse and ill-manners that sometimes shocks even other customers - here on PPrune I don't have to... thank God!
Whatever the reason may be, what ultimately is the issue? - presumably the contract between the customer and the carrier is for transportation, by air, in a seat to the destination specified. It would appear that these conditions were complied with.
If certain seats on board are blocked off by crew for any reason whatsoever then that is not the business of passengers to query such in a fit of pique because they can't have what they want.
If I sound a little tense it is because I resent being described as "two-legged IFE". Working in the cabin I have to smile, tolerate and accept a level of abuse and ill-manners that sometimes shocks even other customers - here on PPrune I don't have to... thank God!
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doh...
I'm not even sure if you're all joking or not.
After boarding the CA makes a headcount and gives an indication how many pax are seated in wich compartment of the aircraft. Our F70 is divided in three sections. From front to back the first 40 seats, than the next 30 and the last 10. We receive a loadsheet with a seating, and if the actual seating has more than 5 seat-changes to other compartments in comparison to our loadsheet, we have to recalculate the trim/center of gravity. Or we let the CA tell some passengers to move to another row and we don't have to recalculate it. And we pilots our lazy arrogant twats, so we always do the last thing. Can you imagine? "No ma'am, you're not fat, but you have to move to balance the aircraft."
Not sure if the 737 has someting similar. But it would not surprise me if it did.
(edit, 40+20+10=70.... nope 40+30+10=80. Now, that's better)
After boarding the CA makes a headcount and gives an indication how many pax are seated in wich compartment of the aircraft. Our F70 is divided in three sections. From front to back the first 40 seats, than the next 30 and the last 10. We receive a loadsheet with a seating, and if the actual seating has more than 5 seat-changes to other compartments in comparison to our loadsheet, we have to recalculate the trim/center of gravity. Or we let the CA tell some passengers to move to another row and we don't have to recalculate it. And we pilots our lazy arrogant twats, so we always do the last thing. Can you imagine? "No ma'am, you're not fat, but you have to move to balance the aircraft."
Not sure if the 737 has someting similar. But it would not surprise me if it did.
(edit, 40+20+10=70.... nope 40+30+10=80. Now, that's better)
Is it so that the pax can't hear the alarms going off in the flight deck?
As far as two legged entertainment is concerned, that seems pretty mild compared to some of the terms I have heard trolly dollies and tarts with carts call nigels, grease monkeys, SLF etc!
If you can't take a joke you shouldn't have joined.
As far as two legged entertainment is concerned, that seems pretty mild compared to some of the terms I have heard trolly dollies and tarts with carts call nigels, grease monkeys, SLF etc!
If you can't take a joke you shouldn't have joined.