Reclining Seat Disputes
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Join Date: Jan 2001
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Reclining Seat Disputes
Can anyone tell me what the official rules are regarding reclining seats in economy class?
I recently traveled From LGW to TPA and had an unpleasant incident with a very aggressive
passenger sitting behind me who did not like me reclining my seat.
As he would not stop banging the back of my seat, and became close to air rage I eventually gave in.
I must state that I always put my seat up during takeoff, landing and meal service.
Has anyone had a similar experience? If so, how did you deal with it?
I recently traveled From LGW to TPA and had an unpleasant incident with a very aggressive
passenger sitting behind me who did not like me reclining my seat.
As he would not stop banging the back of my seat, and became close to air rage I eventually gave in.
I must state that I always put my seat up during takeoff, landing and meal service.
Has anyone had a similar experience? If so, how did you deal with it?
You may need to consider the problem from his point of view. I've had economy class seats where the reclining of the one in front left the whole weight of the seatback on my knees, and I couldn't move my legs at all. I'm only 5ft 9 inches tall. In some cases, too, if the seat in front is reclined, the tray table is digging into your stomach. If the seat is reclined at the wrong time, there's no avoiding that.
It may have been that you could only recline your seat by causing outright discomfort or pain to the guy behind you.
It may have been that you could only recline your seat by causing outright discomfort or pain to the guy behind you.
Join Date: Jun 2001
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Just ask the cabin crew for some help. Ypu've purchased a seat that according to the sales literature reclines. They will normally assist you in getting your seat to recline. You may even get another (occasionally upgraded) seat if the problem cnnot be rectified.
If however the person behind has a genuine reason, maybe they have an infant on their lap you'll probably get less help.
You could try being even more devious, slightly exagerate that the person behind didn't hit the seat but actually hit your head and that you want the police called on arrival/captain informed/you are going to sue the airline etc etc. That will normally get some action.
But most of all be polite to the cabin crew, make them feel that you are the victim.
If however the person behind has a genuine reason, maybe they have an infant on their lap you'll probably get less help.
You could try being even more devious, slightly exagerate that the person behind didn't hit the seat but actually hit your head and that you want the police called on arrival/captain informed/you are going to sue the airline etc etc. That will normally get some action.
But most of all be polite to the cabin crew, make them feel that you are the victim.
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To be quite honest - I do not see the point of having reclining seats in Economy class on shorthaul flights in the first place. Ok, on long sectors there may be some justification - but in an already cramped environment they merely add to irritation and discomfort. Reclining the seat makes little difference (in my opinion) and some people - especially children seem to mess around with the facility just for the hell of it. In other more spacious cabins, it is of course an enhancement to comfort without any real intrusion on others. There are seats where this is not a problem such as a section front where there is no-one in front to cramp you, or a section rear where you can recline and not annoy anyone, but I reiterate - what is the point of reclining seats in in economy - they are just not worth the bother they cause.
[ 06 August 2001: Message edited by: xxzz123 ]
[ 06 August 2001: Message edited by: xxzz123 ]
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Being 6 3 odd when I've travelled econmomy I use my knees to keep the seat in front from recling (plays havoc with the suit creases) no one's ever complained however! Did have one chap who asked if I could move my legs - "To where?" I asked....
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An ongoing and seemingly insoluable debate.
Caused of course by the laughable pitch in most Y cabins these days.
For an exhaustive point-counterpoint search http://groups.google.com (group rec.travel.air) keyword 'recline'. You will see recurring threads on the subject which all seem to end up with the pros and cons slagging each other off.
Personally I find a full 2-litre bottle of water wedged between one's open tray table and the lip effective in limiting the oafs who feel 'entitled' to lay in my lap.
Caused of course by the laughable pitch in most Y cabins these days.
For an exhaustive point-counterpoint search http://groups.google.com (group rec.travel.air) keyword 'recline'. You will see recurring threads on the subject which all seem to end up with the pros and cons slagging each other off.
Personally I find a full 2-litre bottle of water wedged between one's open tray table and the lip effective in limiting the oafs who feel 'entitled' to lay in my lap.
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Mr Pax I am assuming you were travelling BA and therefore on one of our appauling "AML" services, the seat pitch is not standard "BA fit" therefore everyone is crammed in 10 abreast and pitch also suffers too. BA have realised the error of their way and these appalling seat configs should be phased out by FEB 2002, I am quoting from memory but I think pitch reclines only 5 deg as opposed to 9 deg normal BA economy, and that the seats are 3 inches closer together(in rows), I have suffered these flights on a number of occasions, and added to the worst than useless hired hands it makes for a Very unpleasant experience. 
Union Goon
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A much better solution is to Simply fly American Airlines exclusively. AA's more room through coach really has to be seen to be believed. You can get in and out of a window seat with the person in the aisle or center seat getting up. You can use your laptop etc.
It is quite amazing and I don't understand why anyone would put up with the sardine can treatment after experiencing this.
Cheers
Wino
It is quite amazing and I don't understand why anyone would put up with the sardine can treatment after experiencing this.
Cheers
Wino
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Mr Pax,
this is a typical argument during flights. Whenever it occurs I try to explain to the complaining pax that the person in front of him has the right to recline its seat, and that he can do the same with its seatback, gaining more room by doing so. Of course if this happens in a bad moment (such as meals or services) I very politely ask to the "reclined" person if he can put its seatback upright for some minutes so as to allow the person in the back to eat or do whathever he was trying to do.
It is very important to use a low tone of voice, trying to be heard only by the person you are talking to, so that he has the impression that it is something only between
he and you. Otherwise he would feel aggressed and limited by the other (he would feel like being told, not kindly asked ) and a defying "NO!" would be the answer.
It works in 99% of the cases, unless the argument is already beyond human help. And even in those cases, trying to bring the discussion between he and you and acting as a mediator is very effective. If you are a good mediator, they will accept and understand that there is a share of slight discomfort for both, but they will make an effort to please an empathic person who understands their reasons but so kindly asks.
A much better solution than Wino's better solution would be to fly Air France instead.
You would have lots of legroom, eat french cuisine, drink french wine, and last but not least, maybe have the amazing flyblue take care of you!
[ 10 August 2001: Message edited by: flyblue ]
this is a typical argument during flights. Whenever it occurs I try to explain to the complaining pax that the person in front of him has the right to recline its seat, and that he can do the same with its seatback, gaining more room by doing so. Of course if this happens in a bad moment (such as meals or services) I very politely ask to the "reclined" person if he can put its seatback upright for some minutes so as to allow the person in the back to eat or do whathever he was trying to do.
It is very important to use a low tone of voice, trying to be heard only by the person you are talking to, so that he has the impression that it is something only between
he and you. Otherwise he would feel aggressed and limited by the other (he would feel like being told, not kindly asked ) and a defying "NO!" would be the answer.
It works in 99% of the cases, unless the argument is already beyond human help. And even in those cases, trying to bring the discussion between he and you and acting as a mediator is very effective. If you are a good mediator, they will accept and understand that there is a share of slight discomfort for both, but they will make an effort to please an empathic person who understands their reasons but so kindly asks.
A much better solution than Wino's better solution would be to fly Air France instead.
You would have lots of legroom, eat french cuisine, drink french wine, and last but not least, maybe have the amazing flyblue take care of you!
[ 10 August 2001: Message edited by: flyblue ]
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Maybe one day the privilege will be mine, Flyblue!
This issue seems to cause more aggro than any other on flights. It's not at all uncommon on longhaul sectors for otherwise civilised and reasonable people almost to come to blows over it. And "Waaah! Why should I put my seat up if SHE won't..??" is a regular bleat. From adults, what's more.
This issue seems to cause more aggro than any other on flights. It's not at all uncommon on longhaul sectors for otherwise civilised and reasonable people almost to come to blows over it. And "Waaah! Why should I put my seat up if SHE won't..??" is a regular bleat. From adults, what's more.
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This is indeed an insoluble problem, that is until the airlines realise that passengers in economy class do have feelings. I have found the best solution is just ask politely of the person in front not recline his seat so much. It usualy works. If not ask the Flight Attendant to have a word. 
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If the reponses we've had from CC are any guide, you won't get much sympathy. It's kind of hard to take criticism from people who spend the 12 hours up and about, behind the curtain or in a jumpseat with unlimited legroom.
Interesting you said his seat. I have found that women are less likely to respond to a polite request (flame suit on). And frequent flyers are also more accommodating, in that they tend not to recline fully anyway. It's the once-a-year sun seekers who are most likely to offend.
Mercifully my longhauls in Y are infrequent, but some J configurations aren't much better.
If the reponses we've had from CC are any guide, you won't get much sympathy. It's kind of hard to take criticism from people who spend the 12 hours up and about, behind the curtain or in a jumpseat with unlimited legroom.
Interesting you said his seat. I have found that women are less likely to respond to a polite request (flame suit on). And frequent flyers are also more accommodating, in that they tend not to recline fully anyway. It's the once-a-year sun seekers who are most likely to offend.
Mercifully my longhauls in Y are infrequent, but some J configurations aren't much better.
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I have got to agree, frequent flyers are the most accomodating. They obviously understand the difficulties. I take your point about "his" or indeed "hers". I have found that men are more accomadating than women. Hope I am wrong. Maybe its my perception. Ladies prove me wrong 
[ 12 August 2001: Message edited by: rover2701 ]
[ 12 August 2001: Message edited by: rover2701 ]
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Mr Pax, Economy will allways be a trade off, first people want a cheap ticket then they want a meal and a nice little tray to put things on plus a magazine pocket to fill up. Then they want more room. Sure in a perfect world you would have to put up with an average trip on the whole, but its not perfect, so some people will get a great trip and others a terrible one like you have had. Thats life. Personally when I am seated I wait until it looks like nearly all the pax are in and if there are any free seats I ask to move to them. Otherwise I order a nice scotch or two.
