Amount of Hand Flying
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: US
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The lack of raw piloting skills commented on here is appalling. If you can't hand fly the a/c while undergoing altitude, heading, airspeed and configuration changes IMO you shouldn't be collecting the paycheck.
Stablized straight-in's and the a/p finally comes off? Funny, my father used to give people on their first flights ever ILS's with and without a hood. Used that to demonstrate their need to observe what their control inputs did to the a/c. Zero time pilots.
Unfortunately the accident records are littered with the lack of demonstrated ability.
Stablized straight-in's and the a/p finally comes off? Funny, my father used to give people on their first flights ever ILS's with and without a hood. Used that to demonstrate their need to observe what their control inputs did to the a/c. Zero time pilots.
Unfortunately the accident records are littered with the lack of demonstrated ability.
Join Date: Jul 2002
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I sometimes wonder if an entire generation of pilots are īgrowing upī with hardly any hand-flying skills. There are FOīs who go directly onto FBW aircraft from initial training (<200 hours), for companies which discourage hand-flying, and after several years become captains, presumably with little raw flying ability.
There is nothing wrong with FBW aircraft, and Iīm sure they increase safety immeasuarbly, but at the same time I think there is a need for new pilots to ībed-inītheir skills at an early stage of their careers. If itīs not learned at the beginning, itīs probably very hard to get it back later on.
There is nothing wrong with FBW aircraft, and Iīm sure they increase safety immeasuarbly, but at the same time I think there is a need for new pilots to ībed-inītheir skills at an early stage of their careers. If itīs not learned at the beginning, itīs probably very hard to get it back later on.
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Chamonix
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Time & Place?
My experience was mostly below 500ft....for the 1st 15yrs of my career I didnt have an autopilot. I was all hand flying.
Now Im in the airlines its entirely different!
Handing flying can in fact be a major error! You must pick your time & place....and you must be very careful not to overload the non-flying pilot, as he/she is working extra hard monitoring you and doing his/her normal duties. (The PNF may also be twidling HDG, ALT & IAS knobs for you FDs too!)
At major international airports hand flying is a threat.....
If for half a second you "hand flyers" think that following somee FD bars around the sky is "hand flying" you're in la-la land. My kids can do that!. There is no skill involved at all.
Be honest, how many of you are 'No Modes', 'No FDs', and flying totally on Raw Data....whilst you display your superior skills?
Its a sad fact that we are now system operators and that by and large the system is better at it than us.
'George' spares us capacity to deal with the myriad of other seen and hidden threats that exist in high density modern international airports.
Stick & Rudder skills are essential.....but theres a time and place to practice them and of course there is the sim.
Otherwise I suggest you hire a Piper Cub etc.......because following a FD is not even the slightest bit skillful or indeed clever.
eg: parallel ILS's, such as SFO...... is it truely a safe option to hand-fly the localiser intercept?
It may indeed be skillful but just one distraction from ATC or EICAS/ECAM and the holes in the 'swiss cheese' start lining up very very quickly.
All professional pilots will be aware of the swiss cheese analogy, but if youre new to this job or keen to learn about identifying and eliminating the hazards we face daily do a google search for "james reason", "systemic errors" or indeed "swiss cheese model".
Theres a very fine line between being a hero and a zero!
Now Im in the airlines its entirely different!
Handing flying can in fact be a major error! You must pick your time & place....and you must be very careful not to overload the non-flying pilot, as he/she is working extra hard monitoring you and doing his/her normal duties. (The PNF may also be twidling HDG, ALT & IAS knobs for you FDs too!)
At major international airports hand flying is a threat.....
If for half a second you "hand flyers" think that following somee FD bars around the sky is "hand flying" you're in la-la land. My kids can do that!. There is no skill involved at all.
Be honest, how many of you are 'No Modes', 'No FDs', and flying totally on Raw Data....whilst you display your superior skills?
Its a sad fact that we are now system operators and that by and large the system is better at it than us.
'George' spares us capacity to deal with the myriad of other seen and hidden threats that exist in high density modern international airports.
Stick & Rudder skills are essential.....but theres a time and place to practice them and of course there is the sim.
Otherwise I suggest you hire a Piper Cub etc.......because following a FD is not even the slightest bit skillful or indeed clever.
eg: parallel ILS's, such as SFO...... is it truely a safe option to hand-fly the localiser intercept?
It may indeed be skillful but just one distraction from ATC or EICAS/ECAM and the holes in the 'swiss cheese' start lining up very very quickly.
All professional pilots will be aware of the swiss cheese analogy, but if youre new to this job or keen to learn about identifying and eliminating the hazards we face daily do a google search for "james reason", "systemic errors" or indeed "swiss cheese model".
Theres a very fine line between being a hero and a zero!
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: in the western part of the United State of Europe
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Simply much less handflying, because it is a matter of spreading of attention.
What is the ue to fly manual during the climbout from 10000 to 40000 ft?
Only bit of nose up trim, a bit later a bit of nose down trim, then a bit up again..
What is the use of that? Cruise is the same story; why put all your attention in this? This is why you have automatics; on top of it its more comfortable for the pax to let George fly.
What is the ue to fly manual during the climbout from 10000 to 40000 ft?
Only bit of nose up trim, a bit later a bit of nose down trim, then a bit up again..
What is the use of that? Cruise is the same story; why put all your attention in this? This is why you have automatics; on top of it its more comfortable for the pax to let George fly.
Join Date: Mar 2006
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On the bus, Company SOP and Airbus' recommendations are FDs off while hand flying. Constantly setting targets in the FCU (MCP) would miss the point of hand flying. Furthermore if you want to reengage the AP doing this with the FD off will give you the values (HDG, V/S) according to your current flightpath.
I will take a visual approach if I can get one, and if not busy environment will then usually hand fly from ~ 5000ft.
Whether or not the aircraft is FBW misses the point. Hand flying the bus is a joy, don't think many bus drivers miss the trimming.
I will take a visual approach if I can get one, and if not busy environment will then usually hand fly from ~ 5000ft.
Whether or not the aircraft is FBW misses the point. Hand flying the bus is a joy, don't think many bus drivers miss the trimming.
ATR-42, Europe, about 40 PF sectors per month.
Roughly about hour and half hand flying - some during initial cliimbout but most of it on visual approaches. Last month this was risen to about 7hrs as I had inflight AP and FD failure and then got MEL dispatched with no AP. Not so hard as expected.
Roughly about hour and half hand flying - some during initial cliimbout but most of it on visual approaches. Last month this was risen to about 7hrs as I had inflight AP and FD failure and then got MEL dispatched with no AP. Not so hard as expected.
