wake turbulence procedures
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 4
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From: london
wake turbulence procedures
In the wake of the AA 2004 incident involving wake turbulence and rudder response.
How are Jetstar pilots trained to respond to sudden rudder loading as a result of wake turbulence or similar. Is it with aileron or rudder. It seems the inadequate training of the above pilots in AA led to a fatal outcome.
I would love to know, then i can determine whether i should fly with this airline anymore? seeing they operate airbus.
How are Jetstar pilots trained to respond to sudden rudder loading as a result of wake turbulence or similar. Is it with aileron or rudder. It seems the inadequate training of the above pilots in AA led to a fatal outcome.
I would love to know, then i can determine whether i should fly with this airline anymore? seeing they operate airbus.
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: london
full rudder
I was in london. Now back in Australia.
Full rudder is what the AA capt executed which is exactly what ripped off the tail fin. Airbus(the manufacturer) disagreed with AA training which taught this response.
Airbus advised only minor rudder with majority aileron control, and advised that full rudder is was led to the crash.
Full rudder is what the AA capt executed which is exactly what ripped off the tail fin. Airbus(the manufacturer) disagreed with AA training which taught this response.
Airbus advised only minor rudder with majority aileron control, and advised that full rudder is was led to the crash.
Fleet Manager
Joined: Apr 2001
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
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From: various places .....
I don't have the report to hand but was not the conclusion and concern the use of doublets and reversals generally ... as opposed to a single input which more closely mirrors the certification design consideration ? Quite two different animals for fin attachment loads.
Joined: Dec 2005
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From: Wellington,NZ
I've got the report, it's AA587, and available from the NTSB site.(It was Nov 12/2001, report AR04/04) Many things contributed (of course) and to put it simply (and in my own words) included aggressive and repeated rudder inputs, the tendency of this FO to do just that in similar situations, the AA training which encouraged the use of plenty of rudder for wake turbulence upsets, the simulator used for this training did not have the same control behaviour or response rate as the A300-600, and the rudder control on this aircraft had, to term it simply, a type of "power steering" that didn't change the feedback through the speed range, nor reduce the rudder deflection applied with any given foot force, with increasing speed.
Doublets and reversals, definitely.
Still, it does seem strange to me that a tail can be torn off this way inside the envelope. I guess it did to the NTSB too, coz I recall they spent rather a long time testing composite materials for strength/fatigue etc, I think at an automotive plant, before the report was issued.
There is also a video, and a computer animation.
Doublets and reversals, definitely.
Still, it does seem strange to me that a tail can be torn off this way inside the envelope. I guess it did to the NTSB too, coz I recall they spent rather a long time testing composite materials for strength/fatigue etc, I think at an automotive plant, before the report was issued.
There is also a video, and a computer animation.
