Regs for provision of life jackets

[PAXboy]

On a scheduled operation (inter Europe) that crosses open water (the North Sea) what are the regs for pax life jackets?

During the safety demo, I checked under my seat for my life jacket (as suggested on a thread in PPRuNe many moons ago!) and for the first time found that the pocket was empty. When CC did the seat belt check, I called attention and stated that there was no life jacket. The CC replied, "Oh. Thank You." and continued checking seat belts. Nothing else was said or action taken. [Sorry but just HAD to use the new smileys]

I am aware that extra jackets are carried but the simple statement from the CC did nothing to convince me that she had noted my seat number (she did not look up to check the seat row) and that, should an emergency be declared, she would be running down the aisle to bring me one.

Please advise what the actual regulations are, as opposed to company procedures.

Thanks.

[Treetopflyer]

Re: Regs for provision of life jackets

Well... JAR-OPS says you need a life jacket for any flight farther than 50 NM from shore... I guess the North Sea is a bit bigger than this, so this requirement should apply [and here goes another one of these new smileys...]

Furthermore the life jacket in question "must be stowed in a position easily accessible from the seat (...) of the person for whose use it is provided". So if your life jacket was in the flight attendant storage, it is not good enough... Hey, maybe she intended to give you personnal swimming lessons just after evacuation...

Cheers,

-- TTF.

[Getoutofmygalley]

Re: Regs for provision of life jackets

At my airline, we do a life jacket check on every turnaround. If the Purser was to become aware that a passenger had found a life jacket to be missing from their seat, the crew member responsible for that particular seat would be in spot of bother!!!
Perhaps the crew member you spoke to thought 'oh !!!!e!' and didn't bring you a replacement as the Purser might have spotted what was going on. The crew member most probably replaced it on the next turnaround.....
.....Hopefully that crew member didn't claim 'Would you believe it, that thieving git had nicked a lifejacket' and blaimed YOU for it

[PAXboy]

Re: Regs for provision of life jackets

Thanks for the replies. I don't think this airline uses the term 'purser' and it was the last sector of the day (parking up at 23:30) On the way out, I made sure that I was last and stopped toask the FO what the rules were and was told that they carry extra jackets. I pointed out that I had no confidence that one would have been delivered. He replied, "Point taken." By this this the Cpt had emerged and heard the story but said nothing much (he looked very tired).

Before I write to the carrier: Does this mean that I should have had the jacket under my seat before departing? That is, not neccessarily pushing but at least before rotation? Have they broken a regulation or merely exhibited bad practice?? I would like to be sure of my position before writing.

Thanks.

[Getoutofmygalley]

Re: Regs for provision of life jackets

Yes you should have had one under your seat. If the safety demonstration used the words 'A life jacket is located under your seat' (or similar) than that is where it should be.
Let's say you was flying into an airport like NCE, which is close to the sea, if the aircraft went off of the runway and you had an unplanned ditching, you would be told to put on your life jacket before exiting the aircraft - I don't think the CC are going to be able to run to the other end of the aircraft, remove one from it's stowage and run back down to you!
So, write in and complain and post the reply you receive on here

[PAXboy]

Re: Regs for provision of life jackets

Thanks Getoutofmygalley that is what I thought!! The departure meant that we crossed the coast within five minutes of rotation and it was a straight line from the runway! I will now write the letter but do not expect much by way of reply.

Should I copy to the Aviation Authority of the country where the carrier is based, rather than the one from which this flight departed?

[Getoutofmygalley]

Re: Regs for provision of life jackets

Should I copy to the Aviation Authority of the country where the carrier is based, rather than the one from which this flight departed?

Going by the way you have worded that sentence, I think I can guess who this carrier might be, and if it is the one I am thinking of, then going by what people have said in the past about that particular authority, they probably won't do anything.
One thing that does spring to mind though, if the carrier is who I believe it to be, on some of their newest aircraft the life jacket is stowed in the overhead panel where the o2 masks drop from - this change was to prevent theft of life jackets. If your aircraft was one of these aircraft, then they should really say something different in the safety demonstration other than 'the life jacket is under your seat'.

[PAXboy]

Re: Regs for provision of life jackets

Thanks (again) Getout and my reason for asking about the country's authority is because the carrier probably is who you think it is ...

I know that carrier cannot care less and I was only on them because someone else was paying for it and becasue, on this rare occasion, the airport was the closest to where we were visiting friends. I did not want to start yet another mud slinging thread about a carrier upon whom, I trust, I have had the very last flight ever.

I was unaware that that option was now installed on some a/c. This was a '738' and when I spoke to the FO + CPT afterwards, they made no mention of jackets being in the overheads.

So I shall consider sending two letters to the black hole of the authority and the carrier.

[Getoutofmygalley]

Re: Regs for provision of life jackets

I did not want to start yet another mud slinging thread about a carrier

I quite agree PAXboy, which is the reason why I have not mentioned a carrier name.

It might be worth putting into the letter to the carrier about the 'lifejackets in o2 stowages' as their is a (hopefully very) slim possibility that not all their crew are aware of this fact - and the carrier can issue a memo to all crew advising of which aircraft in the fleet have the lifejackets under the seat and which are in the o2 stowages.

[alexban]

Re: Regs for provision of life jackets

well, most probably the life jackets was stowed on the overhead pannel,in a space adiacent to the O2 compartment.This is a standard on the NG,the vests are stowed on the PSU ,overhead compartm.There may be some custom Ng's ,with vests under seats,but i didn't see one like this till now.
So,the crew didn't correctly answered your question,maybe because they were tired,or maybe annoyed by 'this pax who thinks he knows lots about planes...' ,unfortunately it can happen,more often than you think.
Next time check the emergency instructions,or look overhead,and you will be able to identify the vest compartment.

[PAXboy]

Re: Regs for provision of life jackets

I had registered that it was a 738 (I'm not a Spotter, promise!) but the Demo talk said "Under Your Seat". Since I was not aware of the NG storage option (which sounds very sensible) then I think that, had the crew advised that, it would have stuck in my mind. Also, when I checked under my seat there was the usual 'sling' pocket with the front closure tab hanging down, so it was easy to verify that the pocket was empty. If the a/c was equipped with O2 jacket storage, would they still have provided the pocket?

Now I have to write to that FRiggin' airline ...