ATPL Modular Route, which school to use
 

Hi, just nearly finished my hours building and I am looking to the next stage of doing my ATPL Theory. I am based in the UK and I was wondering if anyone can help. I have looked at alot of schools, one to one tours etc but I am stuck between either L3 Harris, Atlantic (although not visited here yet), South West Aviation or maybe Aeros. Has anyone been to these companies and if so, are the Modular students treated differently to integrated (can't afford to lose my money when a school goes under etc and I feel I have more control over my course, although If I like the school for my ATPL Theory then I will probably stay on and complete my training there), where have you looked for accommodation. Are there any other schools to think about. Did think about ACS but they don't do just ATPL Theory.

You've done your hour building but haven't started ATPL theory? How many have you done?

I've just started PPL, and when complete, will be doing ATPL with BGS by distance learning. I'm doing night/IR(R)/hour building all with my local airfield. I haven't seen a complaint about BGS, whether you choose distance or the residential course.

For complex training, I'll wait and see what the options are when I get there, but reckon it'll be Stapleford.

Aeros are marketing Fasttrack heavily which is an integrated program veiled as modular in the sense that whilst in regulatory terms it's modular, you're tied to the one ATO, you can't move, and if you don't like Aeros, then tough, because you're stuck. Aeros is probably the most expensive modular provider (you pay for the company's size). Don't forget their £87k doesn't even include APS/MCC. Doing the course at true modular providers from zero to APS MCC can be £60k if you strictly go for the cheapest. I'm looking at £70k for my plan.

Integrated schools will always prioritise Integrated students, but particularly so if they have airline tagged/sponsored students due to delay penalties in their agreements with the airline.

In any case, do not go with L3Harris. It doesn't take a lot of effort to read about what's been said about them here. Want a school that will treat you like a number? Go to a big school which cares about the big numbers. Want a school that is more personal and, on average, will deliver you a better service? Go to a smaller school (though verify what other students have said about it first)

If you mean you have 135 hours total then there's still time to help you. If you mean you've done 135 hours of hour building and no IMC time then you're already painted into a corner and you dont have many options..

This limit is generally:

ATPL Theory
CPL/MEIR
APS/MCC

Those are the ones airlines like BA care about. They don't care where you do your PPL and hour building, the above are the ones that matter.

I would personally hold off on any more hour building if you haven't completed your ATPL theory yet. You want to get a nice solid bit of hour building in just before starting your commercial courses, otherwise you'll just be spending your first few lessons scraping off the rust.

Is there any reason you haven't looked at Bristol Ground School?

Good advice. I always say do nothing until you have a class one medical. Then do nothing until you have passed all your PPL exams. Once you have a PPL go straight for a night rating then do nothing until you have the ATPL exams passed.

I'm planning on doing my ATPL theory whilst hour building, can you explain the disadvantage of that? It'll be the winter so won't be able to get loads of hours in anyway.

I don't see a problem at all with that. You can fly and train all you want while you are studying but you can't take the skill test until you have passed your exams. A lot of schools say otherwise, but they are wrong.

Agree, nothing wrong with doing both at the same time. Personally, I found it a little too demanding on my time what with studying, working and general day-to-day life so ended up doing an intense couple of months hour building once my studies were complete. But if you can make it work, then go for it. Was great fun getting to fly several times a week and really have me the chance to make sure I was up to standard before starting the commercial courses.

Which leads on to the important bit about hour building. It's not a tick-box exercise, but your time to bring your skills up to them best standard you can before undertaking the commercial courses. The more you effectively use your time hour building, the more likely you'll get your commercial courses done in minimum hours.

Cool, thanks guys. I can do my PPL and ATPL theory for £15k, hour building for £15k, and then if the market is good finish complex training. I'm in final year of uni but run an agency that earns more than I'll ever make flying, but it means I can delay until the time is right if it was necessary.

When I was weighing up Integrated/Modular, I really did place a lot of weight on the name/tagging etc, but now I've started modular, the concept of spending 18 (realistically 24) months on someone else's schedule, paying a premium to do it, and doing it with a school that might not survive long enough to get me my licenses, when I could do it cheaper, on my own terms and schedule, and faster... it just seems like a no brainer to do modular

There's no inherent disadvantage as long as you are disciplined, which I was not. I had to stop PPL flying because I hadn't kept up with the exams, which meant I lost recency of skills and had to fly more than neccesary after a peeiod off to catch up on the exams. ATPL exams take a long time but hour building you can do pretty quickly if you go somewhere sunny. It makes sense to keep a decent amount of hour building until just before your next module so that you have a good amount of recency. If you spread your hour building across your Exams, then have an unexpected 2 month delay for your next module, you'll either have to go into it having not flown for 2 months, or spend more getting up to speed again.
I assume you're going to save money by doing the CBIR next? If so you'll need to split your hour building into 3 blocks (~50/20/30) to represent the prerequisites for IR (50XC) MEP (70PIC) and CPL (100PIC) it makes sense to do half your hour building during your ATPL study (you can use those exams to get the IRR and/or CBIR) and half after your exams and immediately before each module to give you a good amount of recency of skills.

Yeah I just started PPL so got a bit of a while to go before CBIR but that's the plan. I'll try and get my ATPL done in 6 months with two weeks per subject. Three blocks of hour building is a good suggestion - I was struggling to work out exactly 'what' hours (IR, XC, etc) to do and when.

I also have an NPPL which I use for general flying skills and have a share that means I can fly @ £40/hr wet. Hours don't credit, but means I can do procedures/comms/flying for real without spending a fortune, and keep my core flying skills in tact (even if I can't do radio nav in my NPPL aircraft).

This is wildly optimistic and ATPLs don't work like that. I can count on one hand those who I have seen completed in 6 months, usually already experienced pilots with overseas or military experience doing conversions. Even the full-time in attendance courses are around the 7-8 month time frame including actually sitting the exams. The average PPL holder will take around 12 months DL that's assuming they are fully focused, with no distractions and/or unnecessary emotional baggage.

I often get requests from students for help as they are running out of time (18 months) and/or sittings (6 in total). Sounds easy but in reality life gets in the way and those deadlines will arrive sooner than you think. Don't not under estimate the amount of time & volume of work required, mostly learning high-class rubbish you will never use or see again.

6 months is the standard for full time groundschool, I’d guess that’s what OP has based their timeframe on.

But, OP, that is 50 hours a week full time with nothing else going on. 90% of the stuff you will need to learn is absolute garbage with zero use in your flying career, and you’ll mostly just learn question bank answers, but it’s all worth it in the end!

I did mine when questions were all multiple choice and you could still smash the question banks. (Remember the year when the changed the questions and literally everyone failed the OPS exam?) Anyway I did it in a cumulative 4 months of study. 4/4/3/3 subjects per month doing the 'hardest' subjects first so I could roll over any failures.. It worked OK for me but I'm talking dawn to dusk 1 week per subject, then taking them in reverse order two on the Monday and two on the Thursday to make extra revision time. I wouldn't recommend it but it shows what a little motivation can do.

"I can do my PPL and ATPL theory for £15k,"

Wow....

What happens if you walk away from Aeros fasttrack? Surely they’re not gonna beat you up
Also is VA airline training a good provider for the mcc

PPL £10.5k, ATPL distance learning £4.5k, including fees, does something sound off?

DL Theory for ATPL can be done a lot less expensively than that. Most PPL schools just give you a book.