Over 40 'Club'?
 

Are we a special type of wannabe?
Should us oldies be supporting each other?
Any value in us networking?

Comments?

------------------
London Tower this is Skyflash...

Cron - excellent idea. I've still got a few years to go until the big 4 0 but would be interested to see how your thread developes

ariel

Sounds like a good idea.

I'm just over the big 40 and would like to know what would be open to me as most airlines retire pilots at 56 ish, so if anyone has any positives they can give us Wrinkly Wannabes please let us know. :)

I'm not sure I want to admit to being old enough to join :)

Cron, should we have a sub-group for elderly rotary wannabes? :) :) :)

------------------
Whirly

To fly is human, to hover, divine.

As a 48 year old wannabee I think I qualify.
Great idea!
Let the youngsters do a proper job first!
Only joking :-)

don't qualify for over 40s club but it's by a whisker. Wannabegonnabe

I am over 40 (just) and fly for Emerald.
I would interested in an 'old farts' network
and happy to answer any questions etc

I'm just 46, Frozen ATPL, Perf. A, MCC and 950 hours. Been trying to get that first airline job for twelve months. Not even an interview yet. Still, instructing part-time keeps me sane. Airlines say I'm not too old (then they would say that wouldn't they) and every professional pilot I meet tell's me I will get a job.

Turbo-prop hauling freight at night, where do I sign.

I guess us youngsters in our early 30's can't join this elite club?

By way of inspiration I got my first airline job at 41 (737-200) and I wasn't the oldest on the course. I'm still in training so a bit early to start counting chickens.

Keep plugging away. Best of luck to you all.

I am 47, about to do the full monty for 30K plus at SFT.

Cron
Yes! All power to your elbow, or whichever joints still work.

How many flight decks could do with exactly the kind of world-weary cynicism that we oldies would bring? All, I suspect.

I'm 39 and have the X-country qualifier and the Skills Test to go, for my PPL. After that, the Grand Plan is to head for Jerez for the integrated course.. purely to save time. But I do have the advantage of having had the prudence never to marry or breed...

(CUE ROTATING SMILEY.. BUT THEY NEVER WORK FOR ME. WHICH WILL ALSO BE MY EXCUSE FOR THE A/P)

RichT: Thanks!
CloudedYellow: Good Luck!

Let's think of a brick wall and stop the Midwych Cuckoos ---- NOW!!

- catswhisker

I'm up for it.....I see that some airlines are now asking cadets to be able to develop acne as a requirement for interview..! Just kidding....Us older chaps have skills to offer....its just finding someone to pluck us from obscurity and our oncoming senility and dotage....

Zimmer frame down and locked, I have control!

Tailwinds

Not yet forty but approaching fast. Count me in 'cos I reckon old age and cunning will overcome youth and exuberance anyday.

It ticks me off to think the older guy/girl is overlooked because of some industry hokum that says they're "over-the-hill". I'd really like to get hold of the Human Performance geek that put the theory out that older people assimilate information slower and..........zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

I might have missed something here (distracted by the "Muffin the Mule" re-runs.. But isn't that an illegal activity now?) and someone may already have aired this. But: Might it be worth putting the case for part of the PpruNe Wannabe fund to be set aside for us Undead? After all, the Acne Mob are provided for elsewhere, and then some.
Just a thought.

Seems we have a quorom (I think that's how it's spelt).
Rotory definitely included!
What to do next?
Let me have a think. I'll grab your email addresses - where appropriate and available (in case of developments). Email me to make this easier if you wish.
Anyone any ideas?

I'm 42 (and can still read, just) and recently phoned several companies to ask their view on age. The reply from 90% was that it was hours they wanted, age was of no concern - and being over 40 could be an advantage at times because for the turbo prop companies we're less likely to bugger off at the first airline opportunity.
I reckon go for it.
Anyway, who would you rather employ - an over 40 or a spotty youth with attitude?

Been reading this with interest.

We're not a special case.....just too bl**dy old!

I'm up for it anyway!

JWF :) :) :)

Hi guys!
I will be 44 (gosh!!) in fall. Been lucky enough to get a driver's seat (for the biggest regional in EU) on the ARJ at age 42. Ok, I already had been working 20+ years as grease monkey on the big ones. And had 800+ hours, mostly singles.

In conclusion:
Airlines are looking for pilots!!
Now is the time!!
Get qualified!!
Get practice (buy yourselve an Elite or similar flight sim)!!
Get your CVs going!!
Don't forget business aviation!!

And all the best ;)


------------------
... cut my wings and I'll die ...

CRON

Count me in, I'm 41 and just about to complete the CAA ATPL's, with just Navagigation to pass (hopefully !) a week on Wednesday. I have PPL/IMC/Night/Multi and will take the FIC course in June/July, to then hour-build towards the 700 hrs for CPL issue.

Like "AGED" I think the best opportunities for us "oldies" lies with the Regionals for all the reasons stated. I know a couple of guys in their late 30's/early 40'S who have started with UK Regional's with 800 hrs and frozen ATPL, so there's hope for us all !!!!!!!

RICH T - thanks for the inspiration, it's good to know it's possible, good luck on the 737

Finally, I think it's a great idea CRON to start a network for the "fortysomethings" we need just as much mutual encouragement as the younger guys, maybe more. As I said at the start of this post "count me in"




[This message has been edited by Letdown (edited 22 April 2001).]

I'm in!!

35 at the moment and only got 4.5 yrs till i'm booted out of Her Majesty's Finest Flying Club (as non-aircrew). TODAY I started to research the whys, wherefores, and hows, about this industry. Therefore absolutely ANY info/advice would be welcomed.

40's and up-I'm in too!

You have inspired me guys. I was starting to feel over the hill at 34. Still flying bug smashers and loading my own cargo.

45 and been flying professionally for 25 years, but you get my vote. Go for it, peeps!

------------------
Scroggs
Wannabe Forum Moderator
[email protected]

Scroggs,

This sounds a good idea to me. Are you going to provide us with a new forum?

JWF :)

Sounds good to me .. whacha think Scroggs?

Above my level within the Pprune hierarchy I'm afraid, chaps, so I can't make any promises in that direction. I do know that, prior to the change of server, there was no chance of increasing the number of forae. I'm not sure what the word is on that now, but I'm not optimistic. In any case, most of the issues of interest to you are equally of interest to our younger members. The fact that you are further down the road to decrepitude may give you shared experience, but does not imply any special requirements - there's no bus-pass equivalent on Pprune!
Anyway, i'll look into it, but don't hold your breath.

------------------
Scroggs
Wannabe Forum Moderator
[email protected]

I too am approaching the 40 barrier. With one year to go I am starting to wonder if I will get there. I have 700 hours, a degree in aviation and nearly finished my I/R. I also currently teach at a local flying school.The problem is in Oz they say age can't be discreminated against but the airlines always manage to find some reason to say sorry. So what do you do ? The regionals like the old boys because they know that they will not move into the majors. The problem here is that the regionals have a greater hour requirement than the majors. Ridiculous I know, so by the time you get the hours you are close to your mid forties. Around and around you go a never ending rabbit race.
I hate to be blunt but over 35 unless you have 2000 hrs plus and a load of twin time you are cactus and can only devote yourself to a career in charter or instructing. Not bad but the $$$ suck big time..
Goodluck in the queens country!

How about another thread for those of us who go back the Wright brothers - where they nicked my belt and braces - to lengthen the bungee. :)

Hence the flying term "belt and braces". I started it you see! Pity the cameraman had to obey the laws of decency - otherwise I would have been famous! :)

Sounds good to me...count me in

38 going on 39, PPL/IMC/Night/Multi (almost) + all ATPL's passed....should get CPL in June, IR by year end and then as Tommy Pickles would say, "The world is my lobster"!

Nice to know there's hope for us yet - however slim!

Pilot Paul

Captain Scroggs,

Mind your Latin. I think you should say either "forums" (correct English, I beleive) or "fora" (the correct Latin plural for 4th declination, masculine nouns), but please, never "forae" (that's for femennine nouns). Do you think knowing a bit of Latin will help me to get a job up there??

Fly safely

[This message has been edited by Joaqu'n (edited 25 April 2001).]

Smarty Pants!
I believe that believe is spelt 'believe'

... and "femennine" is actually spelt "feminine"! Sorry Joaquin, we don't do conversion courses in Latin...

Pot calling the kettle black, methinks. :)

Anyway, just a small point for you to ponder. JimNich has little time for those who think over-40s have problems assimilating. Unfortunately, this is proven fact, both in Psychology and in the aviation industry. Most airlines have, percentage-wise, a much higher failure rate amongst the oldies (mainly in the sim).

However, there is hope. One thing that will help your application if your are approaching senility is CURRENCY, preferably in something hard to fly. Also, any jet experience at all (ie sim) is like gold.

To that end, I would be prepared to organise another of the famous Wannabe Sim Days for oldies only (Trident sim, near Biggin; I'm sure all oldies will remember Tridents).

Any interest out there?

BTW, my lot takes on a fair few oldies, there is definitely hope!

As a member of this elite club, 41, I've come to the conclusion that if I was going to make it after 20 years of trying. I would have done so by now.

Therefore, reluctantly I have decided to let go of the dream.

It's not that I failed all the exams or anything. I've got the CPL/IR ATPL writtens etc. I just can't seem to progress from that. My medical has expired and I have made no attempt to renew it. I don't believe you can just give up flying, cold turkey. You just sort of drift away kidding yourself that you'll go back soon. All you need is more money or a good opportunity or whatever.
I still love to fly, one of my last flights was in a Pitts Special, a dream come true, but none of this hides the essential fact that I'm never going to work as a pilot in this lifetime. I don't believe that I can fly privately instead, frankly I never liked it. You really have to do some kind of job when you fly. There is no sense of achievment in buzzing the local area just one more time, practicing for what?

So it's time to draw a line and try not to think of the money spent, but not the time wasted, It WAS fun. It was also the one thing I can point to and say 'I did it all by myself'. It was the one near success in a life of appalling mediocrity. But I used it to hide some truths which I didn't want to acknowledge. I always thought, 'As soon as I get the job, I'll be happy and everything else will fall into place'. Not so, that's just the worst form of denial.
I've done nothing else with my life, I never married, who can compete with flying, I've had precious few girlfriends anyway. I own next to nothing, my net worth is about £300, not including the car which of course the bank actually owns. If I'd put the effort in with some other career I would be rich and successful by now, unhappy but comfortable. At the moment I'm unhappy and uncomfortable, not a good combination.
Call it a mid life crisis or whatever, maybe it's just a reality setting in. My Mother accidentally hit the nail on the head some time ago. I just laughed at the time but now I wonder. I was telling her of a woman I met. 'I hope you haven't told her you're a pilot' says she.

'Why not? I am a pilot' I said.

'Not a REAL pilot' she replied.

So, there it is, my epitaph 'not a real pilot' just a Walter Mitty character who never grew up. What will I replace flying with? Nothing I can think of. There is nothing outside of flying for me, that's become all too evident. Nothing worthwhile anyway, you can only bounce back a few times before gravity and reality take over. I blew it and can only take the consequences. However I would encourage all you others to continue, I've watched all my friends, ex friends really, they lose touch quickly when the move on. It is worth it in the end, if you make it, I suppose.

Better than my future, anyway.

I've sat here and tried to think of something profound to finish with, but I cannot. Just that you who have made it and daily leave the Earth trailing in your thunder, to remember how lucky you are, how very lucky and privileged you are.
..

Hi JigSawBlue

I reckon you've done incredibly well mate. You've got your CPL/IR & ATPL's - bloody hell,that's an achievement! All of us Ppruners are in debt to the banks, in one form or the other - I'm sure there's a lot of people on this site who haven't thought at one time or another to go - 'What the f***' & jack it all in. It sounds like your very down right now, so I reckon that you ride the storm my friend and realise how much you have accomplished and stick with the dream. If you do decide you don't want to follow this path anymore, fair enough. But, you're not 'a Walter Mitty' - you're an aviator and should be very proud of that.
All the best

HollyDog
[This message has been edited by HollyDog (edited 27 April 2001).]

[This message has been edited by HollyDog (edited 27 April 2001).]

jigsawblue- far too blue! sorry to be blunt, but you've done all the hard work, and well done to that. please don't give up, anyone that gains a flying licence is a pilot by definition, and there's people in this forum older than you, who haven't even started yet!
if you don't like private flying, then teach other people who do, it's flying with a purpose, it builds hours, it increases your prospects , and it might be fun!
i obviously don't know your financial situation, but you've raised enough once, why not again?
we can all be our own worst enemy at times, i know because i nearly did exactly the same(didn't fly for 3 years), but i'm back, and more determined the ever, encouraged by other people, and by the fact that if you don't do it in this lifetime, then when?
oh, and with flying, as you probably know only too well, resistance is futile, so start flaring way too high, and bounce back , as hard as you can!!!!!
i hope this helps?

Jigsawblue,

I'm in a similar position to you except I'm in the process of thinking about revalidating my licences.

I'm also 40, held a CPL for many years, not realy been looking for work, but may start to do so in a year or so's time. My hunch from talking to guys working the airlines is that there will be a big demand for pilots in a couple of years time. My real problem is trying to not lose the writtens with all the change in regs etc. Some half decent lawyer should have a field day with the CAA and all their antics.

One other difference, I realy enjoy GA. 1300 hours are a testemony to that, and I have not acumuated the hours by instructing. My advice to you is go and get comfortable with GA and enjoy it.

jsb

'All good things comes to those who wait !'

HD

jigsawblue,

Snap out of it. You're talking as though you're 81, not 41. And I'm older than you, so I have a right to say that. Too many people are obsessed with age - oh my god, I'm 25 and I haven't done anything sort of thing. Whether you want to keep on trying in aviation or try something else is up to you, but whichever it is, you have half a lifetime ahead of you in which to do it. Who says you haven't done anything? Sounds to me like you've done a hell of a lot. More importantly, you've tried to do what you really wanted - better to have tried, even if you haven't made it (so far, only so far!) than never to have tried at all. Don't listen to your mother! Of course you're a real pilot. Why do you have to be paid to fly to prove it? A job is only a way of earning a living, nothing else. If I win the lottery tomorrow I'll pack in the CPL exams, but I'll still fly; I'll still be a pilot.

Give up the dream if you want to, no matter what anyone else says. But ONLY if you want to. And judge success or failure by your own standards, not the world's.

------------------
Whirly

To fly is human, to hover, divine.

Wise words WB.... wise words

JWF (43 1/2)

http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/cool.gif