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Sex Offender and becoming a pilot?
As per title says, please take the time to read so I can fully explain my circumstances.
I'm in my early 20s and in the UK. Last year got involved in the hype of dating websites, after going through a nasty breakup of a long term relationship. Got chatting to a nice girl, well spoken, mature, whatnot. She is 17 and just about to finish college, so approx 4.5 years younger than me. She sends me a risque picture of her in her underwear, which I didn't ask for, nor did I think all that much of, aside from being flattered. Eventually the conversation fizzles out and I forget all about it. Looking forward to graduating and heading off to flight school in the summer to complete my fATPL. Six months later I recieve a message from her. Did I know that what she sent me was illegal, and unless I forwarded her a large lump of cash she would be turning me in to the police? Fine I say, I'll talk to them myself, thinking that as I didn't request the pic and she was now blackmailing me, I would be OK. Boy was i wrong. I was swiftly arrested and have had my phone, laptop etc taken, only to be informed that the police have retrieved the image and are prosecuting me for one count of indecent images of children. I'm mortified, beyond mortified, that this has happened. I don't know if I can ever socially or legally recover from this. I'm meant to be starting at L3 in September and don't even know if I can take my place or get a job as a pilot as it looks like I will be convicted and spend 5 years on the sex offenders register. I am really just looking for some honest, brutal advice, especially since my Mum and Dad's holiday home is on the line here as it was used to take out the loan for my flight training. Am I realistically done for in terms of commercial aviation with a criminal record like this? I'll be on the children's barred list most likely which would probably stop me from instructing too :( Honest, brutal advice please. God knows I need it right now. |
I can’t give you any advice but I feel for you. As a man in this day and age it just takes an allegation to destroy your life. As a 22 year old, I’d put it down to being a young and clumsy heterosexual man. Good Luck.
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So what aren't you telling us? If it happened as described then you haven't done anything illegal, although clearly she has.
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You need a lawyer. A good one.
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Its not a crime to receive unrequested messages from the opposite sex. I seem to get a good many unsolicited 'interesting pictures' which I can do nothing about (generally in the Spam box). Unless there is coercion involved, I can see no case against you. Maybe you could mention the blackmail to the authorities. Is a picture of someone in underwear actually illegal?
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Banana Joe
what he said /\ Sounds like you’ve been blackmailed to me. Get a good lawyer and this won’t even get to court. She might even need one too! |
rudestuff
The offence as mentioned is one that doesn't require intent. Back in the day, I was taught that age of consent is 16. Before texting, before phones really. We had blackberry's back in the day, and that is if you are lucky. The age of consent for images, is 18, and the age of consent for carnal relations, relationships etc, is 16. I was blindsided on a technicality, in retrospect yes I should have looked into the laws, but I can say hand on heart that I had no idea you had to be 18 or over for risque pics, hence why I didn't immediately delete it and block- for the purposes of the offence, the image remaining in a local memory of a device is enough to be considered in posession. As the Lord is my witness, this is the truth. A genuine honest mistake. I know that my travel options are severely limited even having been arrested (no USA or Canada entry), but I was hoping that I could even pick up domestic work with Loganair or Flybe. I'm not sure I could cope with the criminal record plus losing my dream of flying to boot. |
Have you been found guilty in a Crown Court? Or was it a Magistrates court?
You can’t let your life be destroyed by a Magistrate. |
This is not justice. What do the CPS think they’re playing at even bringing a case against you? The facts as you told them should be broadcast throughout the nation to point a finger at this ass of a legal system, but of course you risk your name being indelibly scribed across the internet in a way that could also affect any future employment. My unqualified (well, this is the internet) advice:
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This has to be a wind up. Starting L3 In sept? Putting your family’s home on the line? Flybe?
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What did you do with the photo you were sent? Did you save it on any of your electronic devices? Did you delete the message containing the photo?
Sounds like you have been charged with an offence of possession. The answers to the questions I have asked will be important in determining whether you are guilty or not. Go see a lawyer. Everyone hates lawyers, until they need one. Any you need one. |
Sorry. I just don’t get this. There was no crime for you to be arrested for in what you wrote. The age of consent in the UK is 16. As long as you weren’t in a position of trust over that person you are free to get up to whatever you both want to.
Edited to add: I had absolutely no idea there were 2 ages of consent. That is bonkers. So it’s legal to date (and everything that can entail) someone 16 and over, but have a saucy picture (of someone who may be your partner) and it’s illegal. That is incredible! |
Even if there is more to this than expressed by the poster, which I'm sure there is. I still take the view that as a 22 year old with a 17 year old, it's most likely to be a clumsy and immature man, rather than an evil man. I therefore think that education should be the tool of the CPS and not a criminal charge that would permanently label the 22 year old as a paedophile.
I recognise that there are evil men out there who are out to do harm to females and Children. I would never offer those people a way out. But there are normal, reasonable guys who are just Clumsy and don't know how to behave. |
These might be daft questions but was the photo recent or is there any suspicion that it was from when she was younger and was is definitely a picture of her and not someone else?
Also - " only to be informed that the police have retrieved the image and are prosecuting me ..." Just clarify, Are you just subject of investigation/Have you been charged/are the CPS considering the case? |
The whole thing sounds like a scam. Did you ever speak to this girl other than by messaging? Do you have any proof she actually exists? How do you know the photo was of her, and not some random photo taken from the internet?
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That's an unusual statement right there from a 22 year old. "Before texting", "Blackberrys". You are also referring to a law change that happened in 2003? So when you were what, four years old? You were taught THAT aged four?
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Good point and good spot. I hadn’t noticed that. But that post resonated with me exactly at my age… 50, not 22. How many 22 year olds would even know a blackberry. How many 22 year olds would even know life “before texting”. I was first remember texting around the turn of the millennium.
Just re read his post and there is no way he is 22. More like 50-60. Which even if not illegal is morally wrong chatting up a 16 year old irregardless of the picture that he “claims” she sent him unsolicited. The more that comes out of this the more I think the police may have got it right. |
This sounds awfully familiar to a recent event here in New Zealand..with a quick internet search you’ll find what I’m talking about.
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highflyer40
With all due respect, I don't appreciate the accusation that I'm somehow lying about this situation, it's an awful thing to lie about. You might have been texting then, but I was in primary school. I got my first phone at 14, as my parents were technophobes. We didn't even have a computer in the house, and I only got a laptop when I started my A Levels in 2014. Of course we had Blackberries... the days of BBM were, if I remember correctly, around 2010- 2013... which was when I was in school. We could barely send photos on those. "Sexting" was not yet widely spread, and the worst thing that happened was that a girl in my year sent a video around of herself and it became the talk of the school. I can understand why you would be skeptical, but please take a moment to think through this and consider that not everyone on the Internet is a stinking liar. For reference, my Dad is 61. Not me. Kent Based As i previously replied, I got my first mobile aged 14. I had a blackberry in secondary school. I'm finding these accusations alarming, especially since I am reaching out for help. If there wasn't so much at stake I would just link a picture of my driving licence because I'm astounded that people think that someone who is almost 23 is too young to have a blackberry or to have grown up in an age where sending people sexy images wasn't the norm as it is now... Contact Approach Why would it be a wind up? Flybe is actively building back up to what it once was, it seems. L3 and CAE are still the top names in the industry, and taking out a home loan is the route that most of my new coursemates have taken. How else can young people get the required training? As for this being a wind up, i wish it was. All I've done is reach out for advice and I've been hit with accusations of being an old man. I can't win on these forums as I obviously don't want to reveal my identity in case coursemates/school friends/future employers are reading. Grateful I've read that article a thousand times over. The difference with that guy is that he targeted 14 years olds, who are clearly under the age of consent. My grave error was not realising that there are two ages of consent, and assumed the "regular" age for dating and whatnot was the be all and end all. Our justice system doesn't work like that. A friend who is a police officer described me as collateral damage in a system designed to target those who have images of abuse. |
Well if you think L3 and CAE are still the leading names you are deluded. Suggest you look at what has happened at CAE Oxford in the last 12 months. Hardly the world leading flight school any more.
As for Flybe its 2 or 3 aircraft , long way from 70. |
Search the CAA website for CAP 2159 which lists the offences that dis-qualify you from holding an Airside pass.
No pass = no job. |
Given the extremely competitive employment market for pilots right now why would a major employ you ?
No pass = no job is correct , and just the start. Become a tradie instead. ( Australian for tradesperson) In Australia they get paid more than most pilots. |
underpaidtoo
Ah okay, thank you for clarifying. I had read through that document, and I was hoping that that wasn't the end, but it seems that my offence is deemed totally disqualifying. TukwillaFlyboy Yes I can definitely agree, I just think that the part of me that always dreamed of becoming a pilot desperately wanted to believe that there was some way of getting round that issue. You are correct in saying that as the offence is one deemed as being child abuse, I would not be able to obtain an airside pass or pass security vetting. Time to look into lower paid, unskilled labour I think. If this thread serves any purpose, it can serve as a warning to other hopeful young men that 18 is the age of consent, NOT 16 as the law suggests. |
Did you see my questions in post 14?
You are talking as though you have already been convicted |
Repos
Hi, sorry, just seen them. The image was definitely of her, and she was definitely 17 in the picture. The police are investigating (and I was arrested), and the investigating officer has said that they are "waiting for the CPS to produce a charging sheet". |
As far as this thread suggests you are not a sex offender, you are being investigated or possibly prosecuted for an alleged sexual offence. We still have a principle of “innocent until proven guilty” in this country even with such a grievous crime as receiving a dodgy picture with a blackmail threat (Ohrly’s suggestion of organised pre-planned crime seems quite plausible and there could be others similarly affected able to provide support or advice). Get good advice - even better than that available on an anonymous Internet forum - and hope that the law still has some semblance of sense and justice embedded in it.
In the event that you get a disqualifying conviction you can still fly - arguably with more enjoyment than an airline pilot might - you just need to ensure you go down a career path that leaves you enough time and money to do so. Don’t give up! |
The relevant CAP 2159 offence is possessing an indecent offence of a child. As you have learnt by now a child for that purpose is anyone under 18. Consent has nothing to do with it, so talking about “the age of consent” is meaningless.
I repeat my earlier questions, because they may determine whether you have committed an offence: what did you do with the image you were sent, did you save it anywhere? Did you delete the message which contained the image? |
Even if charged he can still apply for a certificate of disregard, if the details given are true.
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i hope i don’t over simplify this.
Consider this. It’s ballsy, but it might just prevent a lot of collateral damage. All you need to do is tell the truth. Trust the system. Your story is simple and credible. Any reasonable Judge would surely have to find you not guilty, and a police prosecutor may pull the whole thing anyway. Spend the absolute minimum you can. Expedite the whole process, and rip the bandaid off. Value the opportunity to get it to genuine well intentioned scrutiny as soon as possible. Good luck you and a fair outcome. |
nothopeful
Lower paid unskilled labour ? You should see the callout fee for a tradie in Australia. If you can get one. |
nothopeful
Were those his exact words? That means the CPS has definitely decided to prosecute? or they are awaiting the decision of the CPS? Sorry to be pedantic but this matters about were you truly are in procedings. You could be worrying about nothing. |
glenb
If it goes to court, Magistrates always, in my experience, side with the Police. If that is the case you'll need to take it to a Crown court. If what you say is even half accurate, you're not going to get 12 jurors to convict you. But you do need to spend money on a lawyer/Barrister/Solicitor. A Good lawyer commands so much respect from the court, you're much more likely to get a reasonable result (That especially applies in the Magistrates court). |
Reciprocal
I'm pretty sure it's also an offence for her to have initially shared the image with you as she was under 18 at the time and I don't think there is a distinction in law between a person sending a (sexual) image of themselves or of anyone else under 18, your just not allowed to do it. I would tell the police or your lawyer that she distributed it to you and push for her to be prosecuted with distribution of child porn. It might not help you but will potentially get the girl also facing being put on the sex offenders list and she will be forced to tell the truth to get her own self out of this, which might just help your case or at least give her a taste of her own medicine. I would hope this wouldn't even get to court anyway as the prosecution service will try and look at this objectively and for what it is,which is a girl trying to blackmail you over an image she sent and is then trying to extort something from you. But it's crazy days and the law can sometimes be bound to act regardless. Get a lawyer and pull her down if your going down, just make sure she falls further and harder. If your in the UK the citizens advice service can be very helpful and might be able to at least get you some legal advice as a start. Good luck
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It would seem to me, to be quite unusual for a 17 year old female to be on an online dating site. Unless, she is part of a pre-planned scam attempt. Perhaps, coerced by someone else. If so, she may have “form” with other suitors on the dating site. I wonder if the Police have investigated the case from her side.
Have the Police pulled her Phone and Computers with regard to this case or interviewed her and her parents or guardian? Do get suitable legal representation and good luck 🤞! |
It's 2021. It would be unusual for a 17 year old not to be on one, surely?
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Get a decent paying job, save up for many years, then go modular at the current rate of approx £55,000.
If you have not already done so, get a Class 1 medical asap as all this chat my be irrelevant if you cannot get one of these. |
Something doesn’t smell right about this thread.
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Couldn’t agree more!
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Not sure this would stand up in a court of law if the image was sent unsolicited and you promptly deleted it. Although deleted images in many cases can be recovered, and there may even be thumbnails of it you are unaware of (yes modern Windows versions create databases of thumbnails for every image you have saved), it could be argued that most people are ignorant to this and couldn't reasonably be expected to know that traces of the original file remain.
The image itself, you say it was risque but the girl was wearing underwear? You could legally view similiar images in swimwear/gymnastics catalogues if you were so inclined. I don't know what constitutes an indecent image these days, but it's definitely worth looking into. You need a good lawyer with an understanding of technology. Also, I hope you saved or at least screenshot the blackmail attempt? |
Sadly, as you said there was deleted images saved in some obscure part of the internal memory of my phone. The police view that was that as an engineering grad I was fully aware of how devices store images.
The context, nature and intent of the image is important. Yes there was no nakedness involved- I would equal it to a bikini shot, you could see exactly the same as what you would see at a beach. Because the image was sent within context of a flirtatious conversation, the image is indecent. The key here is the context in which the image was sent/recieved. I understand why people are trying to tell me to fight it, and I've had legal advice, where its been advised that i plead guilty to avoid a lengthy sex offender registration. If I please out, I will likely get 2 years and a permanent criminal record. If I argue that i didn't recieve it, i would be looking at five. |
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