Is the MCC DEAD
Just another digit
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Is the MCC DEAD
Receiving Aug/Sept Skypointer I read with interest that The ATP Academy is planning to replace the present MCC Course with a greatly upgraded Airline Qualifications Course (AQC). Is the MCC going to that great runway in the sky with others such as the LOFT course. This looks like another way to squeeze money.
And I really do feel like JUST ANOTHER NUMBER
And I really do feel like JUST ANOTHER NUMBER
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Just Another Number - It is hardly likely that the MCC course is "going to that great runway in the sky" whatever that means. The MCC course is a pre-requisite for a multi-crew type rating. The 'ACQ' is a pre-requisite for nothing at all, it is merely a clever marketing ploy.
Just another digit
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Well aware of the rules - my concern is that one of the airlines will ask for it. The LOFT course was not official but some airlines asked for it. There was a heated debate here not so long ago because it was seen to be unfair to ask for 1000 hours and a current IR. Yes I believe it is another way to take money, personally I hope it does not catch on.
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A clear sign of stupidity can be found in the above remarks. DO YOUR HOMEWORK FIRST BEFORE SLAGGING OF A COMPANY PLEASE!!!
MCC = is a requirement for multi crew operation. Go to your local cornershop and find a bargain and yes you are legally allowed to fly multicrew aircraft...
Go to the ATP and they do something differant. They give you an MCC (courses they used to give before it was a legal requirement...) but at the same time are grading and molding you for the airlines. Result? Getting hired. So if you are serious about getting into the airline speak to these guys, asked them which airlines they work for, ask for their results, ask them for references and then ask them for the price of that. Then make a proper assesment whether it is worth it or not.
And FYI, the new course has been set up to meet the requirements of their real customers demand.. the airlines..
MCC = is a requirement for multi crew operation. Go to your local cornershop and find a bargain and yes you are legally allowed to fly multicrew aircraft...
Go to the ATP and they do something differant. They give you an MCC (courses they used to give before it was a legal requirement...) but at the same time are grading and molding you for the airlines. Result? Getting hired. So if you are serious about getting into the airline speak to these guys, asked them which airlines they work for, ask for their results, ask them for references and then ask them for the price of that. Then make a proper assesment whether it is worth it or not.
And FYI, the new course has been set up to meet the requirements of their real customers demand.. the airlines..
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Dutchie
And what else might the ATP academy be providing in this AQC course that you dont recieve in an MCC? On the surface it appears to be a new marketing gimmick, the oldest trick in the book, more or less the same thing just packaged differently.
IMHO do the MCC, its what the JAA and airlines want on your licence not an AQC, whatever that is....
And what else might the ATP academy be providing in this AQC course that you dont recieve in an MCC? On the surface it appears to be a new marketing gimmick, the oldest trick in the book, more or less the same thing just packaged differently.
IMHO do the MCC, its what the JAA and airlines want on your licence not an AQC, whatever that is....
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Dutchie - The original question concerned the future of the MCC in the light of ATP's AQ course. Perhaps you should have read and digested this and read the replies more carefully before hurling personal and offensive remarks around. It is generally found that such posts say more about the character of the poster than about anyone he/she is attempting to attack.
To get back to the original question. It is naive to believe that any independent training provider is in the game for any reason other than to make money, the welfare of the trainee comes second - by how far depends on the provider. The AQ course is a response to similar (JOC) courses already run by OAT, BAe and WMU which have long been accepted by CAA the as fulfilling the requirements of the MCC course as well as preparing one for the airlines. Hence the fact that both BA and Air Lingus use such courses. ATP have also been running a similar course for BA, they are now re-naming it and marketing it to everyone.
I'm sure it will be a perfectly splendid course when it is finally approved, as are all the others, but there is nothing unique about it and it is not a pre-requisite for a multi-crew type rating - the MCC course, however, is.
To get back to the original question. It is naive to believe that any independent training provider is in the game for any reason other than to make money, the welfare of the trainee comes second - by how far depends on the provider. The AQ course is a response to similar (JOC) courses already run by OAT, BAe and WMU which have long been accepted by CAA the as fulfilling the requirements of the MCC course as well as preparing one for the airlines. Hence the fact that both BA and Air Lingus use such courses. ATP have also been running a similar course for BA, they are now re-naming it and marketing it to everyone.
I'm sure it will be a perfectly splendid course when it is finally approved, as are all the others, but there is nothing unique about it and it is not a pre-requisite for a multi-crew type rating - the MCC course, however, is.
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I agree guys, MCC is a requirement on your licence if you want to get a job with the airlines!
overheard a conversation between a training officer in an airline & a senior capt a few days ago regarding recruitment.... one guy had X, the second guy had X plus a MCC, guess who got hired!
overheard a conversation between a training officer in an airline & a senior capt a few days ago regarding recruitment.... one guy had X, the second guy had X plus a MCC, guess who got hired!
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Just Another Number,
I'm with you mate, I too would like to know if these new "all singing all dancing, upgraded, you can't do without it honest" MCC course are going to slip into pre-requisite land for getting a job.
For someone who's finances are already straining at the seams I'm a bit dubious of these altruistic companies selling their wares as "essential" and "the perfect tool for an airline position". All it needs is someone to blow the old "safety" whistle (Will someone PLEASE think of the children) and all of a sudden we're all another thousand quid out of pocket (sponsorship guys disregard).
JimNich (Just Another Numptie)
I'm with you mate, I too would like to know if these new "all singing all dancing, upgraded, you can't do without it honest" MCC course are going to slip into pre-requisite land for getting a job.
For someone who's finances are already straining at the seams I'm a bit dubious of these altruistic companies selling their wares as "essential" and "the perfect tool for an airline position". All it needs is someone to blow the old "safety" whistle (Will someone PLEASE think of the children) and all of a sudden we're all another thousand quid out of pocket (sponsorship guys disregard).
JimNich (Just Another Numptie)
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As Rolling Circle pointed out, company's exist to make money and are not charities. To do this, they must provide what the customer wants and let's not have any doubts, the main customers are the airlines. It doesn't take very long to gain a bad reputation when people discover that very few if any airlines are hiring people who did courses at school "X".
That's the reason OATS, WMU and Jerez set up their JOCs and that's the reason the AQC is being set up. After that, at the end of the day, it's your choice. There are plenty of people around who embarked on the money swallowing process of flying training with the attitude of "all I need is the piece of paper (CPL(IR), ATPL or whatever) and an MCC and I'm in."
There is a whole lot more to getting through the selection process for airlines. It's a fact of life I'm afraid that the airlines would rather you spent your own money to arrive at a standard they want rather than them have to spend theirs on further training - such as JOC etc. LOFT itself began as part of induction training within airlines, until the airlines realised that out-sourcing the thing to private companies was cheaper for them (the airline).
So please don't knock a company who is attempting to provide what the market demands. If you don't want to do it then take your chances and go for the corner shop MCC.
That's the reason OATS, WMU and Jerez set up their JOCs and that's the reason the AQC is being set up. After that, at the end of the day, it's your choice. There are plenty of people around who embarked on the money swallowing process of flying training with the attitude of "all I need is the piece of paper (CPL(IR), ATPL or whatever) and an MCC and I'm in."
There is a whole lot more to getting through the selection process for airlines. It's a fact of life I'm afraid that the airlines would rather you spent your own money to arrive at a standard they want rather than them have to spend theirs on further training - such as JOC etc. LOFT itself began as part of induction training within airlines, until the airlines realised that out-sourcing the thing to private companies was cheaper for them (the airline).
So please don't knock a company who is attempting to provide what the market demands. If you don't want to do it then take your chances and go for the corner shop MCC.
