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EU pilot-shortage a hoax?

Old 18th Mar 2018, 17:17
  #1 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Europe
Posts: 396
EU pilot-shortage a hoax?

It appears to me to be a never ending story "pilot-shortage" - sometimes I have the impression that it's more of a PR campaign to the benefit of airlines and flight schools.
Today commonly the majority of EU operators (airlines as well as executive companies) require a (self-sponsored) type rating, preferably with a couple hundred hours on type and a minimum of 1000hr tt (total time). Lately I've been looking up various EU carriers on the internet and apparently the only EU carrier requiring no self-sponsored TR and no minimum hours is from Ireland That doesn't really lot like a pilot-shortage to me? I have the impression that the airlines/industry just want to make sure that there is no shortage on supplies (pilots)!

Last edited by Transsonic2000; 18th Mar 2018 at 17:29.
Transsonic2000 is offline  
Old 18th Mar 2018, 21:45
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Join Date: Sep 2016
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There is a shortage, as you say, of good pilots with experience on type.

Same as the so-called shortage of flight instructors in Europe... not true. There is a relative shortage of good + experienced flight instructors (salaries are still laughable though, so people still move on to airlines as soon as they get a chance).
KeepCalm is offline  
Old 18th Mar 2018, 22:06
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Join Date: Apr 2003
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There is a shortage of dignity

As long as there are individuals paying to fly or self funding the type rating...
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Old 18th Mar 2018, 22:09
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: USA
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A shortage of WHAT ?

The term, "pilot shortage", is meaningless without an agreed upon consensus definition by those addressing the issue.

In all the years of discussion I've seen on this subject, I've yet to see one acknowledged and used as a basis for any discussion.

Until that happens, we're all The Blind Men and the Elephant.
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Old 18th Mar 2018, 22:38
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Join Date: Jun 2002
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Airlines are probably just slightly under-crewed at the moment. When flights are regularly cancelled then we will know there is a shortage. The airlines affected will be the ones where people are the unhappiest, the ones where the grass is just a bit browner. Airlines that are refuse to give pilots a reasonable work-life balance or treat them like idiots or work-units will lose their pilots first. Then, if there is a real shortage it will be contagious. We might even get paid what we are worth now we to pay for type ratings, training etc.

Notice I in the reasons for leaving I have not said turboprop or mentioned salary because they are not the most important.

PM
Piltdown Man is offline  
Old 18th Mar 2018, 23:32
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: USA
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Originally Posted by Piltdown Man View Post
When flights are regularly cancelled then we will know there is a shortage.
PM,

I'd suggest that won't be the defining criterion for a "shortage". Too many causes for flights being cancelled...even on a wide scale.

Who's going to give the factual information ?

Are airline managements to be trusted to admit they don't have pilots to fly the business plans ? And admit to their own bungling ? Over a rather long time frame ?

What would shareholders and Boards of Directors say to that ?

The answer makes management's blood run cold.

So, the blame is officially assigned to factors management can't control...or claim they can't.

Isn't this fun ? I'm rather enjoying all of the turmoil. Aren't you ?
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Old 2nd Jun 2018, 09:52
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Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: European Union
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The only facts are the ones we can actually measure.

I've run a search on the aviationjobsearch site with the keyword "pilot". The results are: 355 listed jobs, for the whole world. That looks a bit risky to invest and hopping to get a return of the invested amount in that training. 1.5 years on training plus 3 years on a lower initial salary means that only after 5 years if things run smoothly we get the return (break even) of the investment. This looks less appealing if we compare to spending those 5 years on a 9 to 5 job paying half of the pilot net salary.

Also if the world economy and stability means people will be travelling more it will also mean higher fuel prices.

Let's also not forget the regional differences. The lack of pilots in Asia is different from EU and from USA.

I'd like to have more certainty before spending up to 100k in training as a full time occupation.

Best
etsat is offline  
Old 2nd Jun 2018, 13:53
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Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Netherlands
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Originally Posted by etsat View Post
The only facts are the ones we can actually measure.

I've run a search on the aviationjobsearch site with the keyword "pilot". The results are: 355 listed jobs, for the whole world. That looks a bit risky to invest and hopping to get a return of the invested amount in that training. 1.5 years on training plus 3 years on a lower initial salary means that only after 5 years if things run smoothly we get the return (break even) of the investment. This looks less appealing if we compare to spending those 5 years on a 9 to 5 job paying half of the pilot net salary.

Also if the world economy and stability means people will be travelling more it will also mean higher fuel prices.

Let's also not forget the regional differences. The lack of pilots in Asia is different from EU and from USA.

I'd like to have more certainty before spending up to 100k in training as a full time occupation.

Best
In other words, if your primary objective with a pilot job is money it's not worth the pay off and risk

I would only encourage someone to go down the Pilot route if they were passionate about flying and weren't looking to count their days off and finances before they even get in the right hand seat
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Old 2nd Jun 2018, 14:25
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: mids
Age: 54
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There is no shortage of zero muticrew time FO's and there are more than enough willing to pay for type ratings if you haven't enough cold applications a couple of days open application on the internet will get you a couple hundred applicants for a job.

Captains completely different story..... 1000 hours plus PIC on a JAR25 machine and agency's are pestering you. A lot of airlines will give you a nice bonus if you introduce someone that's experienced and qualified (with or without type rating) for a DEC position.
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