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Failing ATPL exams

Old 26th Mar 2017, 16:21
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Failing ATPL exams

Good day,

I have done my first batch of ATPL exams and out of the 7 I took I only passed 4, leaving me with 3 fails. How will this affect my employment opportunities, I've been stressing lately thinking I won't get a job when I'm done with the course.

Any feedback is appreciated!
Regards!
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Old 26th Mar 2017, 18:48
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Some airlines specify first time passes, others couldn't give two short fvcks. Don't stress about it and crack on.

Make sure you pass them next time, however...
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Old 26th Mar 2017, 22:05
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And why did you take seven of them at once ? You had much on your plate and I cannot guarantee anyone could pass their ATPL exams in just two takes.. Or they could but it would be a huge effort..

Try to split the remaining 10 in 2, 3 or even 4 takings.
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Old 27th Mar 2017, 07:01
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In practice, all the airlines know that most people bash the databases and if a bum is needed on a seat to get something flying, then all that goes out of the window. The requirement for first time passes and high marks is simply a way to wade through a pile of resumes, as any Chief Pilot will tell you. In other words, they are used as an excuse to weed you out.

KayPam - we have had several people take all the exams at once - in fact we recommend it, due to the crossover between the questions. Curiously enough, they mostly seem to be German.
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Old 27th Mar 2017, 09:46
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Back in the day, Bristol Groundschool used to recommend 2 sittings. I did all mine in 2 with no real difficulty as did many friends.
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Old 27th Mar 2017, 11:13
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This is true, originally the UK CAA would only allow a maximum of two modules. I think there are still some EASA Authorities that haven't caught on to the idea at all and require all exams to be attempted at once.
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Old 27th Mar 2017, 19:22
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Originally Posted by paco View Post
In practice, all the airlines know that most people bash the databases and if a bum is needed on a seat to get something flying, then all that goes out of the window. The requirement for first time passes and high marks is simply a way to wade through a pile of resumes, as any Chief Pilot will tell you. In other words, they are used as an excuse to weed you out.

KayPam - we have had several people take all the exams at once - in fact we recommend it, due to the crossover between the questions. Curiously enough, they mostly seem to be German.
All 14 ?

Congrats for anyone succeeding at that, even after months and months of learning
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Old 27th Mar 2017, 20:17
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I know a number of UK airlines have 3 or 4 criteria which seem to be: 4 or less retakes at ATPL, first series pass on CPL, first series pass on IR and an average atpl above a certain threshold airline dependant. However, as a group of guys finishing our training we worked out that they apear to take you to interview if you meet at least 3 of those criteria. And then its down to you.

Keep up the hard work and good luck.

**DISCLAIMER - This was true for us but may have changed / may be different for you..
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Old 28th Mar 2017, 00:58
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4 retakes seems like a lot, doesn't it ?
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Old 28th Mar 2017, 01:24
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I talked to an AF pilot few days ago, he studied at ENAC and did 7 & 7....
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Old 28th Mar 2017, 05:51
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Kaypam - the last guy was Turkish, lowest mark 93%.
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Old 28th Mar 2017, 10:14
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I should add that the 2 sittings I did were in 2010, before the exams changed markedly. Apparently some of the previously "easier" exams are now rather more challenging hence the number of sittings.
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Old 29th Mar 2017, 20:40
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It may just be flight school rumours, but I've also heard a similar thing to Mawright. Sources say that after four EASA theory fails it becomes extremely hard, if not impossible to find a job.

As for which airlines specify what minimums requirements, some say Ryanair and EasyJet only accept applicants with an EASA theory average of 85% or above, but then some sources reckon Ryanair will allow up to two re-takes. Supposedly Emirates and BA will only accept those with first time passes in everything, but I doubt the number of people who go straight from training to those two is very high. Flybe seem to be quite well-known to only accept those with an EASA theory average of 90% and above.

Then again, I was told a few weeks ago that some people on a well-known MPL course got right to the end of their training, and were dismissed by the airline for failing the final interview and theory assessment, so it goes to show that you really can't take your foot off the pedal when it comes to flight school performance.
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Old 30th Mar 2017, 05:12
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Failing interviews is an interesting conundrum. Reports are feeding back that candidtates tend to freeze when faced with emergencies and get swamped easily, with very little multi-crew potential. This is one reason for this daft KSA 100.
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Old 30th Mar 2017, 22:35
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EZY take three retakes max. BA/Emirates/FLYBE want 90% average with no retakes. Ryanair take 2 retakes.

This is for direct entry FO, after landing a job it probably gets superseded by experience and then no one cares. The big thing is if two people are going for a job then the atpl average and number of retakes can be a factor for some airlines.

The new ATPLs aren't hard, they just take a lot of studying. No more bank smashing, gotta learn the subjects now!
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Old 31st Mar 2017, 02:01
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I wish the exams were private and only said if you have done them or not. It's not the airlines business how many attempts we have used when it is LEGAL to use multiple attempts.
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Old 31st Mar 2017, 07:49
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Fundamentally pass rates and number of failures is simply another gate, especially for newbies.

Post ATPL you are going to need be able to pass exams (Type ratings, conversions etc. .) so you have to get used to it, develop exam technique, etc. It's one thing failing exams on your own dime, if you're persistently struggling with the ATPL for whatever reason it is going to ring a bell with the companies - they really don't like the idea of perhaps giving individuals extra time /extra days off the line because the individual has a problem taking exams.

it goes to show that you really can't take your foot off the pedal when it comes to flight school performance
It gets slightly easier as you gain experience but FWIW these days courses are increasingly compressed - if undergoing any training (conversion, left to right etc) you can't ever take your foot off the pedal.

Last edited by wiggy; 31st Mar 2017 at 08:04.
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Old 31st Mar 2017, 08:08
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I think ( but am only guessing ) that once you've got your ATPL and proven that you can actually get through a full TR and have hours on the line I doubt anybody is going to look too hard at your initial exam performance, though I may be wrong and there may be exceptions.
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Old 31st Mar 2017, 10:27
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I would imagine, the importance of things like first time passes and high scores is in proportional to the number of CV's they receive and the airlines need for pilots.
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Old 2nd Apr 2017, 05:42
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You're focussing on the wrong area - focus on the material not the deadline!

Good luck.
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