Oxford Aviation Acadamy
I was there in 1996 on there heli course, three job offers before I left. Good school, good instructors crap kitchen staff ! All the big airlines had cadets there when I went though.
Oxford has a good reputation in the industry
Just my 2 pence worth
ITI
Oxford has a good reputation in the industry
Just my 2 pence worth
ITI
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: london
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Im hopefully going to study Integrated ATPL(A) APP FIRST OFFICER course, in 2011. If anyone can tell me whether im provided with accommodation, services etc. Also once i graduate will it be easy getting a job and whats the pay like for new pilots in the commercial industry?
very much appreciate your vital help!!
Mahdi
very much appreciate your vital help!!
Mahdi
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: London
Posts: 611
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Impress,
It was indeed a great school but sadly, things change and a good reputation cannot be sustained when standards and quality are diluted to the extent I fear they have been. Real pity in my view.
What?!?!
It was indeed a great school but sadly, things change and a good reputation cannot be sustained when standards and quality are diluted to the extent I fear they have been. Real pity in my view.
first officer modular integrated training course
PPRuNe Handmaiden
Also once i graduate will it be easy getting a job and whats the pay like for new pilots in the commercial industry
You'll need to work very hard to "shine" at your school to be considered for any job. Other than that, you'll have to prove yourself for any job, just like every one else.
Pay? At the moment for new hires they are paying the company!
I believe some of the contracts being offered pay about £1000/month. Ridiculous money for a jet job.
Things change, hopefully it will get better but I would plan on it not improving for new hires in the UK.
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: FL390
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You want to choose where you work?
Then rule out the chances of getting a job!!
Right now, for that first job, you go where they need you.
And yeh, getting a job straight after training requires a lot of effort throughout the course to make your report stick out and get selected for internal recommendations.. or you just need a hell of a lot of luck and be able to prove yourself to all the other companies.
I was lucky and managed to get a job within 2 months.
Pay isn't necessarily 1000 / month. Depends on the company and the contract.
For example.. some of the recent grads.. on 50 / hour, so 60hrs x 50 = 3000. Plus standby pay, out of base pay, allowances etc. (company dependent..)
My friends are getting between 50 to 90 hours a month.
(Max yearly is 900, but who knows if we will fly that)
So.. perhaps around 35 a year.
Believe companies like ASW starting is more like 18.. others is more.. it all depends.
Factor in loan repayments though. If you need one.
It is a hard world out there in the market, and many of my good friends have yet to have a break, but things are picking up, and if you're lucky it can work out very nicely. But it is certainly not a sure thing.. in any state of economic climate!
Then rule out the chances of getting a job!!
Right now, for that first job, you go where they need you.
And yeh, getting a job straight after training requires a lot of effort throughout the course to make your report stick out and get selected for internal recommendations.. or you just need a hell of a lot of luck and be able to prove yourself to all the other companies.
I was lucky and managed to get a job within 2 months.
Pay isn't necessarily 1000 / month. Depends on the company and the contract.
For example.. some of the recent grads.. on 50 / hour, so 60hrs x 50 = 3000. Plus standby pay, out of base pay, allowances etc. (company dependent..)
My friends are getting between 50 to 90 hours a month.
(Max yearly is 900, but who knows if we will fly that)
So.. perhaps around 35 a year.
Believe companies like ASW starting is more like 18.. others is more.. it all depends.
Factor in loan repayments though. If you need one.
It is a hard world out there in the market, and many of my good friends have yet to have a break, but things are picking up, and if you're lucky it can work out very nicely. But it is certainly not a sure thing.. in any state of economic climate!
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: london
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks for your help, would it be easy getting the whole course fee on a loan ?
Also how does the routine work whilst studying at oxford sorry for all the questions its just I want to be well prepared once i begin
Mahdi
Also how does the routine work whilst studying at oxford sorry for all the questions its just I want to be well prepared once i begin
Mahdi
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: FL390
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Depends on your situation.
But you need to remember that you will have large living expenses plus you may need to pay for a type rating.. so allow another 25 - 35k.
(before everyone starts bickering, I'm not saying it is the right or wrong thing to do, it is fact).
Routine all depends.
Groundschool is 5 days a week, 830 to 4:30 studying in class,
Get home and do another couple of hours and probs more at weekends.. for about 6 - 8 months.
Arizona, all depends on the instructor.
You'll spend a couple of hours prepping, couple of hours flying then a couple of hours backseating your flying partner. If you have an early morning flight, there is time to go get a tan by the pool, by it wears off.
You will fly 5 / 6 days a week and can't book leave.
You know when you are flying 2 days in advance.
The IR is similar.
But the flights are only announced at 14:00 the day before.
I ended up doing about one day of flying then one day off and so on. (so never really have 2 day weekends)
But again, depends on the instructor.
I found myself reading up / practising on the sims on days off though, which is a bit of a bore but it paid off for me and my flying partner in the end.
But you need to remember that you will have large living expenses plus you may need to pay for a type rating.. so allow another 25 - 35k.
(before everyone starts bickering, I'm not saying it is the right or wrong thing to do, it is fact).
Routine all depends.
Groundschool is 5 days a week, 830 to 4:30 studying in class,
Get home and do another couple of hours and probs more at weekends.. for about 6 - 8 months.
Arizona, all depends on the instructor.
You'll spend a couple of hours prepping, couple of hours flying then a couple of hours backseating your flying partner. If you have an early morning flight, there is time to go get a tan by the pool, by it wears off.
You will fly 5 / 6 days a week and can't book leave.
You know when you are flying 2 days in advance.
The IR is similar.
But the flights are only announced at 14:00 the day before.
I ended up doing about one day of flying then one day off and so on. (so never really have 2 day weekends)
But again, depends on the instructor.
I found myself reading up / practising on the sims on days off though, which is a bit of a bore but it paid off for me and my flying partner in the end.
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: london
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Do they provide us with accommodation as I live in london and seems tricky travelling back and forth every week. Also what are you and your friends doing currently are you still training or have you started flying,
Also is it true you only need GSCE qualifications to become a pilot many people say you need to attend uni and get a degree ?
Thanks Again
Mahdi
Also is it true you only need GSCE qualifications to become a pilot many people say you need to attend uni and get a degree ?
Thanks Again
Mahdi
PPRuNe Handmaiden
Mahdi, many of these questions you should be asking OAA after all you're paying them.
You do only need GCSEs (or equivalent) but unless you have something else to bring to the table, you'll need at minimum A levels simply because the competition is very tough.
You do only need GCSEs (or equivalent) but unless you have something else to bring to the table, you'll need at minimum A levels simply because the competition is very tough.
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: FL390
Posts: 49
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Agree with the above.
And no they don't provide accom, other than in the USA.
I suggest you either ask OAA or look into all the info on the web, it is a lot of money at stake and you shouldn't go into to it without proper research!
I'm flying for a big European airline, as are a few of my friends.
A couple of others have been offered jobs with another well known, lo-co.
Most of the other guys on my course (3/4) haven't got jobs yet, and it's been about half a year since finishing.
And no they don't provide accom, other than in the USA.
I suggest you either ask OAA or look into all the info on the web, it is a lot of money at stake and you shouldn't go into to it without proper research!
I'm flying for a big European airline, as are a few of my friends.
A couple of others have been offered jobs with another well known, lo-co.
Most of the other guys on my course (3/4) haven't got jobs yet, and it's been about half a year since finishing.
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: at the whim of people I've never met
Age: 46
Posts: 607
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
OAA do have over priced and poorish quality accommodation at Oxford airport and Heyford, but most people move out of that very quickly into a house share nearby
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: North West
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yeah Langford isn't the best really, I agree that it's definitely over priced for what you get. I lived there for the whole duration of the groundschool phase, overall though I must say I enjoyed it! Most of my classmates were also living there so it was great to all get together at night and ask eachother questions. It was also highly sociable
.
Once back in the UK after the CPL phase in Arizona four of us got together and got a house in nearby Headington, definitely a lot cheaper!
GD
.Once back in the UK after the CPL phase in Arizona four of us got together and got a house in nearby Headington, definitely a lot cheaper!
GD
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: In hope...
Posts: 52
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My tuppence worth...
I am an OAA Grad (integrated, probably ill-timed, but that's for another day) and finished earlier this year. I do not intend to provide a complete review, which has been done to death, and wlll no doubt lead to OAA sales team coming back on and quoting the usual pitch again anyway, but just some general points.
1) OAA is a business, a big one, which grew much bigger throughout the course of my training and has, in my opinion, grown too big for its own good as far as ab initio training is concerned.
The company is a money-making venture and you absolutely must remember that.
2) OAA Accommodation is part of the money-making venture and therefore HUGELY overpriced and not especially good quality. I elected not to stay in it at all but spent enough time there to know I had made a wise decision. If you want a cooker then stay elsewhere; if you're happy with a two-plate plug-in hob and a microwave then knock yourself out.
Notwithstanding this the accomm staff are, by all accounts, some of the best on offer.
3) OAA Management...least said the better, quite frankly. Let's just say that they go to great lengths to make you feel like a "student... trainee pilot... graduate" and do not take kindly to being reminded that you are also a "customer" ... (I shall now have to wash my mouth out, bad, bad word)
4) Groundschool...pretty much spot on, if you match the tuition you are given with a mature, dedicated approach and put the work in yourself as well. The instrcutors are committed and generally very knowledgeable. If you are not ex-forces then you may get a bit fed up of all the "in-chat" but it's bearable. CBT was growing in popularity, seems to be an industry-wide thing so just accept it but personally I absolutely can not stand it.
5) Arizona Flying...great fun, absolutely loved it. Make sure you get yourself sorted out on a personal and professional level with your instructor early on. Make it clear how much experience you have and how you would like to be taught. I do not suggest making demands but having a mature and sensible conversation. Whatever you do speak up at all times, do not just go along for the ride and if it's not working out then get it dealt with. There were some less-approachable staff (instructors and non-intructors) but mostly they were great. Flying solo keep your wits about you and NEVER stop looking around you, there are a lot of planes in the valley...
Only gripe --- maintenance could be better, especially on senecas, but that may well have been rectified by now
6) Instrument flying... everything above with extra emphasis. My personal opinion is that there is always something you can be doing. I was in the airport nearly every day for a solid 5 or 6 hours studying, planning and reading everything I cold get my hands on and I still felt like I hadn't a clue. Others turn up, fly/sim, go home, do some planning for a hour or so and seem to get by. I would suggest that if you are not nervous and feel that you know what you need to know you are not working enough but that's maybe just me. Even with a first time pass on the IR you should, in my opinion, be accutely aware of the fact that you know almost nothing about instrument flying in the real world.
7) MCC...great fun if a bit short. I was with someone I knew and with whom I could work almost without speaking (although that's very much not the point of the MCC). I still believe you should be putting the work in to every session although there is more emphasis on your instructor briefing you in this phase. Coming soon after IR it tends to get a bit of a last-hoorah reputation which is a shame because it's actually a pretty good exercise
8) Getting a job afterwards...
Right, this is the bit I guess everyone wants to hear. I am saying this now and afterwards donning my tin-hat and taking cover:
If you expect OAA to find you a job you will be disappointed and you are most likely a bit dim; if you expect them to help you look for a job, recommend you for a job and prepare you for any subsequent interview you are still likely to be disappointed but perhaps marginally less so.
Why do I say this... well...
I started the training under no illusions as to what was waiting on the other side i.e. not a great deal (again, different discussion about timing).
Since leaving OAA I have found a sort-of relevant job albeit not flying much, OAA has nothing to do with this and I have no problem with that, I needed to go back to work and always planned to either in my old job or something relevant.
If you try to express the opinion to OAA that you don't believe in P2F or, even worse, that you feel that as a newly qualified pilot you are perhaps, dare I say this even after training with them, not ready to for a jet or even maybe airline job you will probably just have committed employment suicide no matter how much you might be able to get experienced pilots to agree with you. Some may say that this is nonsense and point to the usual examples; some will say that perhaps it's a lack of confidence; some might just accuse me of trying to be too sensible.
In my opinion OAA have become absolutely dedicated to P2F with Ryanair and Easy to the point where you will be (almost) dismissed if you do not opt for one or both. This is pretty much seen as the reality of the wold now, and maybe it is, that's another debate, but my point is that the approach seems to be completely blinkered. One other interesting example that has been offered recently was to take up employment with OAA as an FI in Melbourne, sounds intersting you might think, well it is, until you find out that for the costs involved you'll see change from Ryanair! Absolutely no joke (well, on my part at least..)
Final point, there are still, very occasionally and at very, very short notice opportunities which come up through OAA which do not involve the level of investment you will need for Ryanair or Easy but will involve some investment or some kind of sacrifice... How do you get these, well, honestly, I am buggered if I know. I have tried and I have failed each time (and I thought I was pretty good by OAA standards although do try to recognise my own faults). I have asked how they select people and received no answer other than competition is tough and that it's my job after training to keep in touch with them for job opportunities etc. I suspect politics plays a large part in this process but maybe I'm just a bit fed up and cynical.
Bottom line (in my opinion) ... Oxford is mostly a good training establishment buried under the weight of a growing business and if you arm yourself with some knowledge and bit of common sense you should be fine on their course. As for afterwards well, frankly, there's a queue, join it, and pray you haven't missed the bus ... or get the cheque-book out (again).
Just my tuppence worth, and now I am off to send out some more copies of my CV before asking in my evening prayers for the fortitude to continue the struggle and not cave in to temptation. I wish everyone well whatever you choose.
*Bit longer than expected and now ducking for cover.
1) OAA is a business, a big one, which grew much bigger throughout the course of my training and has, in my opinion, grown too big for its own good as far as ab initio training is concerned.
The company is a money-making venture and you absolutely must remember that.
2) OAA Accommodation is part of the money-making venture and therefore HUGELY overpriced and not especially good quality. I elected not to stay in it at all but spent enough time there to know I had made a wise decision. If you want a cooker then stay elsewhere; if you're happy with a two-plate plug-in hob and a microwave then knock yourself out.
Notwithstanding this the accomm staff are, by all accounts, some of the best on offer.
3) OAA Management...least said the better, quite frankly. Let's just say that they go to great lengths to make you feel like a "student... trainee pilot... graduate" and do not take kindly to being reminded that you are also a "customer" ... (I shall now have to wash my mouth out, bad, bad word)
4) Groundschool...pretty much spot on, if you match the tuition you are given with a mature, dedicated approach and put the work in yourself as well. The instrcutors are committed and generally very knowledgeable. If you are not ex-forces then you may get a bit fed up of all the "in-chat" but it's bearable. CBT was growing in popularity, seems to be an industry-wide thing so just accept it but personally I absolutely can not stand it.
5) Arizona Flying...great fun, absolutely loved it. Make sure you get yourself sorted out on a personal and professional level with your instructor early on. Make it clear how much experience you have and how you would like to be taught. I do not suggest making demands but having a mature and sensible conversation. Whatever you do speak up at all times, do not just go along for the ride and if it's not working out then get it dealt with. There were some less-approachable staff (instructors and non-intructors) but mostly they were great. Flying solo keep your wits about you and NEVER stop looking around you, there are a lot of planes in the valley...
Only gripe --- maintenance could be better, especially on senecas, but that may well have been rectified by now
6) Instrument flying... everything above with extra emphasis. My personal opinion is that there is always something you can be doing. I was in the airport nearly every day for a solid 5 or 6 hours studying, planning and reading everything I cold get my hands on and I still felt like I hadn't a clue. Others turn up, fly/sim, go home, do some planning for a hour or so and seem to get by. I would suggest that if you are not nervous and feel that you know what you need to know you are not working enough but that's maybe just me. Even with a first time pass on the IR you should, in my opinion, be accutely aware of the fact that you know almost nothing about instrument flying in the real world.
7) MCC...great fun if a bit short. I was with someone I knew and with whom I could work almost without speaking (although that's very much not the point of the MCC). I still believe you should be putting the work in to every session although there is more emphasis on your instructor briefing you in this phase. Coming soon after IR it tends to get a bit of a last-hoorah reputation which is a shame because it's actually a pretty good exercise
8) Getting a job afterwards...
Right, this is the bit I guess everyone wants to hear. I am saying this now and afterwards donning my tin-hat and taking cover:
If you expect OAA to find you a job you will be disappointed and you are most likely a bit dim; if you expect them to help you look for a job, recommend you for a job and prepare you for any subsequent interview you are still likely to be disappointed but perhaps marginally less so.
Why do I say this... well...
I started the training under no illusions as to what was waiting on the other side i.e. not a great deal (again, different discussion about timing).
Since leaving OAA I have found a sort-of relevant job albeit not flying much, OAA has nothing to do with this and I have no problem with that, I needed to go back to work and always planned to either in my old job or something relevant.
If you try to express the opinion to OAA that you don't believe in P2F or, even worse, that you feel that as a newly qualified pilot you are perhaps, dare I say this even after training with them, not ready to for a jet or even maybe airline job you will probably just have committed employment suicide no matter how much you might be able to get experienced pilots to agree with you. Some may say that this is nonsense and point to the usual examples; some will say that perhaps it's a lack of confidence; some might just accuse me of trying to be too sensible.
In my opinion OAA have become absolutely dedicated to P2F with Ryanair and Easy to the point where you will be (almost) dismissed if you do not opt for one or both. This is pretty much seen as the reality of the wold now, and maybe it is, that's another debate, but my point is that the approach seems to be completely blinkered. One other interesting example that has been offered recently was to take up employment with OAA as an FI in Melbourne, sounds intersting you might think, well it is, until you find out that for the costs involved you'll see change from Ryanair! Absolutely no joke (well, on my part at least..)
Final point, there are still, very occasionally and at very, very short notice opportunities which come up through OAA which do not involve the level of investment you will need for Ryanair or Easy but will involve some investment or some kind of sacrifice... How do you get these, well, honestly, I am buggered if I know. I have tried and I have failed each time (and I thought I was pretty good by OAA standards although do try to recognise my own faults). I have asked how they select people and received no answer other than competition is tough and that it's my job after training to keep in touch with them for job opportunities etc. I suspect politics plays a large part in this process but maybe I'm just a bit fed up and cynical.
Bottom line (in my opinion) ... Oxford is mostly a good training establishment buried under the weight of a growing business and if you arm yourself with some knowledge and bit of common sense you should be fine on their course. As for afterwards well, frankly, there's a queue, join it, and pray you haven't missed the bus ... or get the cheque-book out (again).
Just my tuppence worth, and now I am off to send out some more copies of my CV before asking in my evening prayers for the fortitude to continue the struggle and not cave in to temptation. I wish everyone well whatever you choose.
*Bit longer than expected and now ducking for cover.
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: uk
Posts: 182
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Great post max continous, I am an oxford grad and can say I agree with everything in your post entirely, especially the "getting a job" part. The sad truth is that after your final JOC lesson, you have spent all your money so theres no need to be as friendly as before. So you may go in to the school to keep up appearances, but don't expect the same treatment. Lets put it this way, if you owned a restaurant, and you had a customer come in and sit down and not actually buy anything, would you be nice to him?
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: England, surrey, Walton-on-thames
Age: 28
Posts: 12
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
i have done a bit of research on OAA because i want to go there in a couple of years aswell. Although they are asking for an unholy amount of money, it does pay off in the long run because OAA is the only training company that provides post training employment scheme with british airways, in other words they will arrange for you to have an interview. Also OAA is looked upon as the Best flight school in the world. so airlines will be impressed you trained at OAA - you pay for the name as well as the training. Airlines would rather take on a newby from OAA than one who trained at a lower quality flight school given the choice between the two. 
PPRuNe Handmaiden
Sir Fizzy, I suspect you may be a troll, if not, at 15 you have a long way to go before you'll be knocking at any employers door.
At the moment, BA are only recruiting pilots with 500 hours or more on the Airbus series or the Boeing series of aircraft. Sort of blows the "BA recruits from Oxford" theory out of the water doesn't it?
I would read max_continuous post again. In fact, print it out and study it.
At the moment, BA are only recruiting pilots with 500 hours or more on the Airbus series or the Boeing series of aircraft. Sort of blows the "BA recruits from Oxford" theory out of the water doesn't it?
I would read max_continuous post again. In fact, print it out and study it.