Which Flight School To Choose From (USA)
Joined: Jan 2010
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From: India
SoCal App,
Sir I intend to get a CFI/CFII ratings.I would not mind doing a 2 year(or more) degree course along with that if it allows me to stay and work in US for about 2 years(Got to be cost effective as well!!).For that I have to get F-1 visa.I am in a tight situation financially and getting a degree course along with the ratings will cost me plenty.That is the reason why I chose not to do so.(Can you suggest me any options/alternates?).And also is aviation related F-1 any different from the normal F-1 catagory? Can you explain how is it a replacement to J-1?
As you said no school/college reccomends F-1 for only CFI/II ratings.Only option remaining with me is M-1.It doesnt allow me to work but I think I can gain professional experience (correct me if I am wrong) after complition of the course(i.e CFI/II).I have been contacted by Delta recently and they said I wont be eligible to get F-1 and I'll have to get an M-1.But still after complition of the course I could interview with them and upon selection build a few hours (depending upon time left on my visa after complition of the course) without getting paid which is fine by me atleast its a legal way.
Sir I intend to get a CFI/CFII ratings.I would not mind doing a 2 year(or more) degree course along with that if it allows me to stay and work in US for about 2 years(Got to be cost effective as well!!).For that I have to get F-1 visa.I am in a tight situation financially and getting a degree course along with the ratings will cost me plenty.That is the reason why I chose not to do so.(Can you suggest me any options/alternates?).And also is aviation related F-1 any different from the normal F-1 catagory? Can you explain how is it a replacement to J-1?
As you said no school/college reccomends F-1 for only CFI/II ratings.Only option remaining with me is M-1.It doesnt allow me to work but I think I can gain professional experience (correct me if I am wrong) after complition of the course(i.e CFI/II).I have been contacted by Delta recently and they said I wont be eligible to get F-1 and I'll have to get an M-1.But still after complition of the course I could interview with them and upon selection build a few hours (depending upon time left on my visa after complition of the course) without getting paid which is fine by me atleast its a legal way.
Joined: Jul 2007
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From: UK, US, now more ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀
Well,
If you did your research properly regarding work/instructing option after finishing training, and looked into the (NOW PHASED OUT) aviation J-1 visa, you'd know.
You didn't even know you can change your schools on M1 or get another extension at same school!!
There are 8 (IIRC) schools, mostly fixed wing, two that do both rotary and FW and one only rotary (Bristow Academy) that used to be able to issue DS-2019 form to apply for J1 visa. That'd give you two years' worth of training and instructing (IF hired) at same or other US school. Since some US govt agencies didn't want to administer J1 for aviation, the other didn't want it, so they cancelled it.
Couple big schools' bosses got together and lobbied for some sort of replacement.
Initially, the 'news' said *new kind of visa M1 for work as well* - which we know didn't mean anything.
The govt agencies decided to consider 0/PPL-CPL/IR/CFI programme equivalent to academic studies, with OPT (up to 1 year work authorisation at the end of training, but with more restrictions regarding paperwork than previous J1).
So, the F1 one can now get in past J1 schools, where you DO NOT do any academic, ie associate degree or more, technically, but do part 141 ground and flight training, blah blah, IS NOT same as other F1.
Since there is the provision of OPT, they decided it kills two birds with one stone. No harm to schools that'd lose lots of business from international students, especially Hillsboro Aviation and Bristow Academy, lots of Europeans doing heli training over there, plus no big changes in regulations, making up new visa class or category.
You probably can do another F1 associate degree, but it ain't cheap, and won't get credit (READ DISCOUNT on fees) for your CPL/IR. Also, no idea how dicey it'd be trying to work legally OFF CAMPUS, as it's not normally allowed, unless in unexpected hardship etc, the clauses. It'd all have to be applied for.
I don't see a point trying it that way. I only pointed out that it could be done via college with flight school links, as there, it'd be your 'on campus' as well, where you do part of your studies, practical flying. It's nowhere near sure deal for you.
USA isn't, in general.
Your comments about 'marrying an US gal' etc, that you don't fancy that. Ehrm, for Europeans or Asians, American women are different sort. If not a fake papers marriage (for which you'd have to pay a lot), you just aren't likely to do it just like that anyway. Good.
SH, you're definitely not eligible for post-J1 F1, as you have more than +-PPL.
Go ahead, if you believe Delta that they'd sort H-3 for you. F1 could only be done with extra cost for fees, for associate degree.
Enough on that. I see it very bleak you'd get past anywhere beyond your CFI/I and leisure flying/hourbuilding in the US should you wish so, paid out of your pocket, legally. At least the way you imagine it.
If you did your research properly regarding work/instructing option after finishing training, and looked into the (NOW PHASED OUT) aviation J-1 visa, you'd know.
You didn't even know you can change your schools on M1 or get another extension at same school!!
There are 8 (IIRC) schools, mostly fixed wing, two that do both rotary and FW and one only rotary (Bristow Academy) that used to be able to issue DS-2019 form to apply for J1 visa. That'd give you two years' worth of training and instructing (IF hired) at same or other US school. Since some US govt agencies didn't want to administer J1 for aviation, the other didn't want it, so they cancelled it.
Couple big schools' bosses got together and lobbied for some sort of replacement.
Initially, the 'news' said *new kind of visa M1 for work as well* - which we know didn't mean anything.
The govt agencies decided to consider 0/PPL-CPL/IR/CFI programme equivalent to academic studies, with OPT (up to 1 year work authorisation at the end of training, but with more restrictions regarding paperwork than previous J1).
So, the F1 one can now get in past J1 schools, where you DO NOT do any academic, ie associate degree or more, technically, but do part 141 ground and flight training, blah blah, IS NOT same as other F1.
Since there is the provision of OPT, they decided it kills two birds with one stone. No harm to schools that'd lose lots of business from international students, especially Hillsboro Aviation and Bristow Academy, lots of Europeans doing heli training over there, plus no big changes in regulations, making up new visa class or category.
You probably can do another F1 associate degree, but it ain't cheap, and won't get credit (READ DISCOUNT on fees) for your CPL/IR. Also, no idea how dicey it'd be trying to work legally OFF CAMPUS, as it's not normally allowed, unless in unexpected hardship etc, the clauses. It'd all have to be applied for.
I don't see a point trying it that way. I only pointed out that it could be done via college with flight school links, as there, it'd be your 'on campus' as well, where you do part of your studies, practical flying. It's nowhere near sure deal for you.
USA isn't, in general.
Your comments about 'marrying an US gal' etc, that you don't fancy that. Ehrm, for Europeans or Asians, American women are different sort. If not a fake papers marriage (for which you'd have to pay a lot), you just aren't likely to do it just like that anyway. Good.
SH, you're definitely not eligible for post-J1 F1, as you have more than +-PPL.
Go ahead, if you believe Delta that they'd sort H-3 for you. F1 could only be done with extra cost for fees, for associate degree.
Enough on that. I see it very bleak you'd get past anywhere beyond your CFI/I and leisure flying/hourbuilding in the US should you wish so, paid out of your pocket, legally. At least the way you imagine it.
Joined: Apr 2010
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From: PlanetEarth
I have been to a Delta sales pitch in the UK, and to be honest I found them to give a lot of "vague" promises - like there is always a chance that things will change, and you can instruct with us, but we can't promise you anything now!
"but we are the best and biggest (+one of the most expensive schools)"
But once you give your money, and you start your course, all those promises will turn to nothing. From what they said, you could during a degree, work for them for "free" - however this would have to be during a degree course I think of 4 years (Possible this fact is not 100%, my memory not 100% just now on this)
But again this was followed by BS like " but we are number one flight school in US, so we will maybe get new rules soon, (or next year)"
Now if you are young and dont have to much experience in life and business, you might believe such BS! But the truth is that they will tell you ANYTHING to seal the deal, get your business, your money!
But on the paper you sign, they will not PROMISE YOU ANYTHING with regards to work, because they legally can't employ you!
(Actually with regards to investments in the US, you don't need 1mill $, around $100.000 is enough, as long as it is not in property, and that within 12 months you will employ 1 or 2 US citizens + you spend $10.000 on a US immigration lawyer every year, not knowing 100% sure if you get a visa for your next year of business. They want to see that you can sustain yourself, and will be providing work for US citizens, should increase every year, until you at least employ 3 - 10 US citizens. Anyway that is off topic, nobody here is going to go that way anyway, furthermore such a visa would be specific for one business, you could not part time work as a flight instructor anyway.
Also from what I understand, all US FO programs, are for US citizents/green card holders ONLY!
The Delta promise you an interview, but they can NOT provide you the visa you need, unless you take a degree program. It is easy to promise you an interview, but it is you who have to make sure you qualify for the correct visa to work in the USA, not Delta Ac., so you can pass an interview, but not get the job because you do not have the correct visa, and you can not obtain this.
"but we are the best and biggest (+one of the most expensive schools)"
But once you give your money, and you start your course, all those promises will turn to nothing. From what they said, you could during a degree, work for them for "free" - however this would have to be during a degree course I think of 4 years (Possible this fact is not 100%, my memory not 100% just now on this)
But again this was followed by BS like " but we are number one flight school in US, so we will maybe get new rules soon, (or next year)"
Now if you are young and dont have to much experience in life and business, you might believe such BS! But the truth is that they will tell you ANYTHING to seal the deal, get your business, your money!
But on the paper you sign, they will not PROMISE YOU ANYTHING with regards to work, because they legally can't employ you!
(Actually with regards to investments in the US, you don't need 1mill $, around $100.000 is enough, as long as it is not in property, and that within 12 months you will employ 1 or 2 US citizens + you spend $10.000 on a US immigration lawyer every year, not knowing 100% sure if you get a visa for your next year of business. They want to see that you can sustain yourself, and will be providing work for US citizens, should increase every year, until you at least employ 3 - 10 US citizens. Anyway that is off topic, nobody here is going to go that way anyway, furthermore such a visa would be specific for one business, you could not part time work as a flight instructor anyway.
Also from what I understand, all US FO programs, are for US citizents/green card holders ONLY!
The Delta promise you an interview, but they can NOT provide you the visa you need, unless you take a degree program. It is easy to promise you an interview, but it is you who have to make sure you qualify for the correct visa to work in the USA, not Delta Ac., so you can pass an interview, but not get the job because you do not have the correct visa, and you can not obtain this.
Joined: Nov 1999
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I have been to a Delta sales pitch in the UK, and to be honest I found them to give a lot of "vague" promises - like there is always a chance that things will change, and you can instruct with us, but we can't promise you anything now!
But on the paper you sign, they will not PROMISE YOU ANYTHING
It is easy to promise you an interview
Sales pitches are designed to sell a product or service, it is up to the buyer to satisfy themselves that the product or service is something that they want to buy. If it says on the paper you sign (contract?) that they "will not promise you anything" then it is quite likely that they will not promise you anything. If it is a promise you are seeking, then best to keep on looking.
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 94
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From: PlanetEarth
They do make you believe there is a remote chance that they can offer you something they NEVER will.
"Bealzebub" - When they say no other school can, but we (Delta) - because of our reputation might be able to! It gives a person false hope, that will never materialize. And when they got your dollars, they won't care whatever they told you in advance.
Read OP, said he was promised an interview! This would give the OP a glimmer of hope, this is the false promise, to say that NOBODY (no other flight school) else can give him this, because they are no longer able to. (because of new visa restrictions)
The OP is seeking advice and opinions on this forum, that I assume is one of the ways the OP is finding out about the company and the product they are offering. I am simply saying I would not get my hopes up one second to believe that he will have a job with the school after he finishes, unless he takes the degree course. And also then most likely he would probably need to work for free as an instructor while taking his degree.
Delta gives leading information of why they are so great, but some of the information is misleading!
Besides being over priced, the sales reps from Delta was fairly arrogant and full of themselves. $80.000 - $90.000 for a full course! Madness!!! Not only was they arrogant, but really amateurs coming unprepared for their failed sales pitch.
Imagine coming to a full time ATPL theory course, and not knowing that all the pilots already had their PPL! Then start talking about how good FAA pilots was compared to JAA pilots!
When asked direct questions about the instructor jobs, they avoided a direct clear answer - however everyone on these forums knows that instructing in the US is not easy now, with so many unemployed pilots - US pilots will always have priority unless its JAA training.
Then they started talking about that maybe maybe next few months, there would be a visa so foreigners could stay and instruct for 12 - 18 months, and because of their government connection, they would be the first to be approved.
However with todays internet information we all can find out that this is all BS by Delta flight school, however for someone who believes in the dream, it takes time and effort to investigate these things, and it is not always easy to find an easy answer. Fact is easy though - instructing for long period in the USA is not easy anymore, regardless of what any flight school will tell you. Unless of course you work for free, opps. you can not get housing or food either, as this is considered as pay! So it ends up P2F - if you actually get some offer, hmm. legally!
Supply and demand, the only 100% promise Delta gave, was that in a degree program, you would have a visa that would allow you to instruct with them, if they needed you and wanted you - which according to another previous student there from Italy was highly unlikely in the current climate of employment!
My message refers to the OP, not saying Delta is bad, just don't like companies that belittle other's, and make themselves look like they are the great industry standard for aviation in the USA - because they claim to be connected to Delta Airlines. Unless you are a US citizen being connected to Delta Airlines means 0 -
Colgan Airlines is also connected to Delta Airlines, and we all saw their training standards and crew treatment standards, and the results of these standards. So the association itself does not mean much, as no foreigner is ever considered for Delta Airlines, unless he becomes US citizen or gets a green card.
Delta flight school uses the name/brand and association they have with Delta Airlines, to give confidence for students to choose them - however Delta flight school is NOT Delta Airlines, Colgan Air is NOT Delta Airlines.
"Bealzebub" - When they say no other school can, but we (Delta) - because of our reputation might be able to! It gives a person false hope, that will never materialize. And when they got your dollars, they won't care whatever they told you in advance.
Read OP, said he was promised an interview! This would give the OP a glimmer of hope, this is the false promise, to say that NOBODY (no other flight school) else can give him this, because they are no longer able to. (because of new visa restrictions)
The OP is seeking advice and opinions on this forum, that I assume is one of the ways the OP is finding out about the company and the product they are offering. I am simply saying I would not get my hopes up one second to believe that he will have a job with the school after he finishes, unless he takes the degree course. And also then most likely he would probably need to work for free as an instructor while taking his degree.
Delta gives leading information of why they are so great, but some of the information is misleading!
Besides being over priced, the sales reps from Delta was fairly arrogant and full of themselves. $80.000 - $90.000 for a full course! Madness!!! Not only was they arrogant, but really amateurs coming unprepared for their failed sales pitch.
Imagine coming to a full time ATPL theory course, and not knowing that all the pilots already had their PPL! Then start talking about how good FAA pilots was compared to JAA pilots!
When asked direct questions about the instructor jobs, they avoided a direct clear answer - however everyone on these forums knows that instructing in the US is not easy now, with so many unemployed pilots - US pilots will always have priority unless its JAA training.
Then they started talking about that maybe maybe next few months, there would be a visa so foreigners could stay and instruct for 12 - 18 months, and because of their government connection, they would be the first to be approved.
However with todays internet information we all can find out that this is all BS by Delta flight school, however for someone who believes in the dream, it takes time and effort to investigate these things, and it is not always easy to find an easy answer. Fact is easy though - instructing for long period in the USA is not easy anymore, regardless of what any flight school will tell you. Unless of course you work for free, opps. you can not get housing or food either, as this is considered as pay! So it ends up P2F - if you actually get some offer, hmm. legally!
Supply and demand, the only 100% promise Delta gave, was that in a degree program, you would have a visa that would allow you to instruct with them, if they needed you and wanted you - which according to another previous student there from Italy was highly unlikely in the current climate of employment!
My message refers to the OP, not saying Delta is bad, just don't like companies that belittle other's, and make themselves look like they are the great industry standard for aviation in the USA - because they claim to be connected to Delta Airlines. Unless you are a US citizen being connected to Delta Airlines means 0 -
Colgan Airlines is also connected to Delta Airlines, and we all saw their training standards and crew treatment standards, and the results of these standards. So the association itself does not mean much, as no foreigner is ever considered for Delta Airlines, unless he becomes US citizen or gets a green card.
Delta flight school uses the name/brand and association they have with Delta Airlines, to give confidence for students to choose them - however Delta flight school is NOT Delta Airlines, Colgan Air is NOT Delta Airlines.
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 889
Likes: 0
From: UK, US, now more ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀
I didn't mention that possibility of sorting OPT after M1 as you already left US and no idea if it could be added, say, you stay another 3-6 months, that'd give you only couple months max, IF, it's possible to count past M1 visa, I didn't study it that much.
The fact is, you'd have to sort it before the visa expiry, in the US, and the possible time isn't really worth the hassle, cost and won't serve the objective.
The OPT during/after F1, is after at least 1 academic year of study, when you could work FT (and during vacations), else PT.
I wouldn't bother with any of this, for fixed wing flying.
See Magic's comment above. Delta is expensive. Just like Embry-Riddle. That doesn't mean that they don't get business in. Just maybe not more cost-conscious people with not so deep pockets and looking for 'brand' with high hopes.
Anyway, why couldn't you have done some CFI ground when nearing your CPL/IR end? part 61.183 and 185 are fairly clear. Not so formal 'FI module' like in Europe or elsewhere. Or did you school expect you to do finish CPL and only then do anything about CFI? That'd be raking in money from the flight time..
I know, too late..
The fact is, you'd have to sort it before the visa expiry, in the US, and the possible time isn't really worth the hassle, cost and won't serve the objective.
The OPT during/after F1, is after at least 1 academic year of study, when you could work FT (and during vacations), else PT.
I wouldn't bother with any of this, for fixed wing flying.
See Magic's comment above. Delta is expensive. Just like Embry-Riddle. That doesn't mean that they don't get business in. Just maybe not more cost-conscious people with not so deep pockets and looking for 'brand' with high hopes.
Anyway, why couldn't you have done some CFI ground when nearing your CPL/IR end? part 61.183 and 185 are fairly clear. Not so formal 'FI module' like in Europe or elsewhere. Or did you school expect you to do finish CPL and only then do anything about CFI? That'd be raking in money from the flight time..
I know, too late..
Last edited by MartinCh; 24th July 2010 at 21:08.
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
From: Austria
USA Flight School: please give me an advice
Hi everybody,
I am an Italian Pilot. I have the JAA-PPL A and the FAA validation.
Next summer I'd like to go to USA to do the instrument rating.
I know that I need to find a flight school that is in the SEVIS list to get the VISA.
Could you help me to find out the best flight schools in USA to do the FAA IR?
Please could you advice me some good reliable flight schools in USA?
Thank you
I am an Italian Pilot. I have the JAA-PPL A and the FAA validation.
Next summer I'd like to go to USA to do the instrument rating.
I know that I need to find a flight school that is in the SEVIS list to get the VISA.
Could you help me to find out the best flight schools in USA to do the FAA IR?
Please could you advice me some good reliable flight schools in USA?
Thank you
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
From: The Earth
From reading this board, I can conclude that these 2 are one of the best flight schools for EU citizens whishing to follow JAA training in the US.
Flight Training in Florida
European Flight Training - Quality JAA Pilot Flight Training
Flight Training in Florida
European Flight Training - Quality JAA Pilot Flight Training
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
From: UK
USA Flight School Recommendations, Please
I am looking at funding my son for his CPL, ME, IR in the US. He is British, and despite extensive Internet research, we are having great difficulty identifying a good school. All the comments we find on various forums are mostly negative about the various schools we have considered, but there must be some good schools out there. Can you help with positive advice, guys?
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,175
Likes: 0
From: -
Skymates in Texas! I know many guys who studied there and some of them are currently flying for Ryanair.
It isn't expensive at all and he can also obtain a EASA CPL and then do the EASA IR conversion at Biggin Hill.
The fleet is nice, well mantained and he will hardly have trouble in booking one.
JAA/EASA Courses « Skymates
I know the owner, who is Italian, and I can tell you that he is very kind and always helpful. This school is gonna be my choice!
It isn't expensive at all and he can also obtain a EASA CPL and then do the EASA IR conversion at Biggin Hill.
The fleet is nice, well mantained and he will hardly have trouble in booking one.
JAA/EASA Courses « Skymates
I know the owner, who is Italian, and I can tell you that he is very kind and always helpful. This school is gonna be my choice!
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 1,071
Likes: 0
From: EGYD
And this proves the internet because the above post is the first positive post I've ever read about Skymates.
Don't read any forums - go visit. It might cost you a thousand pounds - but it will be obvious which school you will want to train at. You'll easily save that money if you go to one of the good schools.
Don't read any forums - go visit. It might cost you a thousand pounds - but it will be obvious which school you will want to train at. You'll easily save that money if you go to one of the good schools.
Last edited by BigGrecian; 15th January 2013 at 23:25.
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,175
Likes: 0
From: -
BigGrecian is totally correct! I have to agree with him. The best thing is taking your son there and give a look personally.
As to good and bad posts about Skymates, I can only say that it is very popular among Italians and many of them are very satisfied with their choice.
I had some chats with the owner who personally offered his help to me. So far I have only heard good reviews about Skymates.
But I repeat, if you can afford to visit a school you'd like to study at, first visit it!
As to good and bad posts about Skymates, I can only say that it is very popular among Italians and many of them are very satisfied with their choice.
I had some chats with the owner who personally offered his help to me. So far I have only heard good reviews about Skymates.
But I repeat, if you can afford to visit a school you'd like to study at, first visit it!
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 237
Likes: 0
From: The Netherlands
ParisAir
Yes, go and visit Florida for sure, before you make a choice.
Paris Air in Vero Beach I would pay a visit.
I am not working there, but did training there, and was very pleased.
Good luck and have lots of fun !
Paris Air in Vero Beach I would pay a visit.
I am not working there, but did training there, and was very pleased.
Good luck and have lots of fun !
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,175
Likes: 0
From: -
Also, I would say to visit California!
American Aviation Academy in San Diego and Long Beach Flying Club in Long Beach. The second one is not a flight school but a flying club where your son can get his licence at lower prices.
I don't know how the theory part works but I think he will have to study on his own. As to flight instructors, all of them are freelancers there. I might be wrong though.
American Aviation Academy in San Diego and Long Beach Flying Club in Long Beach. The second one is not a flight school but a flying club where your son can get his licence at lower prices.
I don't know how the theory part works but I think he will have to study on his own. As to flight instructors, all of them are freelancers there. I might be wrong though.
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 118
Likes: 2
From: USA
Best USA Flight school
Could someone tell which is the best flight school in the USA other then Embry Riddle to become a commercial airline pilot? I've looked online and found many conflicting reports, where is best? Thanks.
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
From: London
Seeking a good Flight School / USA
Hello all::
Seeking to get my FAA IR and CPL sorted in one combined course within the US and within a relatively short period.
I have an FAA PPL (since 1991) with many hours already logged as PIC / SEL.
Any advice and pointers to a decent, established school that will be able to meet my needs and offer student visa assistance, accommodation and all examinations/books and admin included, would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance for any and all referrals.
Seeking to get my FAA IR and CPL sorted in one combined course within the US and within a relatively short period.
I have an FAA PPL (since 1991) with many hours already logged as PIC / SEL.
Any advice and pointers to a decent, established school that will be able to meet my needs and offer student visa assistance, accommodation and all examinations/books and admin included, would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance for any and all referrals.
Joined: Feb 2025
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
From: Ahmedabad, India
Flight school in the USA
Greetings,
I am Raag from India and I wish to enrol myself in a flight school in the USA by Fall of this year. Seeking guidance for which school I should opt for since ultimate goal is to fly in India and get my FAA license converted to a DGCA one.
Thanks in advance.
I am Raag from India and I wish to enrol myself in a flight school in the USA by Fall of this year. Seeking guidance for which school I should opt for since ultimate goal is to fly in India and get my FAA license converted to a DGCA one.
Thanks in advance.