MCC First??

[EYZ]

Hi,

Can you complete MCC training before you have completed your CPL/IR Check ride, is that legal?

Thanks for your thoughts,

EYZ

[Nashers]

nope not in the uk at least.

infact you cant even do your mcc untill you have the paperwork in your hand (ie licence issued with all ratings after sending it off to the caa).

[wheelbrace]

Nashers - are you sure about that? I understand you have to have a valid IR - (not necessarily current) attached to your valid PPL or CPL.

It would be worth checking with FCL at the Gatwick aquarium or one of the providers such as:

CRM Aviation Europe Ltd.

[maxdrypower]

Yeh you can start mcc without the licence , they will normally ask for copy of pass certificates though but they dont require licence to be issued .
Istarted my mcc the day after my IR

[dwshimoda]

Nashers,

That's incorrect.

EYZ - presumably you are at the stage of the checkride, so that should suffice - just check with your MCC provider. They may ask for evidence, and they may withhold your MCC certificate until you pass the IR, but you can start the course. EDIT: I see you are based in AUS - I can't answer for AUS, but the above info is good for the UK.

DW.

[BillieBob]

If UK training providers are taking on MCC students who do not hold an IR, they are doing so without the knowledge or approval of the CAA. The TRTO that I worked for until recently was taken to task by their CAA inspector for doing just that. JAR-FCL states that the MCC course is for PPL/IR or CPL/IR holders and the CAA take that to mean that you must have been issued with the rating before starting the course.

[Nashers]

when i did my mcc i was basicly told not to bother turning up unless i had my licence issued and in my hand with me.

a friend of mine who wanted to do his mcc last month got turned away from his start day, as the post had taken their time therefore he did not have his paperwork with him. they could not put him on the next course so he starts tomorrow at another school.

[wheelbrace]

LAS reference

Section F 10.1 states:

The course is intended to provide MCC training in two
circumstances:
(i) for students attending an ATP integrated course in
accordance with the aim of that course;
(ii) for PPL/IR or CPL/IR holders, who have not
graduated from an ATP integrated course but who
wish to obtain an initial type rating on a multi-pilot
aircraft.

As I understand the situation, you are looking at para. (ii) which states 'holders' ie passed, approved and paperwork in your grubby.

[BillieBob]

Actually no, I was looking at JAR-FCL 1.261(d)(1), from which the LASORS entry has been copied. It is always better to consult the source document as LASORS has often proved inaccurate. In this case however, apart from omitting the references, they seem to have got it about right.

[Flighttime3]

I know from Germany that the authority had accept as well students they donīt had finished their IR rating, and they got also the certificate. I can remember myself that I got the information from the LBA that I only need a PPL, if it make sense without IR is another story..

[moggiee]

There are basically 3 scenarios which can apply.

1) Integrated students can do the MCC as soon as they have passed the skills tests as long as the MCC is done as part of their integrated course.

2) Someone who has had the IR added to their licence can do it any time - even if it has subsequently expired.

3) Modular students must not commence the MCC course until the licence has come back from the CAA with the IR added to it. Pass certificates are not enough, nor is the licence being "at the CAA" - it has to be back in the holders possession.

It was hinted to me by an ops inspector that case 3) was being applied because some JAA IRs were a bit iffy and they might not accept them in the UK. I won't mention Greece by name but......................................

If you don't satisfy one of the 3 scenarios above then your MCC may not be accepted as valid by the CAA. Potentially Ģ1,500 - Ģ4,000 down the toilet.