OAA employment statistics
Join Date: Jul 2002
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"BA only take low houred guys from integrated courses only as they have had significant numbers of training failures from modular candidates."
I have been in aviation over 10 years and BA in that time have never taken low hour modular pilots. I believe that the case talked about showed that modular students did worse in initial type ratings than pre-selected and monitored intergated students who had completed JOC. At that time JOC courses comprised of 50 hours in a jet sim using BA SOP's. So no surprise at the result.
Remember Oxford is a buisness they are here to make money and they will tell you what you want to hear to pay the cash. And if you go to Ryan Air, who take large amounts of modular pilots, it is not about where you trained it is about who can pay the cash.
I have been in aviation over 10 years and BA in that time have never taken low hour modular pilots. I believe that the case talked about showed that modular students did worse in initial type ratings than pre-selected and monitored intergated students who had completed JOC. At that time JOC courses comprised of 50 hours in a jet sim using BA SOP's. So no surprise at the result.
Remember Oxford is a buisness they are here to make money and they will tell you what you want to hear to pay the cash. And if you go to Ryan Air, who take large amounts of modular pilots, it is not about where you trained it is about who can pay the cash.
Join Date: Jun 2006
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Everyone's employer is a business, so can we presume they all tell people what they want to hear in order to get custom? Oxford publish their stats in bad times as well as good and not many FTOs have the balls to face that double edged sword. As far as I can tell, they are just raw numbers and not enough else to get an in depth understanding of what they mean. I see neither spin nor interpretation in the report. The spinning occurs on Pprune with OAA fans spinning one way and detractors the other. The truth probably lays somewhere in the middle.
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ahah, clanger is right.
this market is a joke anyway!
everybody bitch , "modular, not modular?", and bla bla bla.
then we have kids paying hours with dad's money
get yourself a real job, be a doctor or a dentist or antyhing else, and dont mess with aviation.
let aviation for the real pilots!
statistic are joke in aviation as well.they just want you to invest money in their school which will be bust soon.
this market is a joke anyway!
everybody bitch , "modular, not modular?", and bla bla bla.
then we have kids paying hours with dad's money
get yourself a real job, be a doctor or a dentist or antyhing else, and dont mess with aviation.
let aviation for the real pilots!
statistic are joke in aviation as well.they just want you to invest money in their school which will be bust soon.
Join Date: Mar 2007
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forgot one tpe of student!
Clanger, you forgot one type of student. Those who did absolutely no revision, burned holes in the sky, took every opportunity to go out drinking in Arizona with both hands. But.........
Still passed, still got through and still got a job.
Got to be good to be gash!
OAA Rules!
Still passed, still got through and still got a job.
Got to be good to be gash!
OAA Rules!
Join Date: Feb 2009
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Modular vs. Integrated
Years ago, when I was in what was laughingly called "the Mob", headed by HRH, we instructed using the DEER system - Demonstration, Explanation, Emulation and Repetition. The point was you repeated it ad nauseum until you "got it".
Seems to me that's relevant in the Modular/Integrated debate - if you do something often, and frequently, enough, you'll normally "get it" sooner or later. That has always seemed a problem with Modular - you have long spells of not training while you save up the shekels for the next part of the course. Now it may be that in the "down time", you can recall it all, but I suspect that some sizeable percentage of the first part of the next course you take is made up by remembering what you've forgotten in the last part of the last course.
Not to say that you finish off a worse driver with modular - just that its easier to be be a better pilot if you do integrated as you do the whole course in a consistent manner and to a reasonable time-scale.
Finally somebody made a comment about "pay to fly" types and Airbussi. Never understood this one. You all pay for your flight training, unless you sign on the line with HRH, and most of you nowadays also pay for type rating, particularly if you go to Ryanair who seem to be the only game in town nowadays.
So you are all well in the hole anyway, so what's the problem with paying a bit more for Line Training? Putting the philosophy aside (you as very junior cadet pilots can't sort out the pay woes of a whole industry), its actually the best and most effective money you spend.
Seems to me that all the training costs and type rating costs are sunk already, so your choice is
1. spend more to get really cheap hours, and jet and airline time in your logbook and MAYBE get a job offer, but at least get some superb experience in the meantime. So give Eagle jet 10K Euros for 500 hours in a 737 in an airline environment - its way more useful than spending 300 stg/hour in a Seneca with your friendly FTO, or
2. alternatively, you say screw it, flip burgers and wait to see if Ryanair will really give you a job when you pass the TR.
Seems to me its a no brainer - give Eagle Jet a call - but maybe its more subtle than that...http://static.pprune.org/images/smilies/confused.gif
Fogey
Seems to me that's relevant in the Modular/Integrated debate - if you do something often, and frequently, enough, you'll normally "get it" sooner or later. That has always seemed a problem with Modular - you have long spells of not training while you save up the shekels for the next part of the course. Now it may be that in the "down time", you can recall it all, but I suspect that some sizeable percentage of the first part of the next course you take is made up by remembering what you've forgotten in the last part of the last course.
Not to say that you finish off a worse driver with modular - just that its easier to be be a better pilot if you do integrated as you do the whole course in a consistent manner and to a reasonable time-scale.
Finally somebody made a comment about "pay to fly" types and Airbussi. Never understood this one. You all pay for your flight training, unless you sign on the line with HRH, and most of you nowadays also pay for type rating, particularly if you go to Ryanair who seem to be the only game in town nowadays.
So you are all well in the hole anyway, so what's the problem with paying a bit more for Line Training? Putting the philosophy aside (you as very junior cadet pilots can't sort out the pay woes of a whole industry), its actually the best and most effective money you spend.
Seems to me that all the training costs and type rating costs are sunk already, so your choice is
1. spend more to get really cheap hours, and jet and airline time in your logbook and MAYBE get a job offer, but at least get some superb experience in the meantime. So give Eagle jet 10K Euros for 500 hours in a 737 in an airline environment - its way more useful than spending 300 stg/hour in a Seneca with your friendly FTO, or
2. alternatively, you say screw it, flip burgers and wait to see if Ryanair will really give you a job when you pass the TR.
Seems to me its a no brainer - give Eagle Jet a call - but maybe its more subtle than that...http://static.pprune.org/images/smilies/confused.gif
Fogey
