Employment in Canada
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Join Date: Oct 2000
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GA Jobs in Australia or Canada
Can anyone tell me wether there is a realistic chance to get a job in general aviation in Australia or Canada?
I have German ATP (A2), Piper- and Cessna series, KingAir and about 350hrs only!
Thank you in andvance!
I have German ATP (A2), Piper- and Cessna series, KingAir and about 350hrs only!
Thank you in andvance!
PPRuNe Handmaiden
I honestly can't speak for the Canadian scene but it is always a challenge getting your first job in Oz. Your language quals may help with the scenic flying in the Kimberley (WA) or Kakadu (NT). I don't know if they would let you fly a Kingair on 350 hours. In fact, I doubt it. Most people in Oz start on C206's etc or instructing. As usual, there are more pilots than jobs in Australia.
Hardest part is emigrating. Check out the <a href="http://www.dfat.gov.au" target="_blank">Dept of Foreign Affairs webby</a> for info.
You would also have to convert your license over.
The CASA website has the info.
Good luck
Hardest part is emigrating. Check out the <a href="http://www.dfat.gov.au" target="_blank">Dept of Foreign Affairs webby</a> for info.
You would also have to convert your license over.
The CASA website has the info.
Good luck
Join Date: Jan 2001
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The guys in the Kimberleys, or atleast Slingair require 500hours min, and 20 hours on Cessna 200 series aircraft.
GA over here in OZ is a very difficult industry to break into. But I would agree that speaking another language may help especially in Kununurra (Kimberleys) as there operation is mainly scenic flights over the region. At the moment there are hundreds of unemployeed pilots around looking for work. I've been lucky enough to find some work after driving all around the country, and taking 1 year to do so. To get work you must be on the door step knocking on the doors.
You will not be able to work into a job. And the King Air time is of no use to you for at least a couple of years at best!
GA is a hard road in Australia.
Just telling it as it is....
Best of luck with your decision
GA over here in OZ is a very difficult industry to break into. But I would agree that speaking another language may help especially in Kununurra (Kimberleys) as there operation is mainly scenic flights over the region. At the moment there are hundreds of unemployeed pilots around looking for work. I've been lucky enough to find some work after driving all around the country, and taking 1 year to do so. To get work you must be on the door step knocking on the doors.
You will not be able to work into a job. And the King Air time is of no use to you for at least a couple of years at best!
GA is a hard road in Australia.
Just telling it as it is....
Best of luck with your decision
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Fluxvalve:
Job opportunities in Canada are like the rest of the world now. There are a lot of high time pilots looking, low time pilots who really get out and search usually can get a job. The problem in getting started is the low pay. Flight instruction is one way to get started, however once again low pay.
As to coming to Canada we are a liberal mindset governed Country with real morons in charge of immigration, and of course we are multi-cultural.
The best way to enter Canada would to paint yourself a dark color and just show up at the airport with no I.D. and claim refuge status. It would be helpful to have a criminal or terrorist background and claim you will be persecuted if you are returned to your place of origion.
Now for some serious advice. Do not feel you have " only " 350 hours. The truth is that with your a/c types you have a good start so do not feel you need to down play your time.
I have found many, many pilots with your time that are just terrific pilots , the most important thing that is needed is a professional attitude.
All the Best.
................
The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no.
Job opportunities in Canada are like the rest of the world now. There are a lot of high time pilots looking, low time pilots who really get out and search usually can get a job. The problem in getting started is the low pay. Flight instruction is one way to get started, however once again low pay.
As to coming to Canada we are a liberal mindset governed Country with real morons in charge of immigration, and of course we are multi-cultural.
The best way to enter Canada would to paint yourself a dark color and just show up at the airport with no I.D. and claim refuge status. It would be helpful to have a criminal or terrorist background and claim you will be persecuted if you are returned to your place of origion.
Now for some serious advice. Do not feel you have " only " 350 hours. The truth is that with your a/c types you have a good start so do not feel you need to down play your time.
I have found many, many pilots with your time that are just terrific pilots , the most important thing that is needed is a professional attitude.
All the Best.
................
The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no.
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Employment in Canada
I have heard from many flight schools that there is no time better than now to become a pilot and its easy to fin a high paying job and blah blah blah... I know this is all false for a pilot who has no exp.
any ways this is the most down to earth quote I've heard so far... how accurate is it?
"Human Resources Development Canada rates employment prospects in this field as "Good", since employment opportunities are above average and earnings are well above average. Over the next five years, this outlook is not expected to change, as the number of job openings is expected to be matched by the number of qualified job seekers."
any ways this is the most down to earth quote I've heard so far... how accurate is it?
"Human Resources Development Canada rates employment prospects in this field as "Good", since employment opportunities are above average and earnings are well above average. Over the next five years, this outlook is not expected to change, as the number of job openings is expected to be matched by the number of qualified job seekers."
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calgary,
I have seen you post a few times on this site and it seems to me that you are quite concerned with respect to finding a job after you graduate from Mount Royal. And rightly so.
I can tell you what I have experienced in the short time I have been in the aviation industry, and from what I have seen and heard from acquaintances in the industry. (Please remember that this is only my opinion and should be taken cautiously as with any advice)
You probably already know that finding that first flying job is next to impossible but what you should also know is that finding that second, third, and even fourth job can be equally tough, especially in Canada. I know of several people that have 1500 hours with ATPL and still can't find a job outside of what they are currently doing. For example, one individual has almost 2000 hrs of instructing time (some multi-IFR instruction) and can't find a right seat in any charter outfit no matter how hard he tries. Another individual has over 2000 hours on floats (single) yet he still can't find work in the winter months.
Some people say that because Air Canada is hiring that things are picking up. What they seem to forget is that there are still hundreds of pilots still unemployed from the demise of Canada 3000 (I know one of them -- Airbus type rated -- still unemployed). The fact remains that airlines are becoming leaner, more streamlined operations which means less pilots for the time being. Although Air Canada is hiring once again the hiring is limited and you must remember that they are still bleeding a ton of money indicating that they could very well turn around after their next shareholders meeting and start cutting once again. As for the charter and bush guys, I have heard they are toughing it out and lay-offs are probably equal to new hires.
This all menas that there are hundreds of qualified pilots out there for each available job (so don't believe the gov.ca website --see below).
With that said, I still believe that if you really want to pursue a career in aviation, it can be done. Your dedication and commitment must be unrelenting. You must live, eat and sleep aviation. Patience will be more than a virtue. Imagine the hardest thing you've ever done to this point in your life and multiply it by 100. Don't believe the sales people (ie: CFI's) who say that the job will come right after you do this or that rating. If your not prepared, this industry will suck you in, chew you up and spit you back out.
As for your first job, networking is key. Treat everyone you meet with the utmost respect and never turn down an offer even if its to build a hangar for someone. It is that someone who will get you into a plane. Oppurtunities reveal themselves in the oddest places and circumstances, when you are least expecting it. Forget about sending out resumes from home, show up in person ready to work.
I'm sorry if I sound like the rest of the nay-sayers on this site. I don't mean to. I just want you to be prepared for the difficult journey that lies ahead of you. You can succeed if you work at it like you've never worked at anything before.
With regards to the job outlook from the government -- ask yourself how many times the government has ever gotten anything right? Nobody, and I mean nobody can predict the future.
If you're wondering about me, I got lucky once (yes it does happen) outside of Canada, but lost the dream job before I even started (9/11). I am now working outside of the industry for financial reasons and because I'm really not sure if I have the kind of dedication, commitment, and will to start over again.
Hope this helps a bit
Aviatter
I have seen you post a few times on this site and it seems to me that you are quite concerned with respect to finding a job after you graduate from Mount Royal. And rightly so.
I can tell you what I have experienced in the short time I have been in the aviation industry, and from what I have seen and heard from acquaintances in the industry. (Please remember that this is only my opinion and should be taken cautiously as with any advice)
You probably already know that finding that first flying job is next to impossible but what you should also know is that finding that second, third, and even fourth job can be equally tough, especially in Canada. I know of several people that have 1500 hours with ATPL and still can't find a job outside of what they are currently doing. For example, one individual has almost 2000 hrs of instructing time (some multi-IFR instruction) and can't find a right seat in any charter outfit no matter how hard he tries. Another individual has over 2000 hours on floats (single) yet he still can't find work in the winter months.
Some people say that because Air Canada is hiring that things are picking up. What they seem to forget is that there are still hundreds of pilots still unemployed from the demise of Canada 3000 (I know one of them -- Airbus type rated -- still unemployed). The fact remains that airlines are becoming leaner, more streamlined operations which means less pilots for the time being. Although Air Canada is hiring once again the hiring is limited and you must remember that they are still bleeding a ton of money indicating that they could very well turn around after their next shareholders meeting and start cutting once again. As for the charter and bush guys, I have heard they are toughing it out and lay-offs are probably equal to new hires.
This all menas that there are hundreds of qualified pilots out there for each available job (so don't believe the gov.ca website --see below).
With that said, I still believe that if you really want to pursue a career in aviation, it can be done. Your dedication and commitment must be unrelenting. You must live, eat and sleep aviation. Patience will be more than a virtue. Imagine the hardest thing you've ever done to this point in your life and multiply it by 100. Don't believe the sales people (ie: CFI's) who say that the job will come right after you do this or that rating. If your not prepared, this industry will suck you in, chew you up and spit you back out.
As for your first job, networking is key. Treat everyone you meet with the utmost respect and never turn down an offer even if its to build a hangar for someone. It is that someone who will get you into a plane. Oppurtunities reveal themselves in the oddest places and circumstances, when you are least expecting it. Forget about sending out resumes from home, show up in person ready to work.
I'm sorry if I sound like the rest of the nay-sayers on this site. I don't mean to. I just want you to be prepared for the difficult journey that lies ahead of you. You can succeed if you work at it like you've never worked at anything before.
With regards to the job outlook from the government -- ask yourself how many times the government has ever gotten anything right? Nobody, and I mean nobody can predict the future.
If you're wondering about me, I got lucky once (yes it does happen) outside of Canada, but lost the dream job before I even started (9/11). I am now working outside of the industry for financial reasons and because I'm really not sure if I have the kind of dedication, commitment, and will to start over again.
Hope this helps a bit
Aviatter
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Hey, thanks, that answers alot of questions. The reason why I am so concerned is because I have to make the choice of working in an office=( drafting. Or doing something I love, Aviation, I know i can do both but i would way rather pursue a career as a pilot than anything. I know if I do drafting I will easily be able to find a job, because theres lots out there especially in calgary, and the pay is right too. So its a pretty tough decision.
I am willing to do whatever it takes to get a job, even going up to the north in the summer holidays do work for an aviation company doing whatever.
As for the canadian gov. any one who spends 140mil on the health canada website... should be horsewhipped, and as for jean chritien he should be horsewhipped too, makes the liberals look like @$$holes, but i guess no party in canada deserves respect.
So if you can understand why I'm so concerned now. I really appreciate you taking the time to write all that by the way.
I am going toget a medical tomorrow to make sure i can become a pilot as well.(i listen to subwoofers loud) so hopefully ill pass the hearing test
Once again thanks, that answer alot of questions
I am willing to do whatever it takes to get a job, even going up to the north in the summer holidays do work for an aviation company doing whatever.
As for the canadian gov. any one who spends 140mil on the health canada website... should be horsewhipped, and as for jean chritien he should be horsewhipped too, makes the liberals look like @$$holes, but i guess no party in canada deserves respect.
So if you can understand why I'm so concerned now. I really appreciate you taking the time to write all that by the way.
I am going toget a medical tomorrow to make sure i can become a pilot as well.(i listen to subwoofers loud) so hopefully ill pass the hearing test
Once again thanks, that answer alot of questions
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Job oppurtunities in Canada VS UK
I am currently situated in UK, 17, doing ATPL's with Bristol GS. After a family discussion (me, the old mad, and sister) my dad popped the question, do we facny emigratting to Canada! 
My initial reaction was of course JOB oppurtunities for people moving in from the UK.
What is it like in Canada? I quite fancy the sounds of bush flying but I am sure you would have to be in the know of some companies, be the owners best friend type of thing to be able to do that?
I have looked at air canada for a little preview, and they want a university degree and canadian ATPL Seems an allwful lot to ask.
Also, if its not too much to ask, whats the living like over there?
My initial reaction was of course JOB oppurtunities for people moving in from the UK.
What is it like in Canada? I quite fancy the sounds of bush flying but I am sure you would have to be in the know of some companies, be the owners best friend type of thing to be able to do that?
I have looked at air canada for a little preview, and they want a university degree and canadian ATPL
Seems an allwful lot to ask.Also, if its not too much to ask, whats the living like over there?
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I have worked in Canada quite a few years ago but I have been told that it is basically the same now as it was then.
If you are prepared to fly any type anywhere, including up in the arctic circle, then it is reasonably easy to find employment. If however, you are like me and are basically a fussy bastard, only prepared to fly medium/heavy jet equipment in the warm, you will find employment VERY difficult to find.
Many pilots in Canada will fly their whole careers without ever seeing the inside of a nice shiny jet. Many more will never see anything larger than a King Air / Navajo.
Hope this helps.
If you are prepared to fly any type anywhere, including up in the arctic circle, then it is reasonably easy to find employment. If however, you are like me and are basically a fussy bastard, only prepared to fly medium/heavy jet equipment in the warm, you will find employment VERY difficult to find.
Many pilots in Canada will fly their whole careers without ever seeing the inside of a nice shiny jet. Many more will never see anything larger than a King Air / Navajo.
Hope this helps.
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I did want to be an RAF pilot, but got turned down due to Hayfever so I will fly ANYTHING! You say it is relatively easy up north? Can you give me any links/names of any regional carriers up there? That would be great!
P.S - how did you find canada? Good lifestyle?
P.S - how did you find canada? Good lifestyle?
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You say that you would be happy flying anything but will you still be happy flying anything in 20 years time? Believe me, the novelty wears off sooner than you may think. Also, temperatures of -35 C WITHOUT the wind chill factor will grate on you after a while.
I left Canada because I wanted to fly bigger and better equipment and I wanted to earn more cash. Now all I want is cash.....
Salaries in Canada are crap unless you work for Air Canada.
I left Canada because I wanted to fly bigger and better equipment and I wanted to earn more cash. Now all I want is cash.....
Salaries in Canada are crap unless you work for Air Canada.
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GoAround, you also thinking of moving to Canada?
Are there any other jobs in aviation that are well paid? I wouldn't mind a well paid job in aviation, but be able to afford to go recreational flying!
Can you tell I hate this country yet? LOL.
Are there any other jobs in aviation that are well paid? I wouldn't mind a well paid job in aviation, but be able to afford to go recreational flying!
Can you tell I hate this country yet? LOL.
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I occasionally visit the Canadian forum which is really where you should be posting your questions.
It does appear that there are still unemployed float pilots with lots of Mountain and lake experience. A friend of mine works for Forde Lake Air Service and they are over subscribed with guys who have a few thousand hours of bush time. He reckons this will change within a couple of years, so it isn't all bad.
I looked into emigration into Canada. They use a point scoring system. I think you need 70 out of a possible 100 points to be able to work there. The points are awarded for things such as education (what level you have achieved), wether you can speak a second language, and age. A large part of the scoring is down to wether the Canadian authorities recognise your intended profession as being one which is needed in Canada. The Authorities produce a sort of "menu" with all the currently required professions in Canada. Obviously this changes according to immigration needs. I think Pilot figures quite low on the points system now. Anyway you are awarded points for the profession that you wish to persue plus points for the level of training that you needed to obtain the qualification that goes with your profession (e.g CPL/IR). If I remember correctly you also have to have worked as a Pilot for a certain time prior to emmigrating to Canada (It was 18 months related work experience when I looked at it).
It may be possible to emmigrate to Cananda in another capacity if you have another skill, and then look for flying work. I'm not sure on the restrictions on doing this though.
Bill
It does appear that there are still unemployed float pilots with lots of Mountain and lake experience. A friend of mine works for Forde Lake Air Service and they are over subscribed with guys who have a few thousand hours of bush time. He reckons this will change within a couple of years, so it isn't all bad.
I looked into emigration into Canada. They use a point scoring system. I think you need 70 out of a possible 100 points to be able to work there. The points are awarded for things such as education (what level you have achieved), wether you can speak a second language, and age. A large part of the scoring is down to wether the Canadian authorities recognise your intended profession as being one which is needed in Canada. The Authorities produce a sort of "menu" with all the currently required professions in Canada. Obviously this changes according to immigration needs. I think Pilot figures quite low on the points system now. Anyway you are awarded points for the profession that you wish to persue plus points for the level of training that you needed to obtain the qualification that goes with your profession (e.g CPL/IR). If I remember correctly you also have to have worked as a Pilot for a certain time prior to emmigrating to Canada (It was 18 months related work experience when I looked at it).
It may be possible to emmigrate to Cananda in another capacity if you have another skill, and then look for flying work. I'm not sure on the restrictions on doing this though.
Bill
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To give you an idea try looking at www.migrationbureau.com . However do your parents qualify bearing in mind thay bought the subject up? Have they applied for residency or are they too just dipping their toes in the water?
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OBK,
As a Canadian, I can tell you - don't go. It will be career suicide for you. It is most certainly NOT easy to get a job anywhere in Canada, no matter how crappy, except instructing. You can expect to spend a year or so of driving thousands of miles across the country just looking for work. The work you get will likely be "swamping" which is working on the ramp, loading aircraft, cleaning lavs, etc. You can expect to do this for between 6 months and 2 years before you get a chance at right seat. All the while you are paid minimum wage. When you are flying, don't expect much of a payrise, if any. Air Canada is realistically the only decent paying job in Canada. One airline. There are currently hundreds of highly experienced airline pilots unemployed because of Canada 3000's failure.
Only a lucky few make it into Air Canada, the majority face lives flying in very remote communities on small aircraft (great if that's what you want) or just give up.
My recommendation is to stay in the UK. Shame because Canada is a great place to live, but not if you are a pilot.
Lazlo
As a Canadian, I can tell you - don't go. It will be career suicide for you. It is most certainly NOT easy to get a job anywhere in Canada, no matter how crappy, except instructing. You can expect to spend a year or so of driving thousands of miles across the country just looking for work. The work you get will likely be "swamping" which is working on the ramp, loading aircraft, cleaning lavs, etc. You can expect to do this for between 6 months and 2 years before you get a chance at right seat. All the while you are paid minimum wage. When you are flying, don't expect much of a payrise, if any. Air Canada is realistically the only decent paying job in Canada. One airline. There are currently hundreds of highly experienced airline pilots unemployed because of Canada 3000's failure.
Only a lucky few make it into Air Canada, the majority face lives flying in very remote communities on small aircraft (great if that's what you want) or just give up.
My recommendation is to stay in the UK. Shame because Canada is a great place to live, but not if you are a pilot.
Lazlo
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I'm in Canada now and have been flying here for a few years. Definitely if I were a European or had EU passport, I would be in Europe right now! The situation here in Canada is quite bad and very frustrating and discouraging for the new green and experienced pilots. In a nutshell, there are way too many pilots (yes for a big country we have) and not enough jobs.
At the present situation, if you have a flying job in Canada, consider yourself very lucky as most grateful pilots would say.
If you have more specifics, then feel free to PM me.
Cheers and happy flying!
At the present situation, if you have a flying job in Canada, consider yourself very lucky as most grateful pilots would say.
If you have more specifics, then feel free to PM me.
Cheers and happy flying!
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Advice please! Canada.
Hi
I currently hold my JAA-PPL, JAA Class 2 Medical and , after training in the UK, however, I long term intend to emigrate to Canada and hopefully take up flying over there (hopefully DH8s for JZA, or maybe at worst something else for ACA).
My first question is, how to Transport Canada go about recognising my JAA PPL - do they follow the FAA system of doing a full enquiry back to the CAA and then giving you the 'home' licence?
My second question is, should I bother to continue doing fATPL training in the UK or just continue and do it in Canada? Either way what would be required in all reality to get a JAA fATPL recognised in Canada at worst?
TIA!
I currently hold my JAA-PPL, JAA Class 2 Medical and , after training in the UK, however, I long term intend to emigrate to Canada and hopefully take up flying over there (hopefully DH8s for JZA, or maybe at worst something else for ACA).
My first question is, how to Transport Canada go about recognising my JAA PPL - do they follow the FAA system of doing a full enquiry back to the CAA and then giving you the 'home' licence?
My second question is, should I bother to continue doing fATPL training in the UK or just continue and do it in Canada? Either way what would be required in all reality to get a JAA fATPL recognised in Canada at worst?
TIA!
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CSerpent,
I lived in Canada for 7 years (in fact I am now a Canadian citizen). I'd say have a good think before emigrating, Don't get me wrong it's a great place, but not everyones cup of tea. The flying is great, but when I left nearly 10 months ago it was still buckled from 9-11.
As far as I am aware TC will recognise your PPL. I had a friend over there who had lived in the UK for a fwe years and funnily enough got his PPL in the UK (days before JAA) and was able to fly on it. All he had to do was renew his UK medical which he was able to do in Canada, no problem I believe.
If you are serious about going to Canada, my advice would be to do as my friend did and whilst there go straight for your CPL. I wouldn't waste your time and money doing the fATPL. If you ever return, you can do it then (like me). I met an Brit bird over there so coming back was in part to do with that. If you meet a Canuck, then your well more like to stay in reality !! Like others I've known !!
Anyway, I could tell you loads more, and if you want to hear it PM me and I'll give you my tel number and you're free to call me and get the whole shaboodle !!
Good luck.
Cheers CG
I lived in Canada for 7 years (in fact I am now a Canadian citizen). I'd say have a good think before emigrating, Don't get me wrong it's a great place, but not everyones cup of tea. The flying is great, but when I left nearly 10 months ago it was still buckled from 9-11.
As far as I am aware TC will recognise your PPL. I had a friend over there who had lived in the UK for a fwe years and funnily enough got his PPL in the UK (days before JAA) and was able to fly on it. All he had to do was renew his UK medical which he was able to do in Canada, no problem I believe.
If you are serious about going to Canada, my advice would be to do as my friend did and whilst there go straight for your CPL. I wouldn't waste your time and money doing the fATPL. If you ever return, you can do it then (like me). I met an Brit bird over there so coming back was in part to do with that. If you meet a Canuck, then your well more like to stay in reality !! Like others I've known !!
Anyway, I could tell you loads more, and if you want to hear it PM me and I'll give you my tel number and you're free to call me and get the whole shaboodle !!
Good luck.
Cheers CG