Loans for funding flying training.
Join Date: Jan 2002
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Its Crazzzzzzzzzzzzzzzy!!!!!!!!!!
Ok, here's the deal. As i posted in my last post HSBC some more info.
For those with no house to secure a loan on like me here is what they want!
35K cash to frozen in an HSBC account for the length of the loan, so from the day the loan starts till they get the final payment, thats 2yrs for the course plus grace period then 11yrs so, 13yrs you cant touch that dough!
They would like you aslo to make a "personal contribution to your career to show dedication and seriousness" and so the total they will loan under any circumstance is 50K.
Now, like me, you do the math!
eg OAT course = 60,000
Living costs = 10,000
total excluding resits and genral f ups =70,000
Now HSBC for 50,000
Now you've given them 35K, here you go say HSBC, here 50K.
Thank you, now i need 20K to finish the course and live for the next year and a bit. where will i get this, oh yeah along with the 35K i had sitting around i've got another 20K taking up space!
So in order to borrow 50K from HSBC at just over 6% APR, do a course costing 70K, i have to put a personal contribution of 55K.
You can do the math with me so, i'm paying interest on 50K to borrow 15K!
eh, what, eh, mmmmmm, excuse me???????? sorry Sanjay???
mine and my folks exact words!
For those with no house to secure a loan on like me here is what they want!
35K cash to frozen in an HSBC account for the length of the loan, so from the day the loan starts till they get the final payment, thats 2yrs for the course plus grace period then 11yrs so, 13yrs you cant touch that dough!
They would like you aslo to make a "personal contribution to your career to show dedication and seriousness" and so the total they will loan under any circumstance is 50K.
Now, like me, you do the math!
eg OAT course = 60,000
Living costs = 10,000
total excluding resits and genral f ups =70,000
Now HSBC for 50,000
Now you've given them 35K, here you go say HSBC, here 50K.
Thank you, now i need 20K to finish the course and live for the next year and a bit. where will i get this, oh yeah along with the 35K i had sitting around i've got another 20K taking up space!
So in order to borrow 50K from HSBC at just over 6% APR, do a course costing 70K, i have to put a personal contribution of 55K.
You can do the math with me so, i'm paying interest on 50K to borrow 15K!
eh, what, eh, mmmmmm, excuse me???????? sorry Sanjay???
mine and my folks exact words!
Join Date: Nov 1999
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I think that this is all down to the banks getting twitchy about the rising levels of debt. I used an HSBC proff. studies loan 4 years ago to fund my training and have now almost paid it all back to them and HSBC has always been excellent when I have needed more credit or services. Just a couple of days though I called them to get a temporary extension to my overdraft (£300 only) for a new car and they told me ''NO CHANCE'', when asked why they said that the bank had carried out a review of lending and were clamping down on any unsecured lending, they would however raise my credit card limit by the said amount, go figure!! I can only guess that HSBC is having some trouble at the moment with defualts on unsecured lending which has buggered it for everyone else.
Join Date: May 2004
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Art H,
My branch said the change in policy was a 'bolt from the blue' up until which time they were not aware of any big problems with the loans.
I think its quite unlikely that people able to complete some amount of training + ATPL exams are somehow unable to service the loans while they wait for jobs.
This might appear a bit cynical but consider the two scenarios, for someone who has invested £30k of their own money - they need another c£20k to finish:
1. PSL, borrow the money, 6months - 1 year later get a flying job, overpay the loan and get it cleared with no early repayment penalty.
2. Personal Loan (which is what they still offered me), borrow the money at 8.9%APR, Whack in £8-9k in loan protection insurance, together with penalties for early payment. Total yield for the Bank = lots for than PSLs.
HSBC has decided it likes option 2 better. I don't believe they have been stung quite so bad. The lady I spoke with said they have had "a couple go bad" .... 2 loans?
When they offered me a PSL two years ago I questioned why the bank would give the loan on such good terms with no early repayment penalty. The sincerely given answer was that the bank saw its customers as people who after training would be looking for mortgages, investment products and other financial services -
I've got what I need from another source, and am about to close down the HSBC account. Others doing likewise would perhaps send the message through that loyalty works both ways.
LF
(Rarr - off to eat a bowl of Pedigree Chum, Yum yum)
My branch said the change in policy was a 'bolt from the blue' up until which time they were not aware of any big problems with the loans.
I think its quite unlikely that people able to complete some amount of training + ATPL exams are somehow unable to service the loans while they wait for jobs.
This might appear a bit cynical but consider the two scenarios, for someone who has invested £30k of their own money - they need another c£20k to finish:
1. PSL, borrow the money, 6months - 1 year later get a flying job, overpay the loan and get it cleared with no early repayment penalty.
2. Personal Loan (which is what they still offered me), borrow the money at 8.9%APR, Whack in £8-9k in loan protection insurance, together with penalties for early payment. Total yield for the Bank = lots for than PSLs.
HSBC has decided it likes option 2 better. I don't believe they have been stung quite so bad. The lady I spoke with said they have had "a couple go bad" .... 2 loans?
When they offered me a PSL two years ago I questioned why the bank would give the loan on such good terms with no early repayment penalty. The sincerely given answer was that the bank saw its customers as people who after training would be looking for mortgages, investment products and other financial services -
I've got what I need from another source, and am about to close down the HSBC account. Others doing likewise would perhaps send the message through that loyalty works both ways.
LF
(Rarr - off to eat a bowl of Pedigree Chum, Yum yum)
Join Date: Apr 2004
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When they offered me a PSL two years ago I questioned why the bank would give the loan on such good terms with no early repayment penalty. The sincerely given answer was that the bank saw its customers as people who after training would be looking for mortgages, investment products and other financial services -
Exactly. For them to pull the loan is a great shame, not just for us, but for themselves too. I was going to use it to part finance my training. What do you do if an airline hires you on the condition that you pay for your own TR?
I'll be joining you in closing the account, and I'll politely tell them why.
POL
Join Date: Dec 2002
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uh oh. This is by far the worst news I've had since leaving my job 3 weeks ago to carry on with my training full time. I had high hopes of getting an HSBC loan for 20k. I don't particularly want to get tied to OAT in order to get a loan. I'm already down the modular route and like to pick the training providers I think are best for each part of the training.
It would be good to keep posting other loan alternatives on here as people start investigating the alternatives. If anyone does put together a cry for help to Mr Branson, give me a shout, I'd sign the letter / request like a shot !
I think I'm going to see if the government's Career Development Loan scheme is still running....
It would be good to keep posting other loan alternatives on here as people start investigating the alternatives. If anyone does put together a cry for help to Mr Branson, give me a shout, I'd sign the letter / request like a shot !
I think I'm going to see if the government's Career Development Loan scheme is still running....
The Cooler King
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So then, that's a bit like HSBC saying:
Ok Farrell, you want 50k to buy a car? No problem......but you can only have a choice of two cars.
There appears IMHO to be a slight problem here in the interests of fair trading.
Are OAT and CTC providing written guarantees that pilots will get a job after training with them? If not, then surely this loan should be open to a student who chooses to go to any school.
Where's the sense in this?
Ok Farrell, you want 50k to buy a car? No problem......but you can only have a choice of two cars.
There appears IMHO to be a slight problem here in the interests of fair trading.
Are OAT and CTC providing written guarantees that pilots will get a job after training with them? If not, then surely this loan should be open to a student who chooses to go to any school.
Where's the sense in this?
Join Date: Apr 2005
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Hye you guys,
Well first of all it must suck that HSBC has pulled the plug on loans for aspiring pilots, I don't think that how much money your parents have or a really friendly relative have any inpact on who are good pilots and who are not...
I thought I'd give you the low-down on the situation here in The Netherlands. Here in Holland the situation has existed for quite a while with only 1 or 2 banks giving loans for aspering pilots and only after they have enough security (like a house or a lot of money).
The Dutch flying schools came up with a solution as a lot of potential pilots where not able to find the financing to start their training.
The solution they found was the guarentee fund, it basicly means that if you get past all the entrance tests the school will post the security for your loan at the bank. As these schools have enough money the bank gives pretty good rates (4,25%) at the moment plus that you don't have to start paying back untill after 2 years after you finish your training.
An added bonus is that the school has an extra guarantee, if you don't have a job within 2 years (as a pilot) they will start paying the bank and you only have a loan with the guarentee fund and not the bank (who are not as understanding of the ups and downs in the industry).
You might wonder what the use of this information is, seeing that the most readers of the board don't live in Holland. Well the 2 shools doing this sceme are :
KLS (KLM Flight Academy)
EPST
EPST does all their training with OAT in Oxford, so basicly you'll be having all the benifits of flying at OAT while not having to put up your house in security. I have no idea if this all applies to UK residents, but you could always ask them...
Well first of all it must suck that HSBC has pulled the plug on loans for aspiring pilots, I don't think that how much money your parents have or a really friendly relative have any inpact on who are good pilots and who are not...
I thought I'd give you the low-down on the situation here in The Netherlands. Here in Holland the situation has existed for quite a while with only 1 or 2 banks giving loans for aspering pilots and only after they have enough security (like a house or a lot of money).
The Dutch flying schools came up with a solution as a lot of potential pilots where not able to find the financing to start their training.
The solution they found was the guarentee fund, it basicly means that if you get past all the entrance tests the school will post the security for your loan at the bank. As these schools have enough money the bank gives pretty good rates (4,25%) at the moment plus that you don't have to start paying back untill after 2 years after you finish your training.
An added bonus is that the school has an extra guarantee, if you don't have a job within 2 years (as a pilot) they will start paying the bank and you only have a loan with the guarentee fund and not the bank (who are not as understanding of the ups and downs in the industry).
You might wonder what the use of this information is, seeing that the most readers of the board don't live in Holland. Well the 2 shools doing this sceme are :
KLS (KLM Flight Academy)
EPST
EPST does all their training with OAT in Oxford, so basicly you'll be having all the benifits of flying at OAT while not having to put up your house in security. I have no idea if this all applies to UK residents, but you could always ask them...
Join Date: Jun 2005
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Life after HSBC???
For all of us who dont intend on splashing over 60 grand at OAT, but could make use of a loan in the 30 grand region, what possibilties are we left with now that HSBC have deserted us??
Cheers
Cheers
Join Date: Apr 2004
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Get working to save up £40,000
Don't forget though that you can get the CDL (career development loan) from various providers, one being Barclays. They will loan up to £8000 with conditions more favorable than a standard loan.
Not quite £40K, but its £8K less saving to do
POL
Join Date: Jan 2005
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If you do choose Barclays make sure you try them well in advance.
They will loose all your sensitive ID - passport, licence, bills.
You will have the worry of being cloned.
You will have re send most of the documents again and again.
They will tell you that they cannot find your school on their approved list, then they will find it in around a week.
Your course may start before you have even got a definate decision as to whether they will give you the money, and your school will think you are not going to pay.
Every time you call you will be speaking to an Indian call centre.
Apart from this they are fine!
They will loose all your sensitive ID - passport, licence, bills.
You will have the worry of being cloned.
You will have re send most of the documents again and again.
They will tell you that they cannot find your school on their approved list, then they will find it in around a week.
Your course may start before you have even got a definate decision as to whether they will give you the money, and your school will think you are not going to pay.
Every time you call you will be speaking to an Indian call centre.
Apart from this they are fine!
Join Date: Jul 2005
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Loans For £35,000+
Hi All;
So i'v picked a flight school for my needs, now im interested in finding out how i could get the loan?
Has anyone has a recent loan for around £35,000?, i know hsbc do a loan but i dont think they do one for that amount...
Please could you give me some ideas on where i could get one...
Thanks
Jay
PS, i am doing my flight training hopefully at Naples Air Center, {no comments!}
So i'v picked a flight school for my needs, now im interested in finding out how i could get the loan?
Has anyone has a recent loan for around £35,000?, i know hsbc do a loan but i dont think they do one for that amount...
Please could you give me some ideas on where i could get one...
Thanks
Jay
PS, i am doing my flight training hopefully at Naples Air Center, {no comments!}
Join Date: Jan 2005
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James,
Unfortunately, HSBC have withdrawn their professional studies loan, so you can no longer secure funding that way unless you intend to train at one of the integrated schools who still have an arrangement with the bank (FTE, OAT, CTC etc).
Your best option if you are going to follow the modular route is (in my humble opinion) to take it stage by stage and try to remain in employment while you are studying for the groundschool.
You might consider applying for a government career development loan (CDL) and details can be found at:
http://www.lifelonglearning.co.uk/cdl/
However, you can only secure a maximum of £8000 from a CDL.
Other options I'd be looking at are graduate loans (did you go to uni?) which you can usually take out up to £15,000 at reasonably preferential rates.
At the bottom of the pile is the "run of the mill" personal loan from your high street bank or someone else (such as lombard direct, etc) which usually advertises loans up to £25, 000. However, I would be concerned about prospective pilots who have undertaken no aptitude testing and have no previous flying experience, if I was the bank manager. You'd need to have a really rock solid business plan to secure that type of funding - and quite possibly some UK based equity on which to secure the loan (a parental guarantee or security on property). Besides the logistical problems actually getting the loan.. I suspect companies like lombard direct and other loan companies are absolute ******** to do business with. I'd do a lot of research before signing on the dotted line.
Also, a good idea would be to go and do some aptitude testing somewhere - which would strengthen your business plan and be a good thing to do to prove to yourself that you have what it takes to make it through the training.
Unfortunately securing financial assistance is really quite difficult, especially since HSBC decided to stop funding modular students recently. It might well be a case of having to go out and through hard work earn at least some of the money required to do your training.
The truth is, you cannot expect someone to simply loan you £35, 000 just like that.
Good luck whatever you decide.....
V2
Unfortunately, HSBC have withdrawn their professional studies loan, so you can no longer secure funding that way unless you intend to train at one of the integrated schools who still have an arrangement with the bank (FTE, OAT, CTC etc).
Your best option if you are going to follow the modular route is (in my humble opinion) to take it stage by stage and try to remain in employment while you are studying for the groundschool.
You might consider applying for a government career development loan (CDL) and details can be found at:
http://www.lifelonglearning.co.uk/cdl/
However, you can only secure a maximum of £8000 from a CDL.
Other options I'd be looking at are graduate loans (did you go to uni?) which you can usually take out up to £15,000 at reasonably preferential rates.
At the bottom of the pile is the "run of the mill" personal loan from your high street bank or someone else (such as lombard direct, etc) which usually advertises loans up to £25, 000. However, I would be concerned about prospective pilots who have undertaken no aptitude testing and have no previous flying experience, if I was the bank manager. You'd need to have a really rock solid business plan to secure that type of funding - and quite possibly some UK based equity on which to secure the loan (a parental guarantee or security on property). Besides the logistical problems actually getting the loan.. I suspect companies like lombard direct and other loan companies are absolute ******** to do business with. I'd do a lot of research before signing on the dotted line.
Also, a good idea would be to go and do some aptitude testing somewhere - which would strengthen your business plan and be a good thing to do to prove to yourself that you have what it takes to make it through the training.
Unfortunately securing financial assistance is really quite difficult, especially since HSBC decided to stop funding modular students recently. It might well be a case of having to go out and through hard work earn at least some of the money required to do your training.
The truth is, you cannot expect someone to simply loan you £35, 000 just like that.
Good luck whatever you decide.....
V2
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Unsecured loans for funding flying training.
Hi guys n gals,
Im 18, been flying since i was 16, i hold a PPL and am looking to apply for OAT for this summer, i understand that if successful as a candidate OAT provide funding, but if i decide to join Cabair they do not.
And since Pro Studies Loans have been stopped by HSBC directly to their customers, that doesnt leave much choice on how to raise such serious amount of cash (£50Kish)
I do not want to remortgage my parents house or take any help from them as i dont want to jeopardise them or their money. Its my dream not theirs, so can anyone please help?
Thanks alot
Im 18, been flying since i was 16, i hold a PPL and am looking to apply for OAT for this summer, i understand that if successful as a candidate OAT provide funding, but if i decide to join Cabair they do not.
And since Pro Studies Loans have been stopped by HSBC directly to their customers, that doesnt leave much choice on how to raise such serious amount of cash (£50Kish)
I do not want to remortgage my parents house or take any help from them as i dont want to jeopardise them or their money. Its my dream not theirs, so can anyone please help?
Thanks alot