Stapleford
I was there today. The woman behind the bar was even more miserable than before.
The school is okay - but it could be so much better. They need to get rid of one or two of the rude girls behind reception. Not Sandra as she is absolutely lovely. They have a fantastic set of instructors. The facilities could do with a cash injection and the cafe/bar should be contracted out to an exterior company because the food is just crap and over priced. The airfield is in such a lovely location though and seems to attract students from all over Europe. This place could easily get a 10/10 but at the moment I'd give it a 6/10. Customer service means everything these days IMO.
The school is okay - but it could be so much better. They need to get rid of one or two of the rude girls behind reception. Not Sandra as she is absolutely lovely. They have a fantastic set of instructors. The facilities could do with a cash injection and the cafe/bar should be contracted out to an exterior company because the food is just crap and over priced. The airfield is in such a lovely location though and seems to attract students from all over Europe. This place could easily get a 10/10 but at the moment I'd give it a 6/10. Customer service means everything these days IMO.
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Moon
Posts: 229
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I would have to disagree with the comment about the bar and food, there is nothing wrong with the food, infact I think the food and bar staff are top notch!
Stapleford is probably the best modular flying school out there
Stapleford is probably the best modular flying school out there
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: PlanetEarth
Age: 44
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The food!!!
You want to be a gourmet critic or a pilot? I mean seriously, bring your own lunch, why waist money in the cafe! Seriously make me wonder what values you have for your training!
Anyway my view so far, the school is very fair and good. CPL cost me a little more then originally quoted, but that was mainly because I opted to use the Arrow instead of the Warrior for most of the training. As flying the Warrior is a waste of time, to have to do all again in the Arrow, and get used to complex aircraft + using the correct speeds in the Arrow makes more sense than flying the Warrior over the threshold at 80kts. Other reason it cost me a little more, was the time from last flight to skill test, I simply wanted a couple of extra hours myself the day before the skills test. Still overall all completed within 4 - 5 weeks. MEP minimums, and will be starting my IR shortly.
Personally I would budget slightly above what they quote, to be safe, but having done much training there, also for my PPL - they have delivered close to minimums.
Everybody I speak to there who do CPL/IR/MEP - have NOTHING negative to say about the place.
Regarding the cafe, the food is fair for what it is, and prices too. The reception, most of them are friendly when you get to know them + who cares, who spends more than 5 minutes in the reception?
You go there to make your bookings, tech log, keys and pay - that's it! And it is pretty busy sometimes, might be several people waiting to get their tech logs signed at the same time + people calling with all kind of questions, it does get pretty busy there sometimes, that's just the way it is!
Most people are there to fly, learn to fly, not spend their day in the reception to get a nice pat on their back, it is In and Out!
The miserable one is probably the one who is the boss in the reception, overall those are things I would not care about. Imagine you work for an airline, do you think all the people you will be in touch with in your company will always be smiling and kissing you on the neck? Please give me a break! Spoilt brats!
Overall personally I would give Stapelford great recommendation, they deliver what they promise, and within a reasonable frame of budget they offered in advance.
In the end, it is all up to the student, it is only that much an instructor can do!
I do not go there to chat with receptionist ladies, or to have a great dinner - I go there to fly and to learn to fly!
If you want smiling ladies go to the lap dance bar, and if you want good food - there are plenty of good restaurants in London!
You want to be a gourmet critic or a pilot? I mean seriously, bring your own lunch, why waist money in the cafe! Seriously make me wonder what values you have for your training!
Anyway my view so far, the school is very fair and good. CPL cost me a little more then originally quoted, but that was mainly because I opted to use the Arrow instead of the Warrior for most of the training. As flying the Warrior is a waste of time, to have to do all again in the Arrow, and get used to complex aircraft + using the correct speeds in the Arrow makes more sense than flying the Warrior over the threshold at 80kts. Other reason it cost me a little more, was the time from last flight to skill test, I simply wanted a couple of extra hours myself the day before the skills test. Still overall all completed within 4 - 5 weeks. MEP minimums, and will be starting my IR shortly.
Personally I would budget slightly above what they quote, to be safe, but having done much training there, also for my PPL - they have delivered close to minimums.
Everybody I speak to there who do CPL/IR/MEP - have NOTHING negative to say about the place.
Regarding the cafe, the food is fair for what it is, and prices too. The reception, most of them are friendly when you get to know them + who cares, who spends more than 5 minutes in the reception?
You go there to make your bookings, tech log, keys and pay - that's it! And it is pretty busy sometimes, might be several people waiting to get their tech logs signed at the same time + people calling with all kind of questions, it does get pretty busy there sometimes, that's just the way it is!
Most people are there to fly, learn to fly, not spend their day in the reception to get a nice pat on their back, it is In and Out!
The miserable one is probably the one who is the boss in the reception, overall those are things I would not care about. Imagine you work for an airline, do you think all the people you will be in touch with in your company will always be smiling and kissing you on the neck? Please give me a break! Spoilt brats!
Overall personally I would give Stapelford great recommendation, they deliver what they promise, and within a reasonable frame of budget they offered in advance.
In the end, it is all up to the student, it is only that much an instructor can do!
I do not go there to chat with receptionist ladies, or to have a great dinner - I go there to fly and to learn to fly!
If you want smiling ladies go to the lap dance bar, and if you want good food - there are plenty of good restaurants in London!
Never my experience, in 10 years at Stapleford. Try phoning up (once they know you) for a last-minute all-day hire of a PA28 when tomorrow's bookings sheet is already nicely full. Scribble, scribble, switch, switch, no not him, put that there, if I do that and that ....... ah, yes !
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: London
Posts: 59
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Stapleford has a bit of an odd atmosphere thats for sure. The receptionists are incredibly busy so I'd never expect them to be interested in general chit chat - I think it depends on the day and the mood they're in as to what level of customer service you get. I know people have mentioned that we're not training at these places for the customer service, we're there to train. I would agree with this comment if it wasn't for one major consideration - the price we pay. When I'm paying £148 an hour dual I expect to get a polished product for my money.
Stapleford, as any other flight school, is selling a product. If I don't like the product my money walks. I trained with Stapleford on and off for about two years and always felt that for the money I paid I wasn't receiving an adequate product. As a result I moved. I'm now training at a school which charges £118/hour dual and makes me make my own tea and coffee. The difference however is that when I pay that £118 after each lesson I feel like I'm getting value for money where as at Stapleford I merely felt like just another PPL there to top up the money pot.
Stapleford, as any other flight school, is selling a product. If I don't like the product my money walks. I trained with Stapleford on and off for about two years and always felt that for the money I paid I wasn't receiving an adequate product. As a result I moved. I'm now training at a school which charges £118/hour dual and makes me make my own tea and coffee. The difference however is that when I pay that £118 after each lesson I feel like I'm getting value for money where as at Stapleford I merely felt like just another PPL there to top up the money pot.
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: PlanetEarth
Age: 44
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
AJ1990 - Now I believe this thread has mostly been about CPL/IR training, and that is a complete other kettle of fish. You should not compare PPL vs this. The school that offer you PPL lessons for less, might be good, don't get me wrong. However the reputation of Stapelford for CPL and IR, is pretty good.
Yes money talks, but I have also heard of schools that are happy to teach for less, but the procedures they teach you are not suitable for the further CPL/IR training, if that is your plan.
You might save a little now, then you go on for your CPL/IR and you need to relearn procedures etc. That is why it is a small advantage to train with one school.
I do think PPL at Stapelford probably has "lower" priority than CPL/IR - but than again you do get a few "hopeless PPL" students too.
It is all about what the student puts in, they will gladly let you spend your money if you are not bothered yourself to put time and effort in your own training.
Yes money talks, but I have also heard of schools that are happy to teach for less, but the procedures they teach you are not suitable for the further CPL/IR training, if that is your plan.
You might save a little now, then you go on for your CPL/IR and you need to relearn procedures etc. That is why it is a small advantage to train with one school.
I do think PPL at Stapelford probably has "lower" priority than CPL/IR - but than again you do get a few "hopeless PPL" students too.
It is all about what the student puts in, they will gladly let you spend your money if you are not bothered yourself to put time and effort in your own training.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: London, UK
Age: 34
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
MagicTiger
It seems as if you're taking many of the posts on this thread to heart. Whilst I disagree with those who feel that the standard of food served in the training establishment's bar is an indictment on their ability to train pilots, I also disagree with consistent rebuttals of people's post in which they are merely trying to get their opinion across to those who want to see a perspectives from across the spectrum for their potential training establishment, whether it be from PPL to CPL ME/IR.
rriisshhii
It seems as if you're taking many of the posts on this thread to heart. Whilst I disagree with those who feel that the standard of food served in the training establishment's bar is an indictment on their ability to train pilots, I also disagree with consistent rebuttals of people's post in which they are merely trying to get their opinion across to those who want to see a perspectives from across the spectrum for their potential training establishment, whether it be from PPL to CPL ME/IR.
rriisshhii
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: London
Posts: 59
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Moving on...
I think Stapleford needs to address its priorities. I've heard many good things said about Stapleford CPL/IR training and couldn't possibly comment on the quality of training. I only talk about Stapleford in terms of an establishment from my own experience. Surely it's sound business sense not to alienate PPL students who'll potentially be tomorrows CPL/IR's? First impressions account for a lot - when I'm considering which training organization I'll go to for my CPL I won't be so inclined (rightfully or wrongly) to go back.
It's good to see PPRUNE continues to be a friendly open forum for debate...
I think Stapleford needs to address its priorities. I've heard many good things said about Stapleford CPL/IR training and couldn't possibly comment on the quality of training. I only talk about Stapleford in terms of an establishment from my own experience. Surely it's sound business sense not to alienate PPL students who'll potentially be tomorrows CPL/IR's? First impressions account for a lot - when I'm considering which training organization I'll go to for my CPL I won't be so inclined (rightfully or wrongly) to go back.
It's good to see PPRUNE continues to be a friendly open forum for debate...
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: PlanetEarth
Age: 44
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Maybe with some more life experience you learn to see what is important and what is not.
A PPL is a license to learn. One thing I would say from my own experience, they try to get you done in minimum time, if they think you are good enough. This for me is more important then the coffee or the receptionist girls!
I know some other schools, they will happily make you fly more than required, and take your money.
If you pass your skill tests in minimum time, than the school must be doing something right!
For PPL you have many more choices in the country then for CPL/IR - so you can not compare this to much.
Everyone can see the Professional flight training set up is ahead of the PPL. End of the day PPL is just a basic license for people to start learning to fly.
AJ1990 said he was training ON and OFF for 2 years for his PPL I assume, now that itself is a major problem. If you want to have good quality you need to do your PPL within 3 to 4 months! If not you loose to much continuity, and that is not the schools fault. I am sure if you are ON and OFF for such a long period, you will have various instructors etc., so of course the quality will be varied.
Most people do the whole CPL within 4 - 5 weeks, and ME in 3 - 6 days, that for me is a sign of quality.
Rather than mess around for 2 years with your PPL, save your money until you can do it intensively, at least 3 to 5 days a week. You show the effort, and their instructors show the same effort back to you.
Regarding the price you pay also depends on what aircraft you fly. There are several good PPL schools in the country, however there are less to choose between regards CPL/IR - and believe me the cafeteria and reception ladies are not going to be a contributing factor to my choice!
Without knowing your personal circumstances, I believe your choice to spread your PPL training out over so long period is a big mistake, maybe that's why the quality in return was not as you expected.
A PPL is a license to learn. One thing I would say from my own experience, they try to get you done in minimum time, if they think you are good enough. This for me is more important then the coffee or the receptionist girls!
I know some other schools, they will happily make you fly more than required, and take your money.
If you pass your skill tests in minimum time, than the school must be doing something right!
For PPL you have many more choices in the country then for CPL/IR - so you can not compare this to much.
Everyone can see the Professional flight training set up is ahead of the PPL. End of the day PPL is just a basic license for people to start learning to fly.
AJ1990 said he was training ON and OFF for 2 years for his PPL I assume, now that itself is a major problem. If you want to have good quality you need to do your PPL within 3 to 4 months! If not you loose to much continuity, and that is not the schools fault. I am sure if you are ON and OFF for such a long period, you will have various instructors etc., so of course the quality will be varied.
Most people do the whole CPL within 4 - 5 weeks, and ME in 3 - 6 days, that for me is a sign of quality.
Rather than mess around for 2 years with your PPL, save your money until you can do it intensively, at least 3 to 5 days a week. You show the effort, and their instructors show the same effort back to you.
Regarding the price you pay also depends on what aircraft you fly. There are several good PPL schools in the country, however there are less to choose between regards CPL/IR - and believe me the cafeteria and reception ladies are not going to be a contributing factor to my choice!
Without knowing your personal circumstances, I believe your choice to spread your PPL training out over so long period is a big mistake, maybe that's why the quality in return was not as you expected.
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: London
Posts: 59
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My personal circumstance...Lost my Class 1 medical after being made unfit to fly by catching a very nasty nasty bug. I didn't fly for 18 months. Not really a personal choice.
I agree with you MagicTiger however. I started an intensive course just two weeks ago and I'll be done and dusted by the end of next week. Intensive training in far superior for obvious reasons. I havent questioned the quality of training at Stapleford, I just said they were a bit over priced for what they were offering. In fact I'm going back there to do my Night Rating so by no means take this as an attack on Staplefords quality of training.
You mention a lack of life experience. As a 19 year old, I still appreciate the value of my money. Thirty odd pounds an hour difference makes alot of difference to myself and when you consider over the course of things, this adds up to a fairly sizeable amount. Or maybe you assume that becasue I'm still young mummy and daddy must have paid for everything as all 19 year olds in this industry allow them to? I could have all the life experience in the world but at 19 that wouldn't change the fact that money still counts for alot.
I agree with you MagicTiger however. I started an intensive course just two weeks ago and I'll be done and dusted by the end of next week. Intensive training in far superior for obvious reasons. I havent questioned the quality of training at Stapleford, I just said they were a bit over priced for what they were offering. In fact I'm going back there to do my Night Rating so by no means take this as an attack on Staplefords quality of training.
You mention a lack of life experience. As a 19 year old, I still appreciate the value of my money. Thirty odd pounds an hour difference makes alot of difference to myself and when you consider over the course of things, this adds up to a fairly sizeable amount. Or maybe you assume that becasue I'm still young mummy and daddy must have paid for everything as all 19 year olds in this industry allow them to? I could have all the life experience in the world but at 19 that wouldn't change the fact that money still counts for alot.
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: PlanetEarth
Age: 44
Posts: 94
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Depends on the quality of the training. With CPL/IR saving few pounds an hour might cost you more in the end.
There are many circumstances to consider. One thing you want to make sure of is that the basics and standard of quality will help you when you go on to your commercial training.
Maybe your current school is excellent, maybe they are not, time will only tell. Saving few hundred pounds now, might cost you more in training later, maybe not. Impossible for me to judge how good your current school is. However for me Stapelford have delivered all with reasonable price, as expected!
That is for me quality, not how the food is or the reception ladies are, by the way they have been excellent with me, always!
There are many circumstances to consider. One thing you want to make sure of is that the basics and standard of quality will help you when you go on to your commercial training.
Maybe your current school is excellent, maybe they are not, time will only tell. Saving few hundred pounds now, might cost you more in training later, maybe not. Impossible for me to judge how good your current school is. However for me Stapelford have delivered all with reasonable price, as expected!
That is for me quality, not how the food is or the reception ladies are, by the way they have been excellent with me, always!
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 48
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
i finished my full Zero-fATPL programme there in March (Modular)
Myself and Three other lads from Stapleford, all finishing bewteen December 2009 - March 2010 are all now flying for Ryanair, First Officer on the 737-800.
I would say it was a fantastic investment for me personally. I've gone from a wannabe PPL to having my dream job flying Jets, in just a little over 2 years.
I would reccommend them as the best modular choice for PPL, CPL, ME & IR.
I would reccommend for hours building you go to Florida (SunState Aviation - Kissimmee)
and for MCC i would definately go somewhere where they have a 737 Sim.
CAE on the 737-800 or Oxford on the 737-400. This was a massive help in my selection and assessment for Ryanair.
Ciao.
Myself and Three other lads from Stapleford, all finishing bewteen December 2009 - March 2010 are all now flying for Ryanair, First Officer on the 737-800.
I would say it was a fantastic investment for me personally. I've gone from a wannabe PPL to having my dream job flying Jets, in just a little over 2 years.
I would reccommend them as the best modular choice for PPL, CPL, ME & IR.
I would reccommend for hours building you go to Florida (SunState Aviation - Kissimmee)
and for MCC i would definately go somewhere where they have a 737 Sim.
CAE on the 737-800 or Oxford on the 737-400. This was a massive help in my selection and assessment for Ryanair.
Ciao.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Rochester, Kent
Age: 35
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I agree with David, I'm just finishing my IR at Stapleford now - should be doing my 170A at the end of this week or beginning of next.
I've done my PPL right through to IR with SFC, and I've also done a fair bit of different types of flying at other places in the UK. PPL-wise I think it can depend on who your instructor is at Stapleford but generally they're pretty good - personally I had an excellent PPL instructor who prepared me well for the CPL.
It's a similar story further up the ladder; my CPL/ME and IR instructors have all been absolutely first class - I really cannot fault them at all. The only minor problem I can think of is a lack of standardisation between the instructors at Stapleford. Even so, they seem aware of this so, where you have to fly with other instructors occasionally, they usually arrange for someone with a similar teaching style to take you on for that slot.
I agree that, for the money you pay, the aircraft are generally a bit old and tired - particularly at PPL level. I worked for a different flying school during my ATPL studies (we only taught up to PPL) and the aircraft were in great condition, but the instructing was, with a couple of possible exceptions, nowhere near the mark of SFC - and I know what I'd rather pay for!
I have no hesitation in recommending Stapleford as a great place to train for anything from PPL through to CPL/IR.
I've done my PPL right through to IR with SFC, and I've also done a fair bit of different types of flying at other places in the UK. PPL-wise I think it can depend on who your instructor is at Stapleford but generally they're pretty good - personally I had an excellent PPL instructor who prepared me well for the CPL.
It's a similar story further up the ladder; my CPL/ME and IR instructors have all been absolutely first class - I really cannot fault them at all. The only minor problem I can think of is a lack of standardisation between the instructors at Stapleford. Even so, they seem aware of this so, where you have to fly with other instructors occasionally, they usually arrange for someone with a similar teaching style to take you on for that slot.
I agree that, for the money you pay, the aircraft are generally a bit old and tired - particularly at PPL level. I worked for a different flying school during my ATPL studies (we only taught up to PPL) and the aircraft were in great condition, but the instructing was, with a couple of possible exceptions, nowhere near the mark of SFC - and I know what I'd rather pay for!
I have no hesitation in recommending Stapleford as a great place to train for anything from PPL through to CPL/IR.
Está servira para distraerle.
Stapleford Flight Centre.
It's a CAA FTO, a properly and professionally run flight training establishment for all sorts of pilots and aspiring pilots. It's true that some of the aircraft are a trifle tatty but the maintenance is prompt and this is a training school, not an elite hire and fly operator.
The standard of training (multi IR renewal) is extremely high and sculpted to the individual's requirements, character and abilities. It's a business though so you'll forgive them if they want to make some money to live on. They're perfectly entitled to do that. I've known plenty of places that charge on a Hobbs metre from the moment the engine starts up to the second it shuts down, not everyone just charges for time airborne, or has an excellent and cost efficient simulator for procedural practice.
I found no rudeness at all within the organization, a little brusqueness perhaps when they were busy but then they work hard there and sometimes no doubt have to deal with less than intelligent questions and requests.. Some people are more taciturn than others and on different days of the week too but that's nothing personal. So long as a workman like job of training or testing is done without any trace of potential victimisation, that's what you should expect. Don't forget too, that if you're tested and passed and subsequently have an aircraft accident or incident, then your testing officer's licence and record will be examined in great detail by the CAA. You can be great drinking buddies with your students but that's best left until after they've qualified and by that time most pupils at a place like this have probably disappeared into the ether in search of their own economic destiny.
Looking forward to further training and testing at SFC. A throughly good mob to train with.
It's a CAA FTO, a properly and professionally run flight training establishment for all sorts of pilots and aspiring pilots. It's true that some of the aircraft are a trifle tatty but the maintenance is prompt and this is a training school, not an elite hire and fly operator.
The standard of training (multi IR renewal) is extremely high and sculpted to the individual's requirements, character and abilities. It's a business though so you'll forgive them if they want to make some money to live on. They're perfectly entitled to do that. I've known plenty of places that charge on a Hobbs metre from the moment the engine starts up to the second it shuts down, not everyone just charges for time airborne, or has an excellent and cost efficient simulator for procedural practice.
I found no rudeness at all within the organization, a little brusqueness perhaps when they were busy but then they work hard there and sometimes no doubt have to deal with less than intelligent questions and requests.. Some people are more taciturn than others and on different days of the week too but that's nothing personal. So long as a workman like job of training or testing is done without any trace of potential victimisation, that's what you should expect. Don't forget too, that if you're tested and passed and subsequently have an aircraft accident or incident, then your testing officer's licence and record will be examined in great detail by the CAA. You can be great drinking buddies with your students but that's best left until after they've qualified and by that time most pupils at a place like this have probably disappeared into the ether in search of their own economic destiny.
Looking forward to further training and testing at SFC. A throughly good mob to train with.
Last edited by cavortingcheetah; 20th Aug 2014 at 06:37.