Cathay or Qantas; Aviation Degree or Diploma?
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
From: Sydney
Aviation Degree or Diploma?
Hello everyone,
I would like to have some advice from anyone who knows please. I am currently a student in Australia, aiming to be an airline pilot for Cathay Pacific or Qantas. I have checked with various flying schools including universities. I am not sure which one to choose, the university courses go for 3 years and they told me that an aviation degree is highly desired by airlines while the flying schools which offer diplomas told me it's a waste of time while it only takes me 1 year to gain all my licenses and an advanced diploma and I am able to use those 2 extra years as years to gain hours ready for airline employment. Others have told me to get a non-aviation related degree. Does anyone have some advice on which is better? Going to a university for 3 years? Or go to a flying school for 1 year? Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks for your time!
Many Thanks,
Jimmy Wang
I would like to have some advice from anyone who knows please. I am currently a student in Australia, aiming to be an airline pilot for Cathay Pacific or Qantas. I have checked with various flying schools including universities. I am not sure which one to choose, the university courses go for 3 years and they told me that an aviation degree is highly desired by airlines while the flying schools which offer diplomas told me it's a waste of time while it only takes me 1 year to gain all my licenses and an advanced diploma and I am able to use those 2 extra years as years to gain hours ready for airline employment. Others have told me to get a non-aviation related degree. Does anyone have some advice on which is better? Going to a university for 3 years? Or go to a flying school for 1 year? Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks for your time!
Many Thanks,
Jimmy Wang
PPRuNe Handmaiden
Joined: Feb 1997
Posts: 4,910
Likes: 184
From: Duit On Mon Dei
At this point in time Qantas and Cathay Pacific do not require a degree to join either company as a pilot. I could say "end of story" but I won't.
The diploma that people talk about is a glorified formalisation of the CASA exams you have to do. Remember, it's the CASA exams that count for your licence. Nothing else.
If you have to get something, get the diploma through tech.
If you really want a degree and nothing wrong with that, you can either get an aviation degree or something else. As many folk have found out in Oz, an aviation degree won't be much use unless you go into aviation. However, if !!!! happens and you lose your job or medical etc, at least you have a formal qualification IF you select another degree.
Naturally the universities have told you that airlines like degrees, of course they're going to say that. What the uni's didn't say is that the airlines like any degree. One in science/technology is more desirable than eg fine arts.
Remember that the flying schools will probably try and tell you a load of promotional rubbish too. The biggest lie at the moment is "there's a shortage of pilots coming".
Cathay and Qantas seem to look for a different sort of applicant. Cathay like you to have a well rounded aviation career with a good mix of flying. QF, I wouldn't have a clue... So, with that in mind a degree will not help you when you are knocking on the doors of the charter guys in the Kimberley. In fact, using it as a selling point will get you laughed out of the place.
Personally, a good trade is better. Electrician, mechanic etc.
If you really want to know what QF and CX prefer, contact them.
So, if you want a degree, get one. Just don't limit it to an aviation one. If you want a diploma, go to tech. (if they still run them). If you don't want either, no problem. It's the licence and the logbook that counts (and your personality). Get the best marks you can at school as this will help.
Good luck.
The diploma that people talk about is a glorified formalisation of the CASA exams you have to do. Remember, it's the CASA exams that count for your licence. Nothing else.
If you have to get something, get the diploma through tech.
If you really want a degree and nothing wrong with that, you can either get an aviation degree or something else. As many folk have found out in Oz, an aviation degree won't be much use unless you go into aviation. However, if !!!! happens and you lose your job or medical etc, at least you have a formal qualification IF you select another degree.
Naturally the universities have told you that airlines like degrees, of course they're going to say that. What the uni's didn't say is that the airlines like any degree. One in science/technology is more desirable than eg fine arts.
Remember that the flying schools will probably try and tell you a load of promotional rubbish too. The biggest lie at the moment is "there's a shortage of pilots coming".
Cathay and Qantas seem to look for a different sort of applicant. Cathay like you to have a well rounded aviation career with a good mix of flying. QF, I wouldn't have a clue... So, with that in mind a degree will not help you when you are knocking on the doors of the charter guys in the Kimberley. In fact, using it as a selling point will get you laughed out of the place.
Personally, a good trade is better. Electrician, mechanic etc.
If you really want to know what QF and CX prefer, contact them.
So, if you want a degree, get one. Just don't limit it to an aviation one. If you want a diploma, go to tech. (if they still run them). If you don't want either, no problem. It's the licence and the logbook that counts (and your personality). Get the best marks you can at school as this will help.
Good luck.
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
From: Sydney
Dear Redsnail,
Thank you for your advice. Which step would you strongly recommend? Which path would be best for someone like me considering to be an airline pilot for Cathay? Should I go for flight training and get a Science degree? Get an aviation degree? Or just do normal flying training? Which one do you think is most important and most successful pathway. Thanks a lot
Many Thanks,
Jimmy
Thank you for your advice. Which step would you strongly recommend? Which path would be best for someone like me considering to be an airline pilot for Cathay? Should I go for flight training and get a Science degree? Get an aviation degree? Or just do normal flying training? Which one do you think is most important and most successful pathway. Thanks a lot
Many Thanks,
Jimmy
PPRuNe Handmaiden
Joined: Feb 1997
Posts: 4,910
Likes: 184
From: Duit On Mon Dei
I am not a recruiter for Cathay nor Qantas.
All of my mates who've got into Cathay have not got degrees.
They just had several thousand hours in piston twins and turbines ranging from Twin Otters, Bandeirantes, Brasilias and Dash 8s.
What you must realise is that you will not go from flight school to Cathay (or Qantas for that matter).
So pick a good school that will teach you properly as opposed a sausage factory.
If you are in Sydney, go and find out what tech courses are being run. They offer (or did when I was doing them) very good value courses.
If you want a degree, it will not hurt you. (It may give you a debt you don't need but it may give you some back up skills just in case). I just can't see the benefit of an aviation degree outside aviation. Most of my friends who have done them have done them once they're in an airline type job and what something to do to keep their brains working.
As you probably have learnt, there's no guarantees. Don't place all your eggs in the Cathay/Qantas basket.
All of my mates who've got into Cathay have not got degrees.
They just had several thousand hours in piston twins and turbines ranging from Twin Otters, Bandeirantes, Brasilias and Dash 8s.
What you must realise is that you will not go from flight school to Cathay (or Qantas for that matter).
So pick a good school that will teach you properly as opposed a sausage factory.
If you are in Sydney, go and find out what tech courses are being run. They offer (or did when I was doing them) very good value courses.
If you want a degree, it will not hurt you. (It may give you a debt you don't need but it may give you some back up skills just in case). I just can't see the benefit of an aviation degree outside aviation. Most of my friends who have done them have done them once they're in an airline type job and what something to do to keep their brains working.
As you probably have learnt, there's no guarantees. Don't place all your eggs in the Cathay/Qantas basket.
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
From: Sydney
Dear Redsnail,
It has been my pleasure for you answering my questions. I would like to know a bit more about this topic, if you don't mind please add me on ICQ or MSN messenger. It would be great if your Cathay Pacific pilot friends won't mind chatting to me either. Right now I would like to learn more about the aviation industry and talk to as many pilots as I could. So if you don't mind, I would be really glad if you don't mind adding me even if you're not a pilot. And would be great if your friends won't mind chatting to me as well. Thank you for your time and I hope we'll be able to chat personally so I can learn more from you.
Many Thanks,
Jimmy
ICQ: 145386269
MSN: [email protected]
Email: [email protected]
It has been my pleasure for you answering my questions. I would like to know a bit more about this topic, if you don't mind please add me on ICQ or MSN messenger. It would be great if your Cathay Pacific pilot friends won't mind chatting to me either. Right now I would like to learn more about the aviation industry and talk to as many pilots as I could. So if you don't mind, I would be really glad if you don't mind adding me even if you're not a pilot. And would be great if your friends won't mind chatting to me as well. Thank you for your time and I hope we'll be able to chat personally so I can learn more from you.
Many Thanks,
Jimmy
ICQ: 145386269
MSN: [email protected]
Email: [email protected]
Moderator
Joined: Feb 2000
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 14,480
Likes: 178
From: UK
A passing thought from somebody who uses his degree every day.
Gaining a degree is a satisfying experience, you learn a great deal and also develop analytical skills that will serve you well in many fields totally unrelated to your chosen subject. In my case, I did a degree in aeronautical engineering, and it's served as an excellent foundation for my career so far.
But, notice that I used the word "foundation". That is what most degrees are, and it is unrealistic to think that most will qualify you to do anything. If you are looking for a "backup" in case for whatever reason pilot training doesn't work out for you, a degree on it's own isn't going to do that.
There are many things that will - whether it's hanging onto qualifications as an outdoor sports instructor, or a certificate in bookeeping, those are what you want if you are primarily looking for a backup. If you've got a non-flying hobby, qualifying to teach it might cost a lot less, and be far more satisfying as a second string to your bow.
On the other hand, if there's a subject that fascinates you, and you'd like to take to degree level - or (say) you are hoping eventually to go into aviation management and some form of business management degree would help that, then go for it.
G
Gaining a degree is a satisfying experience, you learn a great deal and also develop analytical skills that will serve you well in many fields totally unrelated to your chosen subject. In my case, I did a degree in aeronautical engineering, and it's served as an excellent foundation for my career so far.
But, notice that I used the word "foundation". That is what most degrees are, and it is unrealistic to think that most will qualify you to do anything. If you are looking for a "backup" in case for whatever reason pilot training doesn't work out for you, a degree on it's own isn't going to do that.
There are many things that will - whether it's hanging onto qualifications as an outdoor sports instructor, or a certificate in bookeeping, those are what you want if you are primarily looking for a backup. If you've got a non-flying hobby, qualifying to teach it might cost a lot less, and be far more satisfying as a second string to your bow.
On the other hand, if there's a subject that fascinates you, and you'd like to take to degree level - or (say) you are hoping eventually to go into aviation management and some form of business management degree would help that, then go for it.
G
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
From: Sydney
CX or QF
Hey guys,
Just planning the future... I still have around 6 years before I can even apply for an airline. But does anyone know if employment as a pilot at CX (Cathay Pacific) is challenging or easy? Same for QF (Qantas) Which airline of these 2 do you guys think it would be easiest to be accepted. I live in Sydney so I wouldn't mind trying for QF and my background is Hong Kong so I also don't mind working for Cathay Pacific. Anyone know if getting into either of these airlines is easy or very VERY hard? Any comments appreciated! Thank your for your time!
Jimmy
Just planning the future... I still have around 6 years before I can even apply for an airline. But does anyone know if employment as a pilot at CX (Cathay Pacific) is challenging or easy? Same for QF (Qantas) Which airline of these 2 do you guys think it would be easiest to be accepted. I live in Sydney so I wouldn't mind trying for QF and my background is Hong Kong so I also don't mind working for Cathay Pacific. Anyone know if getting into either of these airlines is easy or very VERY hard? Any comments appreciated! Thank your for your time!
Jimmy
Moderator
Joined: Dec 1997
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 4,929
Likes: 6
From: Suffolk UK
Jimmy, please do not post the same topic in multiple threads. You will find I have deleted your 'CX or QF' thread in Wannabes/Interviews, Jobs & Sponsorships. I have merged the same topic in Prof. Pilot Training into your 'Degree or Diploma' thread as there is much overlap in your questions.
Getting into any airline is very difficult and takes a great deal of work. Thanks to somewhat restrictive employment practises and a virtual monopoly in a small market, Qantas is more difficult to get into than most. I'm sure Cathay will be delighted that you 'wouldn't mind' working for them!
Take a look at the reference thread at the top of the list of threads in this forum. There is a great deal in there that you should read. At 14, you've got lots of time to learn what you need to do in the future....
Scroggs
Getting into any airline is very difficult and takes a great deal of work. Thanks to somewhat restrictive employment practises and a virtual monopoly in a small market, Qantas is more difficult to get into than most. I'm sure Cathay will be delighted that you 'wouldn't mind' working for them!
Take a look at the reference thread at the top of the list of threads in this forum. There is a great deal in there that you should read. At 14, you've got lots of time to learn what you need to do in the future....
Scroggs
