14 passes and 55 hrs logged.... what next?

[Just another student]

Basically I am looking for any guidance people can provide me with regarding taking my training onto the next level. I need roughly 10 hrs straight away in order to get me up to speed, but after that, I am open to ideas. My 55 hrs logged include the night rating.

I am contemplating taking a IMC course at my local airport (EGNX) with a view to then flying 25 hrs or so of UK hour building. I really need this time to become confident with European airspace, as my PPL was completed in the USA.I would then move State Side to fly a further 50 (cross country hours). I would then be left with 25 hours or more in the UK to lead into my multi and then IR/CPL. However I have just read that I may need 100hrs p1 to apply for the IMC, is this correct?

I am looking at Bristol Flight Centre for the CPL/IR side of things, as I have heard good things about the standard of training. Are there any other schools you guys could suggest?

I know there are a lot of ways to go about this side of training, some good/ some bad, and not all suit everbodies needs. But what would you guys suggest for me to do? Money is a primary concern as I am not loaded by any stretch of the imagination. However I do regard quality of training as of equal or if not more importance.

Thanks guys

[Jinkster]

However I have just read that I may need 100hrs p1 to apply for the IMC, is this correct?

No, you need 100hrs P1 for CPL licence issue. not IMC as you can do that with low P1 hours.

I would suggest looking at some UK flying time as you have completed your PPL in the US and then heading to the US to save money.

Cannot really suggest any particular schools. I know a place at Sheffield airport who have good flying rates for a PA28 and possible getting an Arrow (send me a pm if you need the address or phone number).

All the best and congrats to your results,

Jinkster

[Dean Johnston]

Jinkster,

I don't think thats quite right. I think you will find that you need 100 PPL time ( I think TT ) before you can take the CPL/ATPL Theory exams. It sounds like JAS has 55 TT and has taken the Theory exams, I would suggest you get onto the CAA website. www.srg.caa.co.uk and have a look at the LASORS.

HTH

D.J.

[Just another student]

Dean, am I correct in saying that you are making the point that you need 100 PPL TT before sitting the ATPL theory exams? If this is the case I have never been informed of this, and can not find any information regarding this in the Lasors.

Thanks

[mad_jock]

You don't need 100hrs P1 time to start ATPL's or sit exams.

I had 60 hours TT sitting the first batch and 130 TT sitting the second and in both case was below 100 PIC. You do need the 100 hours PIC by the time you apply for your CPL.

MJ

[Just another student]

Thanks for clearing that up mad_jock, I was pretty sure that was the case. To be honest the route from where I am now to an f-atpl is proving more mind blowing than any of the exams!

[Half a Mexican]

I know it's hardly a money saving alternative but why don't you take the time to do something interesting like aerobatics or an alpine rating (in France).

It will probably cost you a bit more but will add to your skills as a pilot and will no doubt be an enjoyable alternative to drilling holes in the sky.

--
HaM

[FlyingForFun]

If you only have 55 hours, my suggestion would be to go and do some flying.... solo! By all means get a few hours with an instructor if you're not current or need to be brought up to speed on UK procedures. But you need to start making your own decisions about where you're going to go, what you're going to do, whether the weather is good enough and so on - and solo flying is the only way to do that.

Once you've done that, then it's worth doing the IMC rating (or as 1/2-Mexican says, some aeros, or alpine flying, or floats, or tail-draggers, or whatever else you fancy).

Make sure you read the requirements for the CPL in LASORS, and make sure you satisfy all the requirements. The are requirements for a certain amount of solo time, and a long cross-country, as well as total time, which must be satisfied either before you apply for the license or before you start the course (far easier to satisfy all the requirements before you start the course, though, except maybe total time).

I think you are probably in the most fun part of the training now - the bit where you can do whatever you like. So whatever you decide to do, make sure you enjoy it!

FFF
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[Just another student]

Thanks for the posts guys. As you said FFF, this is probably going to be the most enjoyable part of the training, and I am looking forward to getting out there and doing soom real flying! I have looked at the exact requirements for each section of the training and will tailor my hour building in order that I will have exactly what I need when I come to take my CPL/IR.

Regarding my training as a whole, am I correct in saying that the more multi experience I get, the better? If that is the case, would it be worthwhile trying to tailor my CPL/IR to get as much multi time as possible? I read a post made by a representative of a flying school, and she suggested that they could fit around 40 hrs of multi time into the CPL/IR.

Apart from which FTO to use, I have to decide where and when I go to complete some flying in the states. I don't want to be hour building in the USA and then come back to the UK leading into my CPL/IR. I think it would be best for me to fly in the states in the near future and then come back and complete my European hour building before the more advanced courses start. I am looking at the possibility of going out to California, as I feel it will offer me a greater variation in my flying, rather than just zipping up and down Florida. Any ideas?

Regarding the comments made by Half a Mexican and also FFF. I totally agree with what you recommend. From what I have been reading, I need to make my CV stand out from the others, and showing that I can turn my hand to other types of flying may well help.

Cheers

[Dean Johnston]

Just been loooking through LASORS section D1.2(D) JAR-FCL CPL (A) MODULAR COURSE FLYING TRAINING/EXPERIENCE REQUIREMENTS. It looks like you need 150 Hours before you can start the CPL Course and 200 Hours before you can apply for a CPL licence.

D.J.

[Jinkster]

In in doubt shout!!

Ask your school or any other school, oxford or cabair and see what they have to say. I am sure they will be willing to help if you mention doing the CPL with them.

[YYZ]

To apply for the IMC you need to have done 10 hours PIC since the issue of you PPL & then the 15 hours required for the course.

Thats what i got told last week by a CFI anyway?
YYZ

[Just another student]

Before you take the IMC test, you have to complete 10 hrs PIC post PPL, of which 5 hours have to be cross-country hours. That is what I have read from Clive Hughes's book. I need a few hours before my IMC anyway.

[FlyingForFun]

Thats what i got told last week by a CFI

Or.....

That is what I have read from Clive Hughes's book

Although I think Clive Hughes' book is excellent, and I'm sure your CFI knows what he's talking about, the best place to look is LASORS, which will give you a definitive answer:

When applying for an IMC Rating you must produce logbook evidence of having met the following flying requirements:-

a. 25 hours total experience as pilot of aeroplanes following PPL issue and which must include (b), (c), (d) & (e) below;

b. 10 hours as Pilot in Command of aeroplanes to include (c) below.

c. 5 hours as Pilot in Command of aeroplanes on cross-country flights.

d. 15 hours as Pilot under Training in instrument flying with an instructor in a dual controlled aeroplane (during IMC course). [And some provision for simulation time].

e. [Not relevant to the discussion - details the amount of the 15 hours which must be instrument time]

Once you've satisfied b) and d), you will automatically have satisfied a). d) and e) will be satisfied on the course itself. Which leaves only b) and c) that you have to do yourself - 10 hours PIC post PPL issue, of which 5 must be cross-country (i.e. more than 3nm from the airfield of departure). The requirement is to satisfy these before applying for the rating, which means you can start the course, and even do the skills test, before you satisfy the requirements if you like, but you can't send the paperwork to the CAA until you've met the requirements.

FFF
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[benhurr]

I fly a lot out of EGNX and did my PPL/IMC/Night there. Did my IMC as part of my hour building.

I did all of my hour building in the UK - visited about 30 different airfields from Newcastle down to Perranporth (and Dublin, Le Touquet and Ostend).

PPL hire rates for a C152/172 PA28 are extremely reasonable at East Midlands Flying School and Jason is a good IMC instructor.

Get the hours and then worry about your CPL/IR.

[Just another student]

benhurr, I am basically trying to get a feel of the pros and cons for different ways of going about the rest of my training. I think i'd be daft if I didn't plan ahead. However I agree that I should deal with the hour building side of things fairly soon.

Does the CFI do the IMC testing for East Midlands Flying School (as he is a CAA examiner) ? Do they offer any block discounts at all? I plan on phoning them up shortly to get the IMC booked up, not that I will get much flying done with the weather as it is.

[benhurr]

There is a choice of 2 IMC examiners, same as the PPL ones. I am unsure about discounts but I suppose it cant hurt to ask.

I would suggest doing the IMC course in the 172 as the instruments are much better than in the warriors - it is really stable too and dead easy to fly.

Have fun - I will probably see you up there.

ben

[mad_jock]

Its always worth making sure the examiners know you are paying cash in my experence. If they are airline types the payment in cash means they don't need to declare it which is worth an additional 40% to them.

MJ