Wanting to learn to fly, any advice?
 

Hello all, firstly I am new so sorry if this is in the wrong section, I have tried to find best where to put this though :)

I'm seriously looking into learning to fly, well give it a go and see how things goes, but I really think it's something I'd just love to do.
I've read up about it abit and I know it would be alot of money and hard work but I'm prepared for that.

I just wanted maybe some opinions or advice off people who have a private licence or maybe who went on to a commercial job?
Is learning to fly something anyone with determination can do?

Any replies much appreciated :)

Probably best place to start is by booking a trial lesson at the closest flying school to you and see whether you like it or not. Alternatively you could have a go in a glider for less money. It will then be easier to decide what you want to do. If you want to go commercial a private license is a good start, but if you just want to get in the air, gliders or microlights might suit your wallet better.

Good luck with it! :)

Learning to fly will teach you so much more than learning to fly.
By all means try gliders but I wouldn't make a judgement on it until you've tried power too.
I tried gliding at your age and it didn't tick my boxes but 20 years later (too late for me to take it seriously) I got a PPL and have thoroughly enjoyed it.
At your age you should, money permitting, try everything you possibly can so you can be sure to find something that you like to do in order to make a career out of it. Too many people get stuck in a rut early on in adult life and by the time they wake up and smell the roses they're too burdened by responsibility (much of which is probably imagined anyway) to make changes.
Go for it Girl!:ok::ok:

I see you're in Manchester. You are well placed! Go along to Lancashire Aeroclub Flying School at Barton (now called City Airport) and fly with the CFI, Martin Rushbrooke. He will kindle any enthusiasm you have and get you set on course for your licence. He will give you realistic advice on time and costs etc.

I did my PPL at LAC back in 1978 and flew from Barton for many years. Martin taught me aerobatics in our Chippy, and did my conversion onto the Yak52.

You cannot possibly do better than a session with him!

As above but you may find gliding a bit "lots of time on the ground helping out" off putting.
Trial lesson is the way to go. Then you will be hooked & join the impoverished happy people. There are several ways it can be well affordable once you get the licence. Estimate £6 to 8k. I did mine on the pension at age 67 & wished I were your age. The rut thing.
Go for it:ok::ok:
Edit: yes this is the place to put it.

Thanks for the replies guys :ok:
I was thinking of booking a trial lesson at Barton as it's just up the road from me.
Money is of course always an issue, but I start a new job on Monday which is a good start :rolleyes: I do however have the money for the trial lesson, just need to get around to booking it!

I was wondering, all the groundwork stuff is it? Is that something that with hard work you can get your head around? I've always got the impression that maths is needed to some extent.

Yes. It's a skill that can be taught and learned though it involves things that surface bound people never have to think about.

Lizz, I don't think there is much by way of Maths in the PPL syllabus. Speed/ distance and time is about as tough as it gets! There's also a bit of unit conversion but it can all be done fairly simply on the whiz-wheel (CRP-1 flight computer). Knowing a bit about trigonometry might be useful, but is definitely not essential. If you got Maths and science GCSEs or similar you won't have any trouble.

I'd say that at least at the PPL level you definitely can get your head around it, and one certainly does not need to be a math genius. On the other hand, absolutely loathing numbers and refusing to do some calculations by hand and/or on the paper (e.g., weight & balance, time and distance, top of descent, wind triangles) is probably not the best point of departure ;).

Thank you 500man!
I got C's in GCSE maths and science, bit rusty now, or rustier should I say but I'm sure if it were something I wanted I'd make that extra effort. My dad's also a genious when it comes to maths and science so I can always ask him!

I'm going to take the plunge and book a trial lesson and see how it goes from there.
I have failed to mention that I have been quite a nervous flyer in recent years :ugh: but it's due to a lack of control and I actually (weirdly) really want to go ahead with this!
Fingers crossed!

I started learning at 19, got a PPL at 22 (money slowed me down!), and eventually gravitated to a commercial licence. I've even used it once in a while! (Actually I use it most days, but mostly for the knowledge and credibility in an aviation management job, rather than through being paid to fly as often as I' prefer.)

Flying is a wonderful occupation - for fun, for work, or for something things in between. It also develops really valuable personal skills in planning, attention to detail, multitasking, and clarity of thought and communication. Plus it is tremendous fun.

The exams are a fair bit of work, but demand more hard work than high levels of natural aptitude. If you were up to grade C GCSEs they shouldn't challenge you intellectually.

I agree with others, start with a trial lesson or two, do a PPL (or gliding equivalent, or an NPPL Microlight - the last is where I started), and see how much you enjoy it and whether you want to take it further.

There are several schools at Barton, and I've never heard anything against any of them - so go and have a look around. It's a friendly little airfield, albeit next to some quite scary airspace - but if you learn there, it'll just be part of the scenery.

G

Hi Lizz, I fly (not work, there is a difference!) for a living. It is possibly the best decision I made a good few years ago. I made the decision late but persevered. I would go for it. You certainly appear to have the passion. The training at any stage is challenging. You spend more time at a desk than behind the controls but some of the stuff is interesting and some of the stuff is boring but necessary. The further you go in your adventure the less flying you will do. In a commercial sense, you become more of a flight safety manager and system operator than a stick and rudder pilot. But that is not to put you off the idea. It is still a great feeling landing a 250000kg (that's 250tonnes) aircraft with 300+ souls on board in a weird and wonderful destination. For example, I am currently in west Africa and heading off for another 7/8 hours flying in 24 hours. My suggestion is to talk to a good few people who fly. Listen to the positives and negatives, both points and people!!! Decide if you can balance the two and if that balance is in the right direction, go for it. The cost is a lot but if you pursue the commercial road you and your wallet will soon forget about the expense. You do of course have to choose the right job!!! Best of luck!

Lizz

I'm a former flight instructor, now airline pilot in the USA. First off, go out and BUY the book: "Stick and Rudder" by Wolfgang Langweische (USA Test pilot from the 40's) Read it a dozen times...each reading is worth dozens of hours of real flight instruction.

Second: The amount of math is very little. Arithmetic skills like understanding there are 360 degrees in a circle and that the opposite direction of 360 degrees (north, also known as "0'' degrees) is south or 180 degrees.

You will have to know how to add,subtract and multiply and divide. Its not rocket science.

Try to learn in pipers and not cessnas...much more civilized but a bit more expensive. (see the movie, "Goldfinger" for the ultimate Piper product placement)

Be in good health and get your medical certificate before you spend too much money...it would be rotten to spend a fortune on learnin ofl nlyto find ot you are in ill health( you don't have to be wonder woman)

Go out and watch the planes takeoff and land...get a very cheap vhf receiver to listen to the radio calls.

Hi Lizz,

just do it.

I am based in Hong Kong and meet pilots often, from all over the world. You will be surprised how many started with very little. As other said the studies are no issues. Others did it, you can too.

Great advice guys, thanls :ok::ok::ok:

That maths sounds ok, I just haven't used it in years really, never had need. I was a check in agent, then I've been an estate agent for about 2 months and on Monday I'm doing something not too sure what it is but I know it's not mathematical :rolleyes:!!

Anyway, I did want to ask, the medical aspect, generally I'm in good health but I was wondering about eyesight? Mine's corrected by contacts although it's not 20/20. I would assume it's more than just reading the next planes reg like driving? :confused:

Hi Lizz,

As others have said, once you have had your trial flight, you will be hooked. As to the maths....i am certanly no mathemetician...others have said that you need a "C" in GCSe Maths and Science. Well, I would say thats..although very helpful, not essential. I have an "F" at GCSE maths and a "c" for GCSE science and yes, I do struggle very much with teh Maths and the Science study/nav planning. Whizz wheels and conversions...I hate em! (especially when you ahve your licence you can use GPS ;) ) QFE/QNH calculations...nightmare - especially when ATC and the ATIS give you the Airfield QFE and RPS QNH anyway. Converting degrees C into degrees F...why??!! Will I REALLY need to know this when i'm flying? (now I guess someone is going to jump in and say why I DO need to know these things) i'm just leaving that bit out of my Met study. But really, my goal is that licence and I will overcome my maths and science difficulties to do it.

If you have the motivation and the passion to succeed and get that licence you will. The end goal is whats driving me forward.

So Go for it!! have fun, get your dad to help you with the maths and science, and your FI to help with Nav and other ground study and you'll get there. If you already haev friends who are pilots, ask them for help too. My pilot friends are invaluable - even with just morale support when things are going badly. Spend time around your club or school, no time at the airfield is wasted.....its also very enjoyable (especially with a plentiful supply of cheap coffee and chocolate :ok:)

Good luck with it :D
GQ

Well, I just sent off for a 'voucher' for a trial flight, just have to wait for it then I can book it!
I would have just rung up, however starting my new job on Monday and not knowing what times I start/finish etc it might be best to leave it a week or so before I book it so I know what's happening.
But it's paid for so there's no changing my mind! Well there is, but I don't want to do that!:D :D

A warning.

If you bought the voucher from a school fine, but there are companies who sell trial flight "experience" vouchers at outrageous markups.

Deal with the flying school / club people, as far as you can.

G

Yes I've bought it through a school.
Are the companies you're referring to the ones who do track days in fancy cars? They are a complete rip off! :=

That's the ones, you obviously didn't need the warning. Good on you.

G

That as well!

I'm lucky, working all my life in aviation but seldom as a professional pilot (more as a professional who uses the fact he's a pilot) I've been lucky enough never to lose my enthusiasm for aviation. But, I've seen many who have.

It's noticeable that you're far more likely to find 30++ year old aviation enthusiasts working in light aviation than in "heavy metal" - 10 years seems to beat the enthusiasm out of most in that area. Well on the civil fixed wing side anyhow, there aren't many unenthusiastic fighter pilots, and most helicopter pilots seem pretty happy as well.

G

Liz
 

Lots of good advice above.

Flying from Barton would seem to be the best place for you and unusually you have a choice of two establishments with good reputations, The LAC has a few votes in the pages above and apart from one person on this forum I have never heard a bad word about them.

The other establishment on the airfield is Manchester Flight Training, I have to declare an interest here in the fact that I have done some business with them.
I like the guys for the honest way they do business and don't cut corners but most of all for the way that invoices are paid within a few days of being presented. In these hard economic times I find them a breath of fresh air and would recomend that you take a trip to Barton and see both establishments before deciding on a place to fly as I am sure that both of them would do a good job in teaching you to fly.

learning to fly !
 

i am having a trial lesson with lomac aviators at liverpool airport this month on a piper tomohawk. i have been passionate about aviation since i was a teenager and have decided that it is now or never. the prospect of being able to travel around the uk and europe in a light aircraft is appealing as i love travel. my problem, which i have had has since i was 20, is that i am really scared of turbulence. :{

does anyone have any suggestions ?

Go for it!
 

I've allways loved flying and just recently got my learning permit for PPL. Even though it's going to cost me quite alot (wouldn't surprise me if it's even more expensive here in Sweden) and our local politicians don't give much for private flying (with 3 airfields closed down just in the last 10 years) I'm still going for a ppl!

If you're like me who loves the idea of reaching the skies, i say go for it.:ok:

Whilst you're training nobody's going to let you go flying in non-trivial weather, and after you've got your licence you can choose not to.

If you keep the recommended ten miles away from thunderstorms, which is a jolly good idea if you wish to stay alive, you won't come across anything very bumpy.

Have you considered why you are scared of turbulence?

Thats a good place to start in order to figure out how to overcome your fear.

I can give you the experience, the maths, or the history of why turbulence is no great issue - as syncmeister asks - what worries you about it?

G

rog most of being scared is the fear of the unknown. Once you have been up in it a few times and been flying the aircraft you don't even think about it.

Had one student who claimed they were petrified of it. By the end of the PPL the were saying "yeha jesters dead" when ever we got any which was funny the first time but ......

thanks G it has been a numer of years since I last went up in a light plane so it may be diferent this time - I will right down my exact impressions straight after the flight

I've recently passed my PPL at Barton with Manchester Flying School, very good set up, flexibility and better aircraft. Some brilliant instructors too, very helpful and experienced.

I've on occasion bounced off Mainair Microlight School at Barton; they've always struck me as very decent and competent people with a lot of enthusiasm for flying.

Flying both light and both flavours of microlight aeroplane, in my opinion, for pure enjoyment, microlights are most definitely not second to light aeroplanes where fun for your money is to be sought.

G

My trial lesson's with LAC, I'll see how it goes and have a snoop around at the same time while I'm there.
I was telling my friend before I booked it and she was like bloody hell! Do you know how much it costs? She seems to think it's typical of me, doing things on the spur of the moment (booking holidays last minute, buying brand new cars) I enjoy it though, it's one of the few pleasures I get out of life being so spontanious!!! :D

Weirdly, turbulance has never bothered me! Only when a plane drops and you get that weird feeling in your stomach. I assume as I pilot you get used to such sensations?
Like I said in an earlier post I have odd moments when I'm flying, usually of impending doom :eek: I think that's watching air crash investigation too much though! :ugh: Also, a lack of control, I'm the same when other people drive me places, can't stand it!

Ps, air police, thanks for the advice. If I am totally honest though a little time on the ground learning what's what will be all part of it for me, I'm a total novice, the closest I've ever got is flight sim 98 - and I crashed every time! :bored:

Excellent! If you can, fly with Martin, though I'm sure the other guys / gals are good too.

Let us know how it goes.

Payment
 

Hi Lizz,

I should like to add emphasis to the point already made by airpolice.

All flying clubs/training organisations operate on a wafer-thin profit margin and operating costs are high. As a result, there is a dismal but more or less constant trickle of places going bust. The trouble is that this usually happens without any warning. A place that perhaps seemed to be doing OK yesterday is gone by tomorrow.

Cash flow is almost always a nagging worry to them and one of the ways they try to keep money in the kitty, especially when they are beginning to fail, is by offering package discount deals for the PPL or NPPL (as the case may be). As a result, just too many student pilots have seen their club/FTO go bust overnight with several thousand pounds of their hard earned cash, which usually they never see again.

So perhaps the most important lesson you can learn from us for the moment is; NEVER, NEVER, NEVER PAY UP FRONT FOR A COURSE OF FLYING, and ALWAYS PAY WITH A CREDIT CARD.

Good luck Kid,

BroomstickPilot.

Thank you for the advice, is it normal procedure then to pay after?
Credit card though - yes! Very wise idea :ok:

Credit card?
 

Why do you say it is essential to pay with a credit card? Assuming one is following the first part of your advice and paying in arrears I can't see why one would need the insurance aspects of a credit card.

I personally pay for my lessons by credit card because the club lets me and I get points, but I don't see that paying by debit card would be that bad an idea, e.g. if the club kicked up a fuss about the fees. You're paying for the instructor/aircraft time that you've just used, so how would you ever have a claim that it wasn't delivered?

Certainly at my club paying afterwards is standard procedure - sometimes a while afterwards in my case as I've forgotten to pay once or twice!

Also a valid point, I think the credit card was in reference to buying bulk lessons?
Correct me if I am wrong.

To be honest if I go ahead with lessons I'll find the best way I can to pay considering I have odd debts to pay off!

Lizz as Genghis has already mentioned....don't forget microlights,

Lots of people have the mindset that they are bits of tube and a lawn mower engine...nothing is further from the truth these days,

Go and look at Chris Copples Mainair Microlight School at Barton....if you have not looked at a modern 3 axis microlight I think you will be amazed,

If your thinking of getting into commercial aviation though the NPPL M will be no use to you....but its £££££ cheaper,

I fly micros from Ince Blundel on the coast just north of Liverpool....its prob even cheaper to learn there...there is a fantastic school there.

To be honest yes I have that view of microlights, mainly from what I remember off a sooty programme from when I was younger :rolleyes:

While you mention commercial, I meant to ask, what qualifications do you need? Anything specific? I only did my GCSE's then went to college to do travel and tourism and a cabin crew course (what I used to want to do)
Would - if I went down that path (getting ahead of myself but I am a control freak for planning stuff!) I need other qualifications?
I'd be quite happy to do so, in fact I've been thinking of doing something anyway to bump my qualifications up anyway especially now I'm older and have more an idea of what the working world is like.
I'm quite curious also, as the few people I know that tried to get into commercial jobs all seemed to have done/were doing degrees.

You into a different ball game there Liz. Academically you will be fine with but the market is pretty rubbish just now for low houred commercials and you will have to put in a fair bit of planning into the next 1-2 years and also work out how your going to finance £45k.

There are multiple ways of winding your way through the system and depending on your situation some maybe better than others.

As a quick run down

PPL 7-8k
ATPL theory plus exams 3k
Medical class 1 (you need to go and get this done first at gatwick) £500
Hour build 105 hours 12K
CPL 8k
IR 15k
MCC 2k

And an extra 4k for skills test and license issue.

If you want to go the instructor route its another 7k on top of that.