How much damage to grass?
 

It's a long-standing ambition of mine (and of a colleague, for that matter) to land a plane on the pitches at the school where I work.

There's no problem with the quality of the surface (like a billiard table, grass mown to within a 1/4" of its life!) or the amount of room available, but how much damage would a moderately well-flown landing and take-off do to their beautiful surface, either dry as at present or when wetter? That's likely to be the main objection.

Tim

(edited to add: type could be PA28, C152 or T67 if folks reckon one is less damaging than the others!)

Damage to grass? NONE

Damage to pocket through lack of insurance cover when you hit the goal posts? LOTS

Without wishing to sound naive, why on earth do you want to take this risk?:confused:

What risk? he's already said there's plenty of room and the surface is good. It's fun to land aeroplanes in all sorts of unusual places - fields, beaches, gardens etc. - the aeroplane doesn't know it's not landing on an airfield. :O

To attempt to answer the question, assuming the wheels won't sink into the surface (in which case you should wait 'till it dries out before doing it), one landing and one take off should have no noticable effect on the surface.

SSD

Somewhere on the Rotorheads forum is a thread about a pilot who was prosecuted for landing on a sports field. The circumstances were different from the intention here, but it shows that there might be someone watching who would be more than willing to dump you in it with the CAA.

None of those are particularly short field machines, can you get a C150?

G

I disagree, G. A 150 will get in...but not out. (the others just won't get in!)

If he has the landowner's permisson and is not contravening any ATC restrictions and is flying within the bounds of the ANO, how could he be 'dumped in it with the CAA'?

I don't think we know the TORA or if there are any obstructions on the climbout. If these are favourable, a 152 should not be a problem.

SSD

Fair point, maybe a light 150 with a reasonable wind will get out (as probably will a C152), I'd not even try with any of the others.

I must admit, for something the size of a sports field, I'd rather use a suitably short field microlight - either a 912 engined flexwing, or something like a Savannah or Sky Ranger.

G

Have yer never been to Barton-aircraft land and take off there all the time-and it's like a BOWLING GREEN!

From the looks of things, as someone above mentioned so long as you attain the landowner's permission there should be no problem.

You may want to check out 'Rule 5' though - as far as I'm aware, the only exceptions to the 500' rule with regards to take-off and landing must be under the circumstances that the manoeuvre is carried out at a 'Government, Authority or Licensed aerodrome'... not a school playing field.

But that's just from what I recollect of Air Law - have a look yourself.

Cheers, Jack.

That would preclude most private strips and many beaches. :\

I'm assuming 'sports field' isn't your average football pitch (if nit is, he'll need a helicopter). I've taken off from Hough End playing fields in Manchester in a 172 - but that is quite a big area of land and was an airfield a long time ago (but it may have been bigger back then).

SSD

There are exemptions from most low-flying rules when landing or taking off in accordance with normal aviation practice.

The exception is the 1000' rule over built up areas (the 1500' as it used to be) - there is no exemption from this except at Government or licensed aerodromes. So if your approach and depature can be carried out without passing overhead a built up area, it should be no problem.

All the discussions about whether a particular type would or would not make it in and out of the field are meaningless without knowing how big the field is. Certainly my old school playing fields would have been big enough - several rugby pitches, back to back, are bigger than many grass runways once the posts are removed.

FFF
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ISTR that he was prosecuted for landing in the carpark NOT the sports field.

Damage to field non if the field is not too wet.

If the field, permission etc is all pukka have fun. Make sure not to attract adverse attention. Not worth the headache.

You can come closer to objects etc than 500ft for take off and landing as is custom for normal aviation practice.

The Banbury Helicopter Case was landing at a rugby club which the guy owns!

Irrespective of performance considerations, I would want to cover my butt legally.

i.e. As it is a sports pitch, you would probably be best advised to ensure someone on the ground has sorted out control of entry etc to the landing area as you operate in and out.

There are several bits to Rule 5, it's probably best to read it carefully.

The 500ft rule is relaxed when taking off or landing.

The 1000ft rule (previously known as 1500ft rule) / not-over-built-up-areas rule can be relaxed for T/O and Landing at a government or licenced aerodrome. Whether it applies, or is relaxed, depends upon the class of individual aircraft.

Hence, I suspect, the slight confusion.

When you decide to do it don't forget to inform the police/fire/ambulance people as there will be more than a few calls I suspect, to them, shortly after.............

Shaggy Sheep -

I am fully aware of how fun it is to land away from airfields. I rarely land at airfields!

My point is that in this litigious world that we live in, the chances are very high that someone will not see the enjoyable side of it and make the poor chap's life hell. I sincerely hope it goes without a hitch but there is a lot to lose if something gets damaged or there are any BA pilots living nearby (they're the worst for whinging....)

If I was going to do it (and I have!) I would get written permission from the owner (council if it's a state school or trustees if it's a public school) and make sure you have it handy (and I did!)

Make sure someone is on the ground warding off dog walkers, joggers and those people who hang around half dressed in the outdoors at this time of year with their hands up each other's clothes.

Good luck

P.S The choise of a/c concerns me somewhat. Is the PA28 a slab winged 180 or a Charger? If not please be careful....

The question was how much damage to the grass not about the sensibility of the action:


I have a grass strip, the only damage is done IF

the strip is soggy wet and mini-furrows are ploughed

OR

the strip is dry and max braking can cause wheel lock up and ensuing scorching, tearing out of the grass.


If the grass is a couple of inches long it does retard the aircraft more than 1/4" (?) but this works in both arrival and departure!

Hope that helps.

OR you could go gliding over it and not find any lift and have to land in the field :ok:

If I were you I would send a PM to Flying Lawyer, who knows about these things.