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-   -   US rocket launch cancelled after small plane enters restricted airspace (https://www.pprune.org/private-flying/601781-us-rocket-launch-cancelled-after-small-plane-enters-restricted-airspace.html)

rotornut 12th Nov 2017 00:38

US rocket launch cancelled after small plane enters restricted airspace
 
A private pilot who can't read a map?
US rocket launch aborted after small plane enters airspace - BBC News

Pugilistic Animus 12th Nov 2017 01:28

Check NOTAMS!

Capn Bloggs 12th Nov 2017 02:48

Class E airspace? See and Avoid! :}

LeadSled 12th Nov 2017 03:28


Class E airspace? See and Avoid!
How droll !

Bloggsie, my dear chap,
Your contempt for US airspace management is well know, after all, the rest of the world is out of step, with Australia, "the only soldier in the battalion in step", the only country "doing it right".

The Pugilist has got it right, the whole area is covered by R ( R as in restricted, just as a reminder about R-) -6604, activated by NOTAM, with areas outside the legal jurisdiction of the US designated, in accordance with treaty obligations, as W- (Warning) areas.

Quite unlike the Australian practice of promulgating allegedly Restricted (and Prohibited) area outside Australia's national boundaries, actions that, being contrary to international law and treaties, have no legal effect.

A lot of history here, one of the oldest test ranges/ experimental flight test sites in the US, and the world, for that matter.

Capn Bloggs 12th Nov 2017 03:55


the whole area is covered by R ( R as in restricted, just as a reminder about R-) -6604, activated by NOTAM,
Was that an RA1, RA2 or an RA3?! :}

LeadSled 12th Nov 2017 22:27

Blogsie,
Just R-6604 will do.

aterpster 13th Nov 2017 00:52

If I am more than 12 miles off shore, cannot I choose to ignore a Warning Area? (from a regulatory standpoint)

Pugilistic Animus 13th Nov 2017 02:18

After passing the ADIZ I believe that you can indeed enter a warning zone at your own risk

A Squared 13th Nov 2017 04:41


Originally Posted by Pugilistic Animus (Post 9955331)
After passing the ADIZ I believe that you can indeed enter a warning zone at your own risk

ADIZ is entirely unrelated to a country's statutory authority, something else and often extends well outside a country's territorial airspace.

LeadSled 20th Nov 2017 00:55

aterpster,
WARNING areas will only be found outside the boundary of a country, generally 12 miles, but there are a couple where the country is a bit behind on treaties so it could be only three miles.
In a country like Australia, with purported P, R and D area well beyond the 12 mile limit have no legal standing.
The USA is very particular about conforming the the Law of the Seas Treaty (by whatever its precisely correct name) , not true of every country.
ADIZ is not relevant.
Tootle Pip!!

Pugilistic Animus 29th Nov 2017 17:55

The ADIZ in the US is 12 miles

A Squared 29th Nov 2017 18:25


Originally Posted by Pugilistic Animus (Post 9973338)
The ADIZ in the US is 12 miles

No, it is not. The ADIZ has nothing to do with the extent of sovereign territorial waters or airspace. An ADIZ is an area in which a country has stated that it reserves the right to identify aircraft operating in that area which appear to be on a course to enter the county's sovereign airspace. It is not a claim of the airspace as sovereign airspace. An ADIZ typically extends well beyond territorial airspace.

Pugilistic Animus 1st Dec 2017 01:27

Fly offshore here in the US 12 miles from the coastline then turn back without A DVFR flight plan and you'll get a nice close up view of F15s or 16s...

A Squared 1st Dec 2017 02:55


Originally Posted by Pugilistic Animus (Post 9974888)
Fly offshore here in the US 12 miles from the coastline then turn back without A DVFR flight plan and you'll get a nice close up view of F15s or 16s...

That is most likely true, but saying that doesn't make the ADIZ 12 miles. The ADIZ has a very specific definition and it has very little to do with the extent of sovereign airspace. I'm not sure why you keep trying to defend your misconception, there's an abundance of information available on what an ADIZ is. Wikipedia, for example has a pretty good description of ADIZs, they also have a chart of the North American ADIZ and it's pretty clear that it has nothing to do with the 12 mile limit, in fact extends far beyond it in many places. Sometimes my friend, it's a lot easier to simply accept that you were mistaken, instead of trying to insist that you were correct, when all the evidence is telling you you were mistaken. This is one of those times.

Pugilistic Animus 1st Dec 2017 03:27

https://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publications/us_restrictions/airspace/

A Squared 1st Dec 2017 03:45


Originally Posted by Pugilistic Animus (Post 9974937)
https://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publications/us_restrictions/airspace/


Give it up, buddy. You're only making yourself look foolish. There is simply no way that you can "prove" that the ADIZ is the same thing as the 12 mile territorial limit. It isn't. Period.

custardpsc 6th Dec 2017 11:22

Useful USA adiz map showing various dimensions. Also no ADIZ when crossing from Canada

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_De...f_the_ADIZ.jpg

Maoraigh1 6th Dec 2017 18:33

Elon Musk may have solved this problem on his Mars rocket trial, if the nosecone Tesla has sensors for automatically avoiding other vehicles, pedestrians, etc, and the Tesla computers are linked to the rocket motor control system. Enabling the rocket to detect and safely avoid Piper Cubs. ☺


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