Terry Holloway didn't say he wasn't a fan of Maurice Kirk, but he did describe him as he is seen by many people!
However, I wonder what Sam thinks of Maurice who is seemingly disrupting the Vintage Air Rally, and was asked to leave and has not. The detention in Ethiopia was almost certainly for other reasons than Maurice.

The pilot sits in the back seat.

The Rally has certainly had much wider publicity because of Kirk.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...lew-there.html

It is worth pointing out that he did not ship his Cub to Crete but started the journey to Cape Town from a farmers field in the West Country just a few weeks ago.

How many 71 year old UK pilots could achieve that alone and without support?

He has flown some amazing adventures over the years but sadly does not fit in to the gin and tonic aviation community.

Actually, quite a lot of private pilots can and do fly long distances unsupported!

And who is Jay Sata? What are his credentials for commenting on Maurice Kirk and linking her to Tracey Curtis Taylor?

Terry,

Some posts have vanished which may have given you some insight to the 'linking'.

Believe me when I say that there is a significant difference between alone/solo and pretending to be alone/solo.

You won't have to explain to Jay Sata about the nuts and bolts about flying long distances as a PPL unsupported. He's done it.

For me, the passage that intrigues me is this.

"Terry Holloway didn't say he wasn't a fan of Maurice Kirk, but he did describe him as he is seen by many people!"

Who exactly are these people?

From what I've read he sounds an utter liability and exactly the last person you'd want anywhere near an aeroplane.
He shows no regard whatsoever for the law (which he clearly believes is ay, way beneath him) and is utterly unrepentant even when punished for serious offences by courts of law.

Why does anyone defend or support this lawless jerk? He's a shocking and disgraceful "ambassador" for aviation, that's for sure.

"From what I've read"

Exactly, and there lies the danger, until you start to scratch below the surface and all is not what they would like you to believe.

He's ok. I would trust him much more than the other one.

TH - The links/similarities are numerous. Private aviation, Africa, expedition, retracing, solo, vintage, rule breaking, disregard for procedures, crashes, notoriety, controversy, Sam Rutherford and now another name, one that links an aviatrix to an award now commenting on Maurice and Jay Sata.

I just don't know how he does what he does and gets away with it. You would have thought that at his age you would have slowed down a bit and taken things a bit easier. I even reckon he was in court shortly before his departure from the UK for driving a vehicle (that was towing his aircraft) without insurance.

But he does make the world more interesting. I just hope he doesn't hurt others or himself.

Well, one could start with the CAA and work down through every
part of General Aviation where Maurice has had contact!
He is a very amusing chap, and probably is an able stick and rudder man, but being a pilot is rather more than that.........

The Daily Fail article with its pictures of Maurice withcrashed aircraft does not provide good publicity for the Rally!

What on earth is the "gin and tonic aviation community"? What an inane comment!

Gin and Tonic aviation community
 

Terry Holloway posted It is the part of the general aviation community that indulges in small talk and networks over their achievements at black tie gatherings

You are a key part Terry.Air League executive and Honourable Company of Air Pilots liveryman.

You knew TCT long before she was 'awarded' a framed address from the Air League on which your were chairman of the awards committe.That is apparent from a quick google of your name,Marshalls Aerospace and TCT.

Here is why she got your award.

http://www.airleague.co.uk/wp-conten...chApril_16.pdf

To quote you...

So please tell us why you never corrected her claims in the media!

What did she get the award for?

Never mind the 'Outreach' claims just post what she did apart from sitting onboard a highly funded jaunt with a commercial pilot up front.

To put it bluntly Kirk never got as much as a whiff of recognition for flying a Cub from the UK to Sydney and then on to Japan during the London to Sydney Air Race. The winner was a well funded rebuilt Aerostar flown by commercial pilots.

Here is a question for you Terry.

What was so special about TCT.

Taking three months on a flight Amy Johnson did in 21 days.

Staying in first class accomodation with a large support team.

Having a commercial pilot in the front seat who built the Stearman

Not exactly hardship.

As for the 'outreach' I look forward to a full breakdown of what that means.

Why did Ewald Gritsch not receive one last May?

If Kirk makes it to Cape Town from that wet field in the Quantocks will you at the Air League consider him worthy of an A4 certificate in a frame?

I doubt it.

The Rally has just arrived in Kenya after the Ethiopians managed to figure out where they and the Sudanese managed to mess up.

For the second time in two flights, Maurice is a no show. We have launched (again) an overdue aircraft process (now Kenyan rather than Ethiopian). We suspect he was trying to fly directly to Nairobi but has run out of sunlight and landed somewhere.

Next of kin have been informed, but whilst many of his piloting skills are very poor (rules and regulations to start), his ability to drop his cub into a small field for the night is impressive. We hope he is okay and will continue in the morning.

He is no longer part of the rally, but we have been helping him with everything (fuel, accommodation, oil, permits, flight plans etc. etc.) until Kenya.

Sam,

I'm quite sure that you know this already but Maurice's tracker hasn't moved since this morning. Any reason why?

Unsupported Browser No 31



No 35 appears to be lagging too.

We don't believe he's switched it on in days... Deliberately.

For the others, the weakness in the system is the wetwear! :hmm:

Hi Sam,

Thanks for getting back. I don't understand the turning off of the tracker at this stage of the flight to win the race. Did he tell you this?

Surely he must make the scheduled stops where you have arranged fuel?

Next of kin will not worry about Maurice.

He will have dropped in somewhere and sleep under the wing.

I suspect he plans to beat everyone to Cape Town.

The local fauna might find him tasty:uhoh:

I suspect he will be the predator :-)

Today's news of Maurice, who has had his third engine failure in the same number of flights, from Sam Rutherford via a Facebook paste:

Maurice is safe! We heard he had an engine failure and landed (not at an airfield) in South Sudan but had a puncture on landing. He’s fine, we think the plane also. Locals found him and called a Brit in Juba they recently worked for. He contacted the British embassy in Juba.

Jay Sata has asked elsewhere on PPrune if Maurice Kirk should be recognised for an award for his flying exploits. My response, as Chairman of The Air League awards committee was that a suitable nomination should be written and sent for consideration to :Air League/HCAP/RAeS/RAeC/LAA. He probably could qualify for thr LAA Will Wadhams Trophy for navigation as long as flight planning, airmanship and aircraft maintenance are not factors! But then as he operates under the auspices of the LAA, that might not be an issue!

Well done Terry. You just lost all credibility with me.What a crass and stupid last paragraph.
I suppose awards for 5 star hotels and luggage carriers are more your line.:mad:

"as long as flight planning, airmanship and aircraft maintenance are not factors! But then as he operates under the auspices of the LAA, that might not be an issue!"

I can think of more than one inference to draw from this comment, and I've decided the most likely one is that it says more about the writer than anything else

Terry - He should certainly win an award for weird and another one for getting away with what he does. Anyone who can operate so far from the norms that we take for granted, not hurt anyone and still live is certainly noteworthy, as this thread proves.

But as you are mentioning awards for navigation, flight planning, airmanship and such things can you tell me how TC-T can possibly quality for any award? She doesn't plan, has clearly demonstrated and even brags about her total disregard for the law, shows dreadfully poor airmanship, had questionable navigation skills, even with a GPS and had two interesting and very public crashes. A female Mauruce Kirk if you like. I can not reconcile the lack of differences between them when it come to flying.

PM

A certain person is coming across as everything that GA shouldn't be - elitist.

You (know who you are) have an air of arrogance in some of your postings that I do not like. Not a good trait in the cockpit or on the ground. I believe the 'H' in a certain organisation stands for honourable...

With respect, I welcome the fact that Terry is prepared to come on here and put his arguments. Yes, he made a snarky comment a few posts ago; but pretty much all of us who have contributed to the TCT saga have done that at some point in the debate (me included!).

Absent answers to the questions I asked in the TCT thread, I have yet agree with what he has said but that's no reason for the kind of ad hominem attacks to which he has been subjected.

Let's all play the ball and not the man: if we do that, we have a better chance of getting to the truth.

Yet another £.02 bites the dust....

Steady on posters. Reports of Mr. Kirk's progress are welcomed, let's keep it to that.

A recent presidential candidate broke all the rules and won. Perhaps he will recognise Mr. Kirk as a kindred spirit and make him FAA Administrator :p

I wish TCT could be left out of all of this. I can't read about anybody doing a cross-country flight without comparisons being invoked. It devalues other people's achievements when the first positive thing to be said about them is that they've done it better than TCT.

Back to this thread: I've never had the pleasure of meeting Mr Kirk. Generally speaking I don't find the anecdotes of his antics particularly appealing, yet people seem quite fond of him. I've clearly come late to the party, so can anyone fill me in?

@abgd: I fully concur with your first paragraph. But as was said elsewhere: advertisers on this site will be delighted, so forum management might well be quite happy too.

Quite why anyone would applaud Kirk is frankly beyond me....

From BBC News 14 years ago: BBC NEWS | UK | Wales | 'Disgraceful' vet struck off

Before nanny removed it, I posted that the only award Kirk was likely to find himself being awarded was a Darwin Award.

I knew of Maurice Kirk, through a friend who used to fly a Tiger Moth DH82 at Cardiff (Rhoose) about twenty years ago. This guy is fascinating, his battle over being struck off as a vet, years of difficulties with the South Wales Police and fighting the judicial system often as a litigant in person in the higher courts. In one directions hearing in Court from the dock he asked the judge if he could pass a cheque to his sister (as he was on remand) to pay for a lawyer, the Judge asked if he had it in his pocket, he replied that it was three inches up his rectum, to which the judge responded he would not allow him to remove it in court.

There are lots of you tube video's of him including of him in the London appeal court, in which he was removed for shouting at the judge, his friend was sent to jail for filming it! Following his arrest for selling a unregistered deactivated machine gun, he was sectioned under the mental act, wrongly in my opinion, and held in a psychiatric unit for three months. There is also a video of him being interviewed under caution by the South Wales police for threatening to burn down the house of the psychiatrist who falsely sectioned him, I don't think it actually meant to burn the house down! I think he was just angry and frustrated that the police would not disclose his medical records.

It's not for me to judge his airmanship, as I don't have first hand experience of his flying, but with around fourteen engine failures seems rather high, and I wonder if the additional two engines failures on the current Africa trip are a fuel management issue.

The most recent development, is he appears to be seeking asylum (for reasons I don't feel fair to mention on here) in Northern France with the support of the local mayor, this is interesting from a legal point as the UK leaves the European Union!

I should add that his aircraft G-KURK has a current permit to fly and the aircraft is insured, but what makes me wonder is what pilots licence he is using, as I it might be very difficult to ever convince the UK CAA of medical fitness to fly having been sectioned under the mental act, so is he flying on a French Licence or European Licence? I also wonder if on a UK permit to fly an aircraft can legally fly across Europe or does it require an EASA certificate.

I do not think Maurice Kirk has psychiatric problem, but just a very entertaining and amusing example of an eccentric Englishman. Someone really needs to make a screenplay about his life, I say staring John Cleese.

Finally, Maurice if you reading this I wish you all to best for a safe arrival in Cape Town, but do not attempt as you have previously mentioned a further leg to the Falkland Islands afterwards!

I have no objection to any individual being eccentric.
However, when this impinges on the time, resources and indeed safety of others, then that is another matter.
Pratting about in the part of Africa that he has been flying over shows a complete lack of regard for what the consequences for him and, much more importantly, for others, could be.

BEagle

As I have said many a time, never let the facts get in the way of a true story.

As you already know, people like yourself continue to peddle this sad story.
On the surface, it's shock, horror, wow! It's only when you start to see below the surface and observe the true facts you begin to realise the corruptness of 'the establishment,'

Yes, it's true, Maurice does not suffer 'brown tongue' syndrome and is also very vocal in highlighting the error of their ways, however, like sh*t, they all stick together, and they are not ashamed when they are caught either. They then make the judicial process of putting a wrong back to right very hard.

Quite honestly, I would rather have 10 Maurice's than just a few of the unpleasant persons that I have come across whom would like you to believe that they are the pillars of the community.

I can't believe that he would want any awards either. He just wants to be left alone to fly his aircraft to the Cape.

Haraka

Sorry, but your understanding is quite simply wrong.

Facts here.

VintageAirRally requested landing permits from the Ethiopian CAA in mid September, and were told several times over several weeks that they were ‘under process’. Flight permits are usually issued hours, or even minutes, before the flight so VintageAirRally were not unduly concerned. Two days before the flight VintageAirRally checked again, still ‘under process’.

The day before the flight, still with nothing heard, VintageAirRally contacted the Director General of the ECAA, who told us he expected the permits to be issued the following morning. The airport manager at Gambella also confirmed that our fuel had been delivered and that VintageAirRally were expected.

VintageAirRally filed flight plans, which were accepted by Addis Control, and were then given clearance to take-off by Khartoum, with destination Gambella. All but one aircraft departed (the fastest to wait on the ground first). 40 minutes later, VintageAirRally were asked to return to the tower to ‘fix’ a permit problem. An hour after that, VintageAirRally were informed by the ECAA that the permits had not been issued due to a last minute intervention by the Ethiopian Ministry of Foreign Affairs. By this time it was too late to tell the other aircraft to return, low on fuel they continued to destination and landed. The permit for the last aircraft came through about an hour later (but too close to sunset). The permit was used the next morning to fly to Gambella and join the rest of the Rally.


https://www.facebook.com/VintageAirRally/

Jetblu


Your #77. I second that in all respects !

Jetblu.
I am very well aware of the contents of your enclosure.
What you seem to have overlooked is that Kirk had "left" the Rally by that stage and was expected to be heading North, back to Khartoum. Also he had switched off his tracker beacon from the 23rd November onward.
He then disappeared, causing much concern to the organisers, then reappeared at Gambela, having apparently put down in open country for the night, or so I have been informed..
Following the VAR's release, he then disappeared for a second time, was overdue (triggering, again, a series of emergency actions from VAR) and, it subsequently transpired, had put down again, this time in South Sudan, following an alleged engine failure. The third so far since coasting in, I believe.

Haraka,

Nothing or no one has been failed. What you now cite is all old news.

There was another engine failure yesterday with catastrophic consequences. Luckily nobody was hurt.
A Stearman was subsequently written-off with no chances of sleeping under that wing.

I can see the point that you are trying to make, but I understand that he is now a free spirit away from the rally, so Maurice rules now apply.

Jay Sata asked if the Air League would consider an award and I invited him to submit a nomination. How does that lose credibility? I carry my own baggage and seldom use 5 * Hotels! I occasionally have, like Maurice slept under a wing! So there!!

Because it will probably be ignored?



(Whoops, sorry- " Considered in depth and then finally decided against" )

I agree all that!

Is where you lost credibility with me Terry. Your paragraph is seen by more than just me as a bitter and ill informed comment on the LAA.

The awards committee will consider all nominations submitted which will be judged on their own individual merits.
Personally I find Maurice Kirk entertaining, amusing and interesting company, but I am certain that won't influence other members of the committee, if a nomination is received. The Air League is undertaking its annual trawl for awards in the aviation press and elsewhere, including, a thread somewhere on PPrune. I am certain that "the hate TCT" brigade will wish to link this request for nominations with previous awards, so they might like to look up who has recieved them in the past! Actually quite an impressive list, which does include one or two who might be considered to be eccentric!

I have a huge regard for the LAA, notwithstanding what I and many others regard as "poor handling" in the case of the award and withdrawal of the award to Tracey CT, and I fail to understand your translation, of my words as "bitter".

".....a thread somewhere on PPRuNe".

It's here http://www.pprune.org/private-flying...ual-awrds.html


But once upon a time there was an another 'outreach' programme called "Jim'll fix it." But despite many complaints from various people that were seemingly ignored, the truth finally emerged. didn't it. The rest is history.

Similarly, albeit on a much lesser scale, the Air League and other organisations have also been linked with the scandal and controversial TC-T shenanigans so any awards from here wouldn't hold much weight, I wouldn't have thought, but good luck with your endeavours.

That said, the creme de la creme of aviation awards must now surely come from the LAA.
The LAA have showcased total honour and integrity to the GA community, haven't they.

HARAKE made an interesting comment in earlier post (76) about "the consequences for him (Maurice Kirk), much more importantly, for others", but to be honest, i think the rescue resources in Africa would be very limited and I wonder how much survival equipment including water Maurice an he other aircraft will be carrying.

As for sleeping under the wing in mid Africa, I would certainly would want a malaria net, not least as some anti malaria drugs do not mix well with piloting. Again if you prang you aircraft in Africa and there are other considerations, such as the risk of blood transfusions and how long it might take to get to a hospital. I knew someone who was mauled by an elephant, and it took so long to get hospital (48 hours) he died.

Further to the potential health issues in Africa if things go wrong, its important to consider issues such as political situations that can arise rapidly, I say that as I very nearly got caught up in a military coup in West Africa.