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-   -   Is booking out a legal requirement? (https://www.pprune.org/private-flying/558648-booking-out-legal-requirement.html)

Oldpilot55 24th Mar 2015 09:35

Is booking out a legal requirement?
Anyone know? It is a source of constant discussion at my club.
If it is legal what is the definition?

Jetblu 24th Mar 2015 09:57

This subject has come up often over the years. As far as I am aware there is no 'legal' requirement for booking out. However, you may find that booking in/out is in the t & c's of the club 'if' you are a member.

From my personal experience, the few times that I have forgotten to book out the issue is usually raised by known jobsworths.

Heston 24th Mar 2015 10:12

No legal requirement. It may be stipulated by the airfield operator - and they are likely to have good reasons for this such as conditions in their planning consent or the like.

piperboy84 24th Mar 2015 10:44

Back in the early 90's there was a certain vertically challenged and freshly minded FI at Perth who used march around with a clipboard who appeared to take great delight in demanding and challenging owners upon their return from flying as to correct entries in the sign-out sheet, inspite of the fact it was not his job or business. One day he hassled me and I asked him why he had such a bug up his ass about the sheet. He informed me that it was necessary as if there was anyone smuggling drugs he would have a log of the flights and he could relay this info to the cops, I pointed out that if indeed there was any smuggling going on the traffickers were hardly going to sign his shytee wee book.He never took much to do with me after that, I always felt the guys talents were being squandered teaching folks how to fly, he was far more suited for the guard tower at Bergen Belsen.

Gertrude the Wombat 24th Mar 2015 13:33

Who would an acrft owner at his own strip book out with?
Anyone who might care if s/he didn't come back when expected? Wife/husband/etc?

gasax 24th Mar 2015 15:15

The Bentine thing was incorporated into the rules of the air clause 20(depending upon your interpretation).

Under SERA there does not seem to be an exact read across - which given the arrangements in Germany is surprising - but that I suppose is covered by the Aerodrome permissions part of things (unless Germany has posted a list of exemptions as we have!).

chevvron 24th Mar 2015 17:43

There actually is a legal requirement (brought about by the above mentioned 'Bentine' story) for you to leave basic details of your intended flight with a 'responsible person'. Additionally, some airport operators require you to 'book out' for each flight, in some cases by telephone in advance, but most accept an RTF call.
Don't forget that military 'booking out' differs from the civil version in that your details will be passed to your destination and they will be told when you are airborne.

Jan Olieslagers 24th Mar 2015 19:06

What is "booking out"? I have never come across anything by that name. Then again again, I've never flown in the UK, so it might well be just another...

I do am used, though, to closing the flight plan (if any), and writing down the landing in the aerodrome logbook (if any). Plus completing the entries in my pilot's log and in the plane's log.

gasax 24th Mar 2015 19:10

You're right Jan, it is a very British thing directly due to political influence from a bereaved father.

But the question is - does SERA and its British embodiment still have that requirement - I've had a look and I cannot see it!

Is this a gold plate removal - even if accidental?

Jan Olieslagers 24th Mar 2015 19:33

Thank you, Gasax, but after reading more thoroughly I am not so sure. What DOES it mean, after all? Leaving some notification of where you intend to fly before take-off? Filing a flight plan includes that info, and a good deal more. Even when not filing a flight plan, I am supposed to mention my destination in the aerodrome log before take-off.

France has no such aerodrome logs, but I think Germany does have them. Holland must have them too, they have just about everything to discourage one from private flying.

9 lives 24th Mar 2015 21:50

In Canada, we don't have "booking out" It's none of anyone's business when and where you fly, unless you are requesting access to controlled airspace. If you are required to file a flight plan, or flight notification, you are responsible for closing it too. But this rarely has anything to do with an airport, or operator, unless you chose them as your "responsible person".

The nearest I know of is "Booking it", which can either mean "but the ticket [for a commercial flight]" or, run or drive very quickly [to escape], seemingly a teenager term, 'cause I guess they need to escape every now and then...

Maoraigh1 24th Mar 2015 22:02

Leaving some notification of where you intend to fly before take-off?
Based at a full ATC airfield, I have to book-out by telephoning ATC before my radio call for taxi permission." Land-away" and I give my destination. "Local" otherwise. I give endurance, duration, and number on board. I'm then free to go wherever I want in Class G airspace. Local can be 2 hours + at 100kts, with no requirement to talk to anyone once away from the airfield.
Our Group have a log sheet which we use to record T/O, Land, time and airfield, - but when operating from a strip I've carried the sheet in the aircraft - which would not be helpful if I disappeared.

fireflybob 24th Mar 2015 22:59

Is booking out a legal requirement?
It certainly used to be, this from an old "Guide to Visual Flight Rules (VFR) in the UK"

Rule 17 of the Rules of the Air Regulations 1996 requires a pilot intending to make a flight to inform the Air Traffic Service Unit (ATSU) at the aerodrome of departure, an action known as ‘Booking Out’. Filing a FPL constitutes compliance with this Rule. The action of ‘Booking Out’, however, does not involve flight details being transmitted to any other ATSU.
Whether it's been included in the Standardised European Rules Of The Air (SERA) Regulation I am not quite sure but I guess you'd find it there if it is.

This from another:-

• Transition to the SERA rules covering VFR night flying
• Some modifications to flight planning requirements. For example, the UK expects to keep the existing process of ‘booking out’ at an airfield before a flight but will consider whether to introduce some form of ‘booking in’ at the end of a flight
• A change from the use of quadrantal cruising levels to semicircular cruising levels to align the UK with the rest of the world.
Legislation aside I think it is common sense to "Book Out".

Mach Jump 24th Mar 2015 23:02

There used to be a requirement to 'Book in/out' but I suspect that when we adopted the Single European Rules of the Air it got lost in the transition.

...but when operating from a strip I've carried the sheet in the aircraft - which would not be helpful if I disappeared.
Best thing to do here is just call a friend (responsible person) tell them that you intend to fly, text them the details, with the Tel. No. for D&D, (we all know what that is, don't we?) and ask them to raise the alarm if you don't call them back by an agreed time.

Or there's always the 'note under a stone' at the departure method. At least anyone investigating your disappearance might then have a chance of finding out who you were, and your intentions.


On Track 25th Mar 2015 00:27

I never cease to be amazed by the eccentricities of British aviation.

When I first saw the title of the thread I thought it must have something to do with an insurance company's requirement that an instructor sign out an aircraft to a flying club member or to a student pilot training solo. That's fairly standard procedure in this part of the world.

Private jet 25th Mar 2015 00:39

I never cease to be amazed by the eccentricities of British aviation.
& you should see some of the eccentrics they let do it :}

PA28181 summed it up very nicely but that's probably anathema to people that still use terms such as round-out and overshoot...

fireflybob 25th Mar 2015 01:10

I never cease to be amazed by the eccentricities of British aviation.
I feel the same way about some of the idiosyncrasies associated with flying in Australia.

Some of us will recall the case of Michael Bentine's son who went missing in 1971.

while his elder son, Gus, was killed when a Piper PA-18 (Super Cub, registration G-AYPN) crashed into a hillside at Ditcham Park Woods near Petersfield, Hampshire, on 28 August 1971. His body, together with that of the pilot and the aircraft, was found on 31 October 1971. Bentine's subsequent investigation into regulations governing private airfields resulted in his writing a report for Special Branch into the use of personal aircraft in smuggling operations.
They had not "booked out" and Bentine who was a well known comedian was very vocal about this aspect.

I can't understand why anyone would not want to book out (or whatever you want to call it). When I say this I'm not talking about unmanned landing strips but places where this a presence in the form of A/G, AFISO or even ATC.

Surely it's common sense to let someone know what you intend to do and how many are on board etc?

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