Yes but your risk is increased if you do.

And if you don't want to accept that increased risk you shouldn't have to because of some pillock's rule book.

I am more than happy flying a flying school standard heap of crap sans ASI alitimeter, radios and everything else as long as the engine is running and is unlikely to stop, around the highlands of scotland with only me onboard.

Doesn't mean I would be happy doing it in deepest darkest england next to CAS or with pax apart from another ex reprabate FI that knows the score.

And neither would I expect another pilot to be happy doing what I would accept.

CumulusRider

That is not the point as ones mans "its just a nuisance" might be another mans "I want to land."

The whole point is that we all have failures of one item or another and make a decision on whether to continue the flight or not.

As a general rule It is far better to be on the ground and sort it out rather than to press on.

Press on maybe ok but you then need to consider other future events along the line where loss of radio would make those worse.

Frankly self proclaimed Hitlers like that? You are probably best holding your ground and giving them a mouthful back as to feed their Ego just encourages the same attitude to the next person and there is no excuse for rudeness.

Pace

I do think that the person's reported attitude to Genghis was poor. But you do have to look at the big picture. We are not aware of the reasons that Tatenhill does not want flex wings, however its their choice. You also have to look at the situation, no radio and no intercom in a flex wing, does that threaten the safety of the flight? If not then according to the wording of the Strasser agreement it's not a "real" emergency. If the engine failed was the com's kit required for a safe outcome - of course not. In fact historically there have been many instances of engine failiures in flex wing, the vast majority not reported to anyone. I know this first hand having spent time over the last twenty years at Long Marston (the engines are much better now).


I have a large field at the back of my house, there is often something that fly's parked there. Would I be upset if someone dropped in? If they had a genuine emergency (something that threatened the safety of the flight) then NO. However if they dropped in for a problem with something that they could have safely continued the flight with then I would not be happy. Simply because of the likely raised eyebrows of my neighbours and my sensitivity to not upsetting them (and not wanting them to think the field might get busy...). I have to get on with them after the visitor has gone.

Genghis obviously did not know the restriction at Tatenhill, an innocent mistake with a disproportionate response by a jobsworth. But is it really worth blacking the name of Tatenhill over that?

Personally the only time I take a jobsworth seriously is when they are dressed in DPM holding a gun!!

Is reporting the facts of an upsetting incident by an individual really seen as "blackening the name" of the whole airfield?

Btw, the airfield is Tatenhill, only one "t" in the middle.

While we are naming and shaming, can pressure be exerted on Belfast-Intl., Cardiff, Leeds/Bradford, London-Luton and Manchester?
I'm guessing that Luton and Manchester claim they are too busy (but then Stansted, which is twice as busy as Luton and pretty similar to Manchester is on the scheme) but what is the excuse for the others?
In NI Belfast-Intl would be a much easier approach in an emergency than Belfast-City / George Best.

GEP

I used to fly into Tatenhill a lot in twins and never had a problem! It was always a very quiet do your own thing sort of place.
I wonder if the attitude would have been the same if Genghis had arrived in a Cessna 150?
Maybe it was the type of flying machine the guy reacted against!
While a radio failure may not be a big thing in an aircraft like that it maybe to some and it is for the pilot to state his case and reasons.
Was it an emergency NO! is the Strasser designed for emergencies? NO
The Strasser was designed to stop an emergency situation developing by a pilot passing a useable airfield purely based on cost.

I once moved a Cessna 150 which had no nav kit apart from the radio.
The cloudbase was 1000 feet in light rain and as a river line went almost to my destination I decided to fly VFR below cloud knowing that if I kept the river below me I could not hit any high ground.
I was pushed down and down and now at 2-300 feet with more intense rain and cloud appearing below the aircraft I decided enough was enough climbed in cloud to the SSA and contacted a military base with the intention of using the radio for a PAR! luckily 25 miles on the weather cleared but no radio???

Pace

Pace - I agree, every time I have been there its been quiet, but the people I have seen have been friendly. Might be that the jobsworth just hated flex wings!!

Ghengis

On the way out shutting the door you should have flour bombed him from 30 feet :E splat splat splat!! :{

Pace

To be fair, that description also applies to my favourite uncle and many other very pleasant people.

G

Ok - Ginger and fat?

My uncle is grey and bearded. Not all people who are grey and bearded are my uncle.

G

I've landed several times at Lasham in powered SEP aircraft, admittedly for a purpose but certainly not on gliding business. Parham, Wormingford, Challock, Upwood and Rattlesden as well. Some have planning issues or movement limits for power aircraft. I personally think it's more like: "you power pilots can't possibly be as good as us glider pilots, so be a good chap and buzz off"

If you want to land at a gliding airfield that 'bans' power, just lob in unannounced, land exactly where you want, start making phone calls and when challenged, tell them you ran out of ideas and "landed out'. Works for gliders at the private strip I fly from which only accepts any aircraft by invitation...:E

I have been banned personally from the Hertfordshire hell hole that is Panshanger..... for force landing on the runway with a total & terminal engine failure without the owner's permission and for not asking permission on the radio. When I explained I would have landed at Heathrow in similar circumstances, it all got a bit heated. :rolleyes:

Another thing which works but takes some practice is to break out in uncontrollable and hysterical laughter occasionally pointing a finger at him then doubling over splitting your sides!
Works or you get carted off to the nearest Looney Bin :{

Pace

Like Genghis, don't think its ok to carry on at all if you have a sudden comm failure and don't know what has caused it.
I had a regulator burn out in an R44, the first symptom was the radio and intercomm cutting in and out. As I was deciding on which field to carry out a precautionary landing, several warning lights started flashing like a christmas tree along with the needles bouncing around. by the time we landed in a field we had lost all electrics, and had a completely burnt out regulator. Who knows if a fire might have ensued, had I not landed and shut down.
Different thing altogether having comms then losing them, than flying non radio, which is how I learnt to fly.
Also in a flexwing how do you know its not a loose wire thats about to go through the prop.

Hi folks

I have seen that you have put Turweston in the bad place list , please remove it , the owner the staff and the pilots at Turweston have no problem with flex wing microlights but the local council AVDC does, at the last planning appeal we fought hard to lose the restriction that had been imposed ,we did manage to get 3 axis microlights allowed but the flex wing rule was kept in place by the inspector running the appeal , this said we would never stop or chastise any flex wing pilot for landing if safety was involved .
2 weeks ago I had a flex wing land after the pilot was caught short after encountering a strong headwind, no charge and a happy chap, so do get your facts right before you go naming and shaming.
Regards Chris
.

Max, it seems to me that your post explains things much better than my just removing Turweston from my original post.

G

Chris

That does explain things far more. Having been a regular visitor to Tatenhill in the past I was surprised as I have always found the airfield laid back and its people friendly.
Nevertheless there is little excuse for being bombastic arrogant and dictatorial??
Some pilots may ask for such an attitude but not our Ghengis who is a highly respected individual here.

Pace

...and one 'tw@t' on the ground?

Maybe the bath colour clashed with the tent fly sheet strapped to the top.

Must admit there is so many ways these things can kick off.

My usual one is the old park into wind when its over 20knts in the work machine even when you tell tower what you are doing.

You can have a frothing at the mouth gorilla jumping out of the ops wagon screaming that your not parked as per the yellow lines. And you can have a ramp cop that smiles and opening line is "its a bit hairy today" and finishing line after shooting some krack is "take it you parked like that for start?"
And everything is fine. Were as the gorrilla you would have thought you had tampered with is 10 year old. And it can even be at the same airport just different shifts.

BEagle :ok: like

I've found the ground staff at Blackbushe to be universally charming and helpful, as well as their resident instructors, but the guy on the radio in the tower is quite the most officious annoying man I have so far had the misfortune to encounter.

Also Popham is an airfield that touts itself as being microlight friendly but infact their service is extraordinarily poor. I regurlarly find myself stopping by for fuel as its the only convenient place for me and I walk up to the ops desk and am ignored for anything up to 5 minutes before being asked whether I want avgas for my motorbike and looked up and down like I'm going to steal anything thats not bolted down.

Airfields that are good really seem to stand out. Dunkeswell has always been fantastic with a warm welcome whenever I stop by. Oxford was great for a proper airport and as such made an intimidating place much less scary for me when I was a low hour pilot. There is also a small airfield near Penrith that was unbelievably welcoming, with free hangarage and a donation of whatever you wanted to give for landing fees. The guy that owns it is a real gent as well.