Recommended airfield?
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Recommended airfield?
I've moved to Wimbledon recently and I'm looking for a new airfield to fly from. I've got a PPL (which shortly needs revalidating) and I would be looking to hire an aircraft, preferably a C152. The obvious places would be Redhill or Fairoaks. Any suggestions?
Choosing an Airfield
I live near Leatherhead and fly at Fairoaks with LTFC. We have 2 Pipers, a Warrior and a Cherokee 140. Judging by current bookings, weekends are getting a bit busy and if you can fly in the week, getting an aeroplane is easier.
There is also Fairoaks Flight Centre of whom I have no knowledge whatever, other than they also fly Warriors.
At Redhill, which for me is the same distance as Fairoaks but in the other direction (I went looking a few months ago so as to have a second string to my bow), I could only find Cabair - but I am told there are clubs - and thought them very expensive compared to LT. They also wanted a monthly "insurance excess payment" whether you flew or not. They have 172's but I don't know what else.
The difference of course is that they are a business (with paid staff) we are a club (with volunteers).
Suggest a quick internet search will turn up various web-sites, ours, Cabairs etc. to look at. http://www.cabair.com/ http://www.flyingzone.co.uk/flyingsc...y/surreyfs.htm (can't get our web-site to come up !!!)
Both fields have restrictions. We are tucked in the Heathrow zone and so can only depart/arrive from the South East or South West.
Redhill are in the Gatwick zone and have an entry/exit lane to the north until you reach the M25 when you can go east or west. Neither is anything complex but the unwary are occasionally caught out.
Lots of people on this and other forums have sung the praises of White Waltham and West London Aero Club and say it's worth the extra 20 minutes drive. Again I have no knowledge but no doubt others can fill you in.
I guess from where you live Biggin Hill is also a place you shouldn't discount without some research.
There is also Fairoaks Flight Centre of whom I have no knowledge whatever, other than they also fly Warriors.
At Redhill, which for me is the same distance as Fairoaks but in the other direction (I went looking a few months ago so as to have a second string to my bow), I could only find Cabair - but I am told there are clubs - and thought them very expensive compared to LT. They also wanted a monthly "insurance excess payment" whether you flew or not. They have 172's but I don't know what else.
The difference of course is that they are a business (with paid staff) we are a club (with volunteers).
Suggest a quick internet search will turn up various web-sites, ours, Cabairs etc. to look at. http://www.cabair.com/ http://www.flyingzone.co.uk/flyingsc...y/surreyfs.htm (can't get our web-site to come up !!!)
Both fields have restrictions. We are tucked in the Heathrow zone and so can only depart/arrive from the South East or South West.
Redhill are in the Gatwick zone and have an entry/exit lane to the north until you reach the M25 when you can go east or west. Neither is anything complex but the unwary are occasionally caught out.
Lots of people on this and other forums have sung the praises of White Waltham and West London Aero Club and say it's worth the extra 20 minutes drive. Again I have no knowledge but no doubt others can fill you in.
I guess from where you live Biggin Hill is also a place you shouldn't discount without some research.
Why do it if it's not fun?
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You might also want to look at White Waltham. Not quite as near as Fairoaks, but a far, far nicer airfield IMHO. Two very new C172s for hire, and lots of much older PA28s, as well as a couple of other things.
(Dave, are you sure you can't arrive/depart Fairoaks to the North? I'm sure an SVFR clearance wouldn't be a problem. I know I've routed directly overhead Fairoaks SVFR from the north, but never arrived/departed.)
FFF
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(Dave, are you sure you can't arrive/depart Fairoaks to the North? I'm sure an SVFR clearance wouldn't be a problem. I know I've routed directly overhead Fairoaks SVFR from the north, but never arrived/departed.)
FFF
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I live in Kingston and fly from White Waltham. About a 50 minute drive.
Lovely airfield and great club, and friendly instructors. Very professional. In fact, one of the best grass airfields around this part of the country in my opinion.
Loads of PA28s a couple of C172/182 as well. Not too difficult to convert though.
Lovely airfield and great club, and friendly instructors. Very professional. In fact, one of the best grass airfields around this part of the country in my opinion.
Loads of PA28s a couple of C172/182 as well. Not too difficult to convert though.
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I fly from Redhill (Redair 01737 822959) and we have C152s (standard and aerobat), Archers, a Turbo Arrow and Seneca IIIs based there.
There's also the opportunity to join the other Redair clubs at Shoreham and Blackbushe and fly from there as well.
Friendly, busy, professional folk and (I think) a nice field - spitting distance from Kent and easy trips down South. Have to take a hop around Gatwick zone, but it's no big deal as Dave Gittins said.
Feel free to PM me - or drop in.
Hersh
There's also the opportunity to join the other Redair clubs at Shoreham and Blackbushe and fly from there as well.
Friendly, busy, professional folk and (I think) a nice field - spitting distance from Kent and easy trips down South. Have to take a hop around Gatwick zone, but it's no big deal as Dave Gittins said.
Feel free to PM me - or drop in.
Hersh
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I used to fly from Redhill........ not sure about the entry/exit lane to the north.... must be a new thing. I used to fly with Redair. Not bad but not great either. Cubair (not cabair) are also at redhill They won flying school/club of the year a while back. And yes Cabair are there as well but cabair is cabair.
Also just as close is Biggin Hill.
Shoreham is about 40 mins drive from you or an hour or so one the train (and I know of a share for sale in an excellent C150..... cheapest flying in the country I reckon..... PM me for details)
Also just as close is Biggin Hill.
Shoreham is about 40 mins drive from you or an hour or so one the train (and I know of a share for sale in an excellent C150..... cheapest flying in the country I reckon..... PM me for details)
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I also rent from Redair at Redhill. Hersh, we may have met - I'm the tall guy in a '152 (if you hadn't guessed), often flying on a Friday afternoon.
The problem with Redhill is that it tends to waterlog in the winter and sometimes well into spring, severely limiting operations. If you have enough hours (not sure how many, definitely over 100) and the wind is favourable then you can use a short piece of taxiway instead.
TG.
The problem with Redhill is that it tends to waterlog in the winter and sometimes well into spring, severely limiting operations. If you have enough hours (not sure how many, definitely over 100) and the wind is favourable then you can use a short piece of taxiway instead.
TG.
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I fly out of white waltham. great airfield, 'cos there're lots of runways to choose from (although they can be a little on the bumpy side). good practice for noise abatement circuits too
some of the warriors are a bit tired (one of them at least has a sun visor held on with chewing gum LOL), but there is at least one new one, and a cub, and a couple of 172s.
All in all pretty good.
some of the warriors are a bit tired (one of them at least has a sun visor held on with chewing gum LOL), but there is at least one new one, and a cub, and a couple of 172s.
All in all pretty good.
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Thanks everyone for your advice. I think a visit to these airfields is what is needed now.
Having not flown from a grass strip before, do Redhill and White Waltham take long to dry out after bad weather?
Having not flown from a grass strip before, do Redhill and White Waltham take long to dry out after bad weather?
Why do it if it's not fun?
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I don't know Redhill well, only been there once, but Tall_Guy mentioned that they do get waterlogged.
White Waltham is generally ok though. The field can get very muddy in the winter, and it's not completely uncommon for one of the three runways to be shut, or for the airfield management to request that you try not to use the centre line because that's inevitably the worst part of the runway. But in the few years I've been flying from there, they've never yet had to stop flying because of water-logging.
FFF
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White Waltham is generally ok though. The field can get very muddy in the winter, and it's not completely uncommon for one of the three runways to be shut, or for the airfield management to request that you try not to use the centre line because that's inevitably the worst part of the runway. But in the few years I've been flying from there, they've never yet had to stop flying because of water-logging.
FFF
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I thought Redhill spent a fortune a few years back putting in an all singing-all dancing drainage system.
Shoreham has tarmac.... no waterlogging ever (except for fog if that counts ?)
Shoreham has tarmac.... no waterlogging ever (except for fog if that counts ?)
)
Recommended Airfield
FFF
Yep it is possible to depart Fairoaks to the north, the boys at Heathrow will often allow SFVR to cut the corner via Fairoaks, Ascot & Burnham but it's very runway direction and traffic dependant. Personally I've never tried it as you'd presumably have to negotiate with them by phone before taking off - anywhere north of the Fairoaks circuit and above 1300 ft QFE is a no/no. (come to think about it I've never seen any of our club depart northwards !!!)
I've always found it as easy to get a amble into the sky first then call for a service from Farnborough and go through/ just east of, their zone at 2400' QNH.
Hersham Boy
Am interested to hear about other clubs at Redhill - I only found Cabair the day I went visiting and they tried to make out there wasn't anybody else on the field or if there was they were practically inactive.
Perhaps you could PM me with some ideas of price, availability etc. - like I said Cabair were IMHO very dear but a second string to my bow is always useful. Like all clubs, chances are one aeroplane goes for it's 50 hr the same weekend the other one decides to develop a minor snag just after the maintainers went home Saturday lunchtime.
I have never had any problems with grass - I flew at Barton for about 30 hrs a few years ago. Main problem was having to wash the aeroplanes and not being able to use 27/10 half the winter - there was a slightly displaced 27N/10N though it got bumpy. Am off to Sandown on Sunday afternoon (Wx permitting) to try grass again.
SW19
Sorry if I'm hijacking your thread, hope you get something sorted out real soon - before the weather turns. Where did you fly before you moved to SW19 ?? Shoreham sounds more than 40 minutes drrive from Wimbledon though !!! Takes me over an hour from Bookham !!!
Yep it is possible to depart Fairoaks to the north, the boys at Heathrow will often allow SFVR to cut the corner via Fairoaks, Ascot & Burnham but it's very runway direction and traffic dependant. Personally I've never tried it as you'd presumably have to negotiate with them by phone before taking off - anywhere north of the Fairoaks circuit and above 1300 ft QFE is a no/no. (come to think about it I've never seen any of our club depart northwards !!!)
I've always found it as easy to get a amble into the sky first then call for a service from Farnborough and go through/ just east of, their zone at 2400' QNH.
Hersham Boy
Am interested to hear about other clubs at Redhill - I only found Cabair the day I went visiting and they tried to make out there wasn't anybody else on the field or if there was they were practically inactive.
Perhaps you could PM me with some ideas of price, availability etc. - like I said Cabair were IMHO very dear but a second string to my bow is always useful. Like all clubs, chances are one aeroplane goes for it's 50 hr the same weekend the other one decides to develop a minor snag just after the maintainers went home Saturday lunchtime.
I have never had any problems with grass - I flew at Barton for about 30 hrs a few years ago. Main problem was having to wash the aeroplanes and not being able to use 27/10 half the winter - there was a slightly displaced 27N/10N though it got bumpy. Am off to Sandown on Sunday afternoon (Wx permitting) to try grass again.
SW19
Sorry if I'm hijacking your thread, hope you get something sorted out real soon - before the weather turns. Where did you fly before you moved to SW19 ?? Shoreham sounds more than 40 minutes drrive from Wimbledon though !!! Takes me over an hour from Bookham !!!
Why do it if it's not fun?
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Dave,
Fairoaks is very similar to White Waltham in this respect. Not above 1500' QNH (1300' QFE) in the eastern part of the ATZ there. Procedure for special VFR is to change to 119.9 as soon as safe, while orbiting overhead. Don't know if the AFISOs would approve of that at Fairoaks, you'd have to ask, but as long as you're visual with any other traffic in the ATZ it shouldn't be a problem.
I did ask on this forum about getting contacting them from the ground, and got a reply from one of the controllers (can't remember who though - may have been ATCO Two?) to say don't bother - things change far too fast for them to be able to give you a clearance before you're airborne.
SW19 - please let us know what you decide!
FFF
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Fairoaks is very similar to White Waltham in this respect. Not above 1500' QNH (1300' QFE) in the eastern part of the ATZ there. Procedure for special VFR is to change to 119.9 as soon as safe, while orbiting overhead. Don't know if the AFISOs would approve of that at Fairoaks, you'd have to ask, but as long as you're visual with any other traffic in the ATZ it shouldn't be a problem.
I did ask on this forum about getting contacting them from the ground, and got a reply from one of the controllers (can't remember who though - may have been ATCO Two?) to say don't bother - things change far too fast for them to be able to give you a clearance before you're airborne.
SW19 - please let us know what you decide!
FFF
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Tall Guy - Hi... yes, deffo seen you! Not sure we've met, but I've noticed someone getting out of a 152 whom I though had no right to be able to get in it in the first place! I'll come and shake hands next time I see you. I'm the short skinny bloke usually in a big white Shogun (driving it, not flying it 
).
Re. Redhill drainage, the new soakways have considerably improved the situation, but it can still get unflyable in Winter. T/o and/or landing on the taxiway is 100+ hrs under Redair rules, certainly... might be airfield rules. It's tricky but not too bad, as long as you're not on x/wind limits!
Dave G - check your PMs.
Cheers all
Hersh
).Re. Redhill drainage, the new soakways have considerably improved the situation, but it can still get unflyable in Winter. T/o and/or landing on the taxiway is 100+ hrs under Redair rules, certainly... might be airfield rules. It's tricky but not too bad, as long as you're not on x/wind limits!
Dave G - check your PMs.
Cheers all
Hersh
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Getting SVFR going North out of Fairoaks is much less troublesome than people seem to think.
On 24 keep climbing on Runway heading, on 06 turn left downwind, and call 119.9 (as soon as you are airborne) "G-ABCD request Ascot Burnham" They will give you a squawk, tell you to remain clear and ask you to pass your message.
You reply "G-ABCD C172 just airborne Fairoaks going to Liverpool request Ascot Burnham not above 1000"
They will usually immediately clear you not about 1000' VFR.
I have done this hundreds of times and it is really no hassle.
There was a thread on the subject here
W
On 24 keep climbing on Runway heading, on 06 turn left downwind, and call 119.9 (as soon as you are airborne) "G-ABCD request Ascot Burnham" They will give you a squawk, tell you to remain clear and ask you to pass your message.
You reply "G-ABCD C172 just airborne Fairoaks going to Liverpool request Ascot Burnham not above 1000"
They will usually immediately clear you not about 1000' VFR.
I have done this hundreds of times and it is really no hassle.
There was a thread on the subject here
W
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Hi there,
Im a brand new PPL trainee and live in Richmond. I decided the easiest airfield for me was Blackbushe- staright down the M3 takes 35-40 mins. I am learning with Blackbushe Avaiation (part of Redair gorup) rather than Cabair.
Im a brand new PPL trainee and live in Richmond. I decided the easiest airfield for me was Blackbushe- staright down the M3 takes 35-40 mins. I am learning with Blackbushe Avaiation (part of Redair gorup) rather than Cabair.
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SW19,
Fairoaks Flight Centre has 5 PA-28 161s of varying vintages, plus a Cherokee 180 (old) and access to a TB10, both the last only available to PPL holders rather than students.
Costs are £140 / hr for Warrior solo wet, 135 for the Cherokee and about 160 for the TB10. Add 20 for instructor.
Downside to Fairoaks is single runway - if the wind is 15 knots @150 / 330 you might not wish to fly, while you could at WW.
I fly from there for convenience to home and office, not because it is cheap - it ain't!
PS - I know that Redhill was badly waterlogged in Autumn / Winter 2000/2001 'cos I had to take off and land on a paved taxiway!
HTH.
SD
Fairoaks Flight Centre has 5 PA-28 161s of varying vintages, plus a Cherokee 180 (old) and access to a TB10, both the last only available to PPL holders rather than students.
Costs are £140 / hr for Warrior solo wet, 135 for the Cherokee and about 160 for the TB10. Add 20 for instructor.
Downside to Fairoaks is single runway - if the wind is 15 knots @150 / 330 you might not wish to fly, while you could at WW.
I fly from there for convenience to home and office, not because it is cheap - it ain't!
PS - I know that Redhill was badly waterlogged in Autumn / Winter 2000/2001 'cos I had to take off and land on a paved taxiway!
HTH.
SD
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Thanks to all for your continued advice.
I did my PPL at Stapleford which has both asphalt and grass runways. I'd forgotten that I've used grass runways at Stapleford as throughout most of my training we used the preferred asphalt RWY 22L. I then started flying from Elstree which has an asphalt runway.
I'll let you know where I decided to fly from.
I did my PPL at Stapleford which has both asphalt and grass runways. I'd forgotten that I've used grass runways at Stapleford as throughout most of my training we used the preferred asphalt RWY 22L. I then started flying from Elstree which has an asphalt runway.
I'll let you know where I decided to fly from.