Getting to Grips with the IMC
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Surrey, UK.
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B_G,
As you're really only "simulating" the procedures and not the flying, FS98 (or higher) is a good bet.
Helps with the morse if you don't just practice the same ones all the time
Also helps visualise what the OBS/RBI look like - "fly" some of the more advanced models and you get an RMI instead, which is handy if that's what your training aircraft has...
Also good to just sit in the cockpit of the real aircraft and visualise what would be happening - and it's free
Pen and paper work, too
PS, check your PMs.
As you're really only "simulating" the procedures and not the flying, FS98 (or higher) is a good bet.
Helps with the morse if you don't just practice the same ones all the time
Also helps visualise what the OBS/RBI look like - "fly" some of the more advanced models and you get an RMI instead, which is handy if that's what your training aircraft has...
Also good to just sit in the cockpit of the real aircraft and visualise what would be happening - and it's free
Pen and paper work, too
PS, check your PMs.
Last edited by rustle; 9th May 2003 at 21:18.
Join Date: Sep 2002
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RANT is excellent, both as a tutorial and as a tool for trying things out. When trying things out it is both an advantage and a disadvantage that you don't have to actually spend any effort flying the plane. It's good in that (a) you're not kidding yourself that it is real and (b) you can concentrate on the navigation and use of the nav aids. However, (b) is also the disadvantage after a while - whilst nobody would argue that PC flight simulators are completely realistic that doesn't mean to say there is no value in them being as realistic as possible. In other words, having to concentrate on flying the plane (holding a level and a heading for example) whilst you're juggling other things in your head is a more realistic setup and ultimately more useful as a result.
Microsoft flight sim is fine for this stuff, but I prefer x-plane. The flight model is more realistic, which you may or may not care about, but also the whole thing is much more fluid and the response of the instruments are more realistic than Microsoft's. It is at least as good as the other simulators you mention, cheaper than most and has some interesting/fun other options too. You can download a trial from their website.
Microsoft flight sim is fine for this stuff, but I prefer x-plane. The flight model is more realistic, which you may or may not care about, but also the whole thing is much more fluid and the response of the instruments are more realistic than Microsoft's. It is at least as good as the other simulators you mention, cheaper than most and has some interesting/fun other options too. You can download a trial from their website.
Join Date: May 2003
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Groundbound those sound like sensible tolerances, I am not quite sure of the exact figures, I can see my trevor thom from here but I am not getting up to fetch it!
I always remember a little phrase that helps me, from my instructor actually!
'Never except second best'
Its as simple as that, if the dial doesnt say what you want, quite simply do somthing about it, 50ft maybe 50 ft, but its still not what you want!
Remember we are professionals now!
The four T's also help when making approaches, always go over the beacon, just a little to the side wont do, and start timing imediately.
TTTT (Time Turn Task Talk)
I always remember a little phrase that helps me, from my instructor actually!
'Never except second best'
Its as simple as that, if the dial doesnt say what you want, quite simply do somthing about it, 50ft maybe 50 ft, but its still not what you want!
Remember we are professionals now!
The four T's also help when making approaches, always go over the beacon, just a little to the side wont do, and start timing imediately.
TTTT (Time Turn Task Talk)
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Just resurrecting this cobweb-covered thread to record the happy news that I finished my IMC today with a successful flight test.
My preparation for this great event was to take a PA28 to a microlight rally, dine on a fine steak tartare, spend the night in a tent on the grass at Abbeville and then fly back for a spot of last minute revision before the test this afternoon. It seemed to do the trick.
The test involved tracking out of Lydd up to Detling, then in on the SND NDB to Southend, once round the hold, then an NDB approach to 06 in a rather stiff wind before the examiner had a bit of fun giving me various full and partial panel recoveries etc.
All-in-all a fairly intense hour-and-a-half, but, like banging your head against the wall, it was nice when it was over!
I know from other postings that FFF finished his a while ago - how is the rest of the Class of '03 getting on?
I had a very good instructor, but RANT and the IMC Confuser came in pretty handy too!
My preparation for this great event was to take a PA28 to a microlight rally, dine on a fine steak tartare, spend the night in a tent on the grass at Abbeville and then fly back for a spot of last minute revision before the test this afternoon. It seemed to do the trick.
The test involved tracking out of Lydd up to Detling, then in on the SND NDB to Southend, once round the hold, then an NDB approach to 06 in a rather stiff wind before the examiner had a bit of fun giving me various full and partial panel recoveries etc.
All-in-all a fairly intense hour-and-a-half, but, like banging your head against the wall, it was nice when it was over!
I know from other postings that FFF finished his a while ago - how is the rest of the Class of '03 getting on?
I had a very good instructor, but RANT and the IMC Confuser came in pretty handy too!
Join Date: Sep 2002
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Just at the end of 'basic' and moving on to 'applied' and the joys of the £20 go-around - plan on finishing before the end of September. Much to my relief it's getting easier, but I still hate limited panel...
PPruNaholic!
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Wish I could say the same... have postponed afetr a few hours due to a) instructor away too often with his day job as a 737 charter pilot... this time of year difficult to get him on weekends; and b) some family problems which meant I had to go back to Australia for a time.
Planning to kick off again in the winter...
Well done Fly Stimulator and FFF
Andy
Planning to kick off again in the winter...
Well done Fly Stimulator and FFF
Andy
Join Date: Aug 2002
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IMC Rating
I got an IMC rating back in the early 1990's, in those days you were not allowed to do an IFR approach to places such as Manchester. As such you had to get back to VMC before entering the zone. I thought that this was iffy to say the least and did the full IR. The difference is a massive one. Not only all the ground school and then two days with the CAA exams at Gatport Airwick but a flight test with CAAFU, never been so nervous in my life.... but if you are thinking of doing it and have the time ( Took 300 hrs of ground study using a correspondance course and a week's refresher training) then the benefits are worth it. I actually find flying on the airways dead simple and you have positive radar control all the time.
Worth Considering.
Dope05
Worth Considering.
Dope05
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Well yes, a full IR would be lovely (especially as many people say that IMC holders should never actually use the rating on purpose; only when they've blundered into cloud by mistake), but these days it is well beyond the reach of most recreational pilots in the UK both in terms of the cost and the amount of time that has to be devoted to the ground school and exams.
If I do decide to go for an IR in future it will be the FAA one. It's a shame we don't have something equally accessible on this side of the Atlantic.
If I do decide to go for an IR in future it will be the FAA one. It's a shame we don't have something equally accessible on this side of the Atlantic.
Join Date: Feb 2003
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Used my IMC rating for the first time in anger on Wednesday - I was going from Oxford - Old Buckenham - Oxford, arrived at 10am to find 400ft cloud base... As it began to clear around noon I booked an IFR departure slot and by the time I left I could have gone VFR, marginal, but decided to go for the IFR departure. Real feeling that it was all worth it, as I climbed into the cloud on a BOTLI departure, routed via WCO to CFD and then came out of the cloud at Cranfield. I had taken the precaution of ringing Cambridge to make sure they had suitable conditions so I didn't end up at Old Buckenham without an instrument approach...
Now was that a dangerous thing to do? That counts as using the rating deliberately... but it was the first bit of IMC flying I'd done for several months and if I don't use it, I'll lose the skills...
Tim
Now was that a dangerous thing to do? That counts as using the rating deliberately... but it was the first bit of IMC flying I'd done for several months and if I don't use it, I'll lose the skills...
Tim
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tmmorris,
I'm with you on this one. Having gone to the trouble of getting the IMC rating I do intend to actually use it. At the very least I believe that given the choice of scud-running at low level or climbing through cloud to fly VFR on top it will be a good deal safer doing the latter.
I'm very aware of the significant difference between IMC and IR training and skill levels since the friend who owns the aircraft I often fly is just completing the process of moving from IMC to IR and I've seen just how much extra work goes into it, even for somebody who used his IMC constantly.
As a new IMC holder I know that I have a very rudimentary set of instrument flying skills, but I don't want to let those skills atrophy. Using them (with instructor from time-to-time) seems like a good idea to me.
I'm with you on this one. Having gone to the trouble of getting the IMC rating I do intend to actually use it. At the very least I believe that given the choice of scud-running at low level or climbing through cloud to fly VFR on top it will be a good deal safer doing the latter.
I'm very aware of the significant difference between IMC and IR training and skill levels since the friend who owns the aircraft I often fly is just completing the process of moving from IMC to IR and I've seen just how much extra work goes into it, even for somebody who used his IMC constantly.
As a new IMC holder I know that I have a very rudimentary set of instrument flying skills, but I don't want to let those skills atrophy. Using them (with instructor from time-to-time) seems like a good idea to me.
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tmmorris
You did absolutely the right thing. The IMCR gives you very useful privileges and you need to be able to actually do them. So, do them, and do them often enough to keep current.
You did absolutely the right thing. The IMCR gives you very useful privileges and you need to be able to actually do them. So, do them, and do them often enough to keep current.
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At the very least I believe that given the choice of scud-running at low level or climbing through cloud to fly VFR on top it will be a good deal safer doing the latter.
CFIT due to wx is in my opinion as neglegent as running out of fuel. You should either not be there or know how to handle the situation.
Cheers
EA
