PPL (A) Skills Test
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PFLs during Skill Test
What radio calls are you supposed to make during you practice PFL into an active Aerodrome? Have only done practice PFLs into fields.
"xxx radio G-xxxx carrying out a practice PFL, request airfield information and circuit traffic"
What if there is circuit traffic?????
Mike
"xxx radio G-xxxx carrying out a practice PFL, request airfield information and circuit traffic"
What if there is circuit traffic?????
Mike
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Don't do what I did and say 'Look at that nice old airfield there - that must be Sleap' when actually it was Rednal, about 10 miles away... nearly cost me my pass, that... As he said afterwards, I should have kept my bl**dy mouth shut...
Similar consolation stories to the others, though: I nearly busted the Liverpool CTR (had to orbit while I sorted out the clearance) and my circuits were terrible (but I blamed a late decision to go around on the examiner - I had suggested a go-around at about 500ft (aircraft on the runway) and he had told me to continue, so when I went around at no more than 50ft he couldn't really complain...).
Good luck! I've got my IMC test today so I feel for you...
Tim
Similar consolation stories to the others, though: I nearly busted the Liverpool CTR (had to orbit while I sorted out the clearance) and my circuits were terrible (but I blamed a late decision to go around on the examiner - I had suggested a go-around at about 500ft (aircraft on the runway) and he had told me to continue, so when I went around at no more than 50ft he couldn't really complain...).
Good luck! I've got my IMC test today so I feel for you...
Tim
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Dont worry about the PFLs, EVERYBODY on my course hated them!! I even heard of one guy on a mates course who was so worked up about them he turned base at 3000' DOH!!! My examiner got a b0ll0cking during my GFT for mucking about aorund an airfield when he had told them on our departure we were off to do something else, trying not to laugh as would have cost me my pass!!!!
On another note, on my IR checkride coming down the ILS I called out 'Minimums' at which point he would usually say 'OK, hood off and land' or 'Go around' but not this time! His response was ' I like you so you are taking her all the way down or I will have you back again tomorrow!' . He took me down to 50' before he took over and landed, he did say he has had poeple land under the ood before but we were slightly too fast for that hence why he took control. I passed though
On another note, on my IR checkride coming down the ILS I called out 'Minimums' at which point he would usually say 'OK, hood off and land' or 'Go around' but not this time! His response was ' I like you so you are taking her all the way down or I will have you back again tomorrow!' . He took me down to 50' before he took over and landed, he did say he has had poeple land under the ood before but we were slightly too fast for that hence why he took control. I passed though
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When I did my test on Sunday (which I passed 
) the PFL was done out in the country and a glide approach done at the airfield, exactly as I had been taught. As I see it the whole point of doing a PFL is to practice/demonstate your ability to choose a suitable field and then to get the aircraft into a position where it is obvious you will get in, while going through the various checks. Doing a PFL at an airfield takes away what I think is the hardest part, which is the choosing of a suitable field.
Simon
) the PFL was done out in the country and a glide approach done at the airfield, exactly as I had been taught. As I see it the whole point of doing a PFL is to practice/demonstate your ability to choose a suitable field and then to get the aircraft into a position where it is obvious you will get in, while going through the various checks. Doing a PFL at an airfield takes away what I think is the hardest part, which is the choosing of a suitable field. Simon
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A good PFL tip is to turn to the right when the examiner shuts the throttle, so you can see what field he has spotted. On my test there was nothing very inspiring on the left hand side of the aeroplane - on the right hand side was a disused airfield...
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I agree with simonh
My PFL was in the countryside. The examiner was looking for me to find a suitable field and position the A/C into a circuit at the right distance to get "in" safely.
The actual landings came back at my own airfield.
One tip I would offer is what my instructor told me. Don't worry about the skills test because by then you have already done a QXC solo into controlled airspace which is far more nerve wracking as you are alone.
If you pass the syllabus you have already proved you can do it so go out and have fun.
My PFL was in the countryside. The examiner was looking for me to find a suitable field and position the A/C into a circuit at the right distance to get "in" safely.
The actual landings came back at my own airfield.
One tip I would offer is what my instructor told me. Don't worry about the skills test because by then you have already done a QXC solo into controlled airspace which is far more nerve wracking as you are alone.
If you pass the syllabus you have already proved you can do it so go out and have fun.
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There is a helpful guideline issued by the CAA to examiners - they are supposed to ensure that it is made available to candidates.
Did a search on the CAA website ( entered standards documents into the general search field - NOT the publications search field).
If the link doesn't work, look for Standards Document 19
Best of luck.
BTW - if you think the examiner has tricked you in any way - or you get something like the "go arounds" listed above (it's up to YOU if/when to go around), you should appeal under "Section 6".
Did a search on the CAA website ( entered standards documents into the general search field - NOT the publications search field).
If the link doesn't work, look for Standards Document 19
Best of luck.
BTW - if you think the examiner has tricked you in any way - or you get something like the "go arounds" listed above (it's up to YOU if/when to go around), you should appeal under "Section 6".
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I totally agree with most of what has been said here.
FYI, JAA/Licensing Division has just finalized a document called 'Flight Examiners Manual'. It's meant to be guidelines to the national CAA's as how their examiners should do the SkillTests. It also contains lots of guidance as to test tolerances, maneuvers. etc etc. It's a huge pile of paper but can still be worth a glance.
It should be here at the JAA website .
Enjoy!
cheers,
redbar1
FYI, JAA/Licensing Division has just finalized a document called 'Flight Examiners Manual'. It's meant to be guidelines to the national CAA's as how their examiners should do the SkillTests. It also contains lots of guidance as to test tolerances, maneuvers. etc etc. It's a huge pile of paper but can still be worth a glance.
It should be here at the JAA website .
Enjoy!
cheers,
redbar1
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Be wary of "test tolerances" - PPL, for example, says ±150 feet of nominated altitude.
Captain Examiner, however, would be more likely to growl at you for doing a negative G nose down to stay within ± 150', than he/she would if you did an immediate but smooth and gracefull cordinated descent from 200' high (provided you hadn't just climbed in to airspace that you shouldn't be in!!).
(Works for being too low, aslo - but hope I don't have to stress that).
Captain Examiner, however, would be more likely to growl at you for doing a negative G nose down to stay within ± 150', than he/she would if you did an immediate but smooth and gracefull cordinated descent from 200' high (provided you hadn't just climbed in to airspace that you shouldn't be in!!).
(Works for being too low, aslo - but hope I don't have to stress that).
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Keygrip,
Agree wholeheartedly! The average Captain Examiner would react as you say.
One problem with ST pass/fail criteria is just this: How much use the general terms "airmanship' and 'good judgement' etc. etc, being very difficult to quantify, versus the use of fixed tolerance limits, easily quantifyable but not neccessarily reflecting the above terms?
As FI, having as many tolerance limits as possible gives a 'measuring scale' of kinds to evaluate the training standards.
The legal bureaucrats (I know of) prefer the clear quantifiables of tolerance limits, and tend to dislike terms like 'airmanship'.
As FE, it's usually much less controversy connected to failing a candidate on landing 15 kts slow, than failing the person on 'bad airmanship'.
Anyway, the FEM is not regulatory, it is 'Advisory & Guidance Material' only, intended to increase the standardisation of ST between the JAA states. And in the regulations (FCL) it clearly states that 'The following limits are for general guidance'.
Luckily for the survival of the term 'airmanship'!
cheers,
Agree wholeheartedly! The average Captain Examiner would react as you say.
One problem with ST pass/fail criteria is just this: How much use the general terms "airmanship' and 'good judgement' etc. etc, being very difficult to quantify, versus the use of fixed tolerance limits, easily quantifyable but not neccessarily reflecting the above terms?
As FI, having as many tolerance limits as possible gives a 'measuring scale' of kinds to evaluate the training standards.
The legal bureaucrats (I know of) prefer the clear quantifiables of tolerance limits, and tend to dislike terms like 'airmanship'.
As FE, it's usually much less controversy connected to failing a candidate on landing 15 kts slow, than failing the person on 'bad airmanship'.
Anyway, the FEM is not regulatory, it is 'Advisory & Guidance Material' only, intended to increase the standardisation of ST between the JAA states. And in the regulations (FCL) it clearly states that 'The following limits are for general guidance'.
Luckily for the survival of the term 'airmanship'!
cheers,
