Clearing French Customs
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2001
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From: London
Clearing French Customs
Wonder if anyone can help? Flying to a non customs French Airfield soon, is it true that I can clear customs in the Channel Islands as opposed to a French Customs field? Planning for St Breuic, wouldn't mind dropping into Guernsey instead though.
Also do people have experieces/problems trying to claim VAT drawback from club aircraft? (ie do the clubs get ratty about it?)
cheers in advance!
Also do people have experieces/problems trying to claim VAT drawback from club aircraft? (ie do the clubs get ratty about it?)
cheers in advance!
Why do it if it's not fun?
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 4,782
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From: Bournemouth
Can't help with the first question, sorry.
As for the second question, though, shouldn't be a problem. The only club I've got any experience of is West London Aero Club at White Waltham. They positively encourage renters to claim drawback. There is a stash of forms in the operations room, and all the operations staff know how to fill them out and will help renters (and no doubt owners, too) if necessary.
Enjoy your trip!
FFF
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As for the second question, though, shouldn't be a problem. The only club I've got any experience of is West London Aero Club at White Waltham. They positively encourage renters to claim drawback. There is a stash of forms in the operations room, and all the operations staff know how to fill them out and will help renters (and no doubt owners, too) if necessary.
Enjoy your trip!
FFF
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Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 36
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From: SW UK
Again, no answer to #1, but for #2, I've had mixed experiences. One club that positively encouraged you to claim it and one that got all ratty about it. Guess which one I'll be hiring from for future international trips??
Just ask around beforehand, should be ok as long as your club ain't run by a bunch of cowboys. Also check the club rules, it'll probably be in there.
Oh, and its not actually VAT drawback, its fuel duty drawback 27.34p/litre last time I looked and make sure you claim it on all the fuel in your tanks (bought in the UK) not just the amount you use on the outward trip.
Just ask around beforehand, should be ok as long as your club ain't run by a bunch of cowboys. Also check the club rules, it'll probably be in there.
Oh, and its not actually VAT drawback, its fuel duty drawback 27.34p/litre last time I looked and make sure you claim it on all the fuel in your tanks (bought in the UK) not just the amount you use on the outward trip.
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Very much doubt that you can clear Customs/Immigration into France by clearing into the Channel Islands, after all, the CI are independent states which have their foreign relations handled by the UK.
Your best bet is to fly into a French "Customs Aerodrome" - Le Touquet or one of the others listed in Pooley's and go on from there.
Don't - whatever you do - attempt to fly direct to a non Customs aerodrome without French Customs approval. They don't like it. Osman Durrani fell foul of them a few years ago and wrote about his experiences in Pilot
Can't help with the fuel drawback point. So far as I'm aware, you send the form the Customs at Southend, they send you a cheque.
Point to note though, they'll only give the rebate on fuel that hasn't already been rebated. That is, if your aircraft has been abroad recently and fuel drawback claimed, if some of the fuel on board has already been rebated that will be taken into account in calculating the amount you get.
S
Your best bet is to fly into a French "Customs Aerodrome" - Le Touquet or one of the others listed in Pooley's and go on from there.
Don't - whatever you do - attempt to fly direct to a non Customs aerodrome without French Customs approval. They don't like it. Osman Durrani fell foul of them a few years ago and wrote about his experiences in Pilot
Can't help with the fuel drawback point. So far as I'm aware, you send the form the Customs at Southend, they send you a cheque.
Point to note though, they'll only give the rebate on fuel that hasn't already been rebated. That is, if your aircraft has been abroad recently and fuel drawback claimed, if some of the fuel on board has already been rebated that will be taken into account in calculating the amount you get.
S
Thread Starter
Joined: Oct 2001
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From: London
Cheers for the advice! I didn't think one could go via the Channel Islands, fancy the French Coast anyway.
Just to add another question though - I am correct in thinking that I don't need to clear customs leaving France? I can fly straight to a customs airfield in the UK?
Just to add another question though - I am correct in thinking that I don't need to clear customs leaving France? I can fly straight to a customs airfield in the UK?
Joined: Dec 2000
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From: London, UK
The latest circular on French intra-Schengen flights is here if anyone's concerned. Doesn't list the CIs though.
For the fuel drawback, does anyone have a source for the forms you need to submit to claim it?
Cheers,
Wrongun
For the fuel drawback, does anyone have a source for the forms you need to submit to claim it?
Cheers,
Wrongun
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 619
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From: Dorset, UK
I don't need to clear customs on leaving France?
Couple of years ago, we were not allowed to depart from Caen, for the UK, until the Customs came back from their leisurely two hour lunch!
Mind you, we went to Le Touquet a few weeks back, on a Saturday. The Customs office was empty when we arrived, and still empty when we left (neither time was lunch hour). So did we break any French laws?
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Kirstey,
If I recall I have seen Les Douanes at Saint Brieuc, but I think they are 24 Hrs Prior notice though. I dont have up to date info to hand, but might be worth a phone call to the airport to check if you do want to go direct.
Regards, SD..
If I recall I have seen Les Douanes at Saint Brieuc, but I think they are 24 Hrs Prior notice though. I dont have up to date info to hand, but might be worth a phone call to the airport to check if you do want to go direct.
Regards, SD..
Joined: Dec 2001
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From: europe
Channel Islands clearence is a special case and requires I believe 12 hours notice to special branch for outbound flights from a concession airfield, or clearance through a full customs UK airport.
Flights from the Channel Islands to France require whatever notice the individual French airport/airfield requires.
St Brieuc requires at least 24 hours notice I think.
Le Touquet and Cherbourg are a better bet.
Dinard has now got a reputation for difficulty.
At bigger airports be careful not to go through any self closing doors from airside, you may be there for the duration.
Flights from the Channel Islands to France require whatever notice the individual French airport/airfield requires.
St Brieuc requires at least 24 hours notice I think.
Le Touquet and Cherbourg are a better bet.
Dinard has now got a reputation for difficulty.
At bigger airports be careful not to go through any self closing doors from airside, you may be there for the duration.
Joined: Apr 2002
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
Posts: 1,264
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From: Surrey, UK ;
Customs Clearance France - UK
I am still confused about flying from France to the UK (and more especially back again). I spoke to HM Customs in July and they were totally disinterested and referred to a leaflet of theirs "Flying your own aircraft abroad" and said it had been withdrawn as it was no longer applicable. As far as their national helpline was concerned if arriving from France (or pretty well anywhere elsewe had no obligation to tell anybody.
Fairoaks - our departure point to Le T - were adamant that we had to fill in a full customs dec. with our outbound flight plan listing est. time of landing back, names, addresses, passport numbers, ages etc (so in effect it was more of an immigration declaration).
We did what we were supposed to .. arrived via a flight plan at a French Customs field ..... returned via a flight plan to Fairoaks .... which we closed by phone to LHR as Fairoaks were shut when we got back.
What I am puzzled by is a) why Fairoaks need a customs dec when H M Customs say we don't, and b) what they did with it (apparently faxed it to the customs office or Police in Guildford)and whether anybody did anything with it when they got it.
We weren't met at Fairoaks by Police or H M Customs although It is rumoured that the local Police are interested to know who is flying back and to, so they can keep an eye on (and surprise) known suspicious characters (presumeably those with more than 20 Rothmans when they land) but this seems to me to be just a reason or excuse for imposing a requirement not currently enshrined in the regulations or laws. A bit like telling the Police which road you are going to drive down in case they want to keep an eye on you with a radar gun.
Now I haven't got any problem with following a properly required recognised procedure, but would prefer not to have to do something which is unnecessary and is only generating paper and sending faxes to people who don't need/want to know.
I keep threatening to write to H M Customs to get a definitive response. If I do and get an answer I'll post it.
Fairoaks - our departure point to Le T - were adamant that we had to fill in a full customs dec. with our outbound flight plan listing est. time of landing back, names, addresses, passport numbers, ages etc (so in effect it was more of an immigration declaration).
We did what we were supposed to .. arrived via a flight plan at a French Customs field ..... returned via a flight plan to Fairoaks .... which we closed by phone to LHR as Fairoaks were shut when we got back.
What I am puzzled by is a) why Fairoaks need a customs dec when H M Customs say we don't, and b) what they did with it (apparently faxed it to the customs office or Police in Guildford)and whether anybody did anything with it when they got it.
We weren't met at Fairoaks by Police or H M Customs although It is rumoured that the local Police are interested to know who is flying back and to, so they can keep an eye on (and surprise) known suspicious characters (presumeably those with more than 20 Rothmans when they land) but this seems to me to be just a reason or excuse for imposing a requirement not currently enshrined in the regulations or laws. A bit like telling the Police which road you are going to drive down in case they want to keep an eye on you with a radar gun.
Now I haven't got any problem with following a properly required recognised procedure, but would prefer not to have to do something which is unnecessary and is only generating paper and sending faxes to people who don't need/want to know.
I keep threatening to write to H M Customs to get a definitive response. If I do and get an answer I'll post it.
Joined: Oct 2002
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From: East Sussex, UK
In addition to all the other replies, remember to take your licence with you as many French customs now seem to require this.
In the summer I flew to the Alderney fly-in. On the Saturday I flew to Dinard and they wouldn't let me through customs as I didn't have my licence with me (left it at Alderney). They wouldn't even let my passengers through (just to get a cup of coffee) as it meant they would not be able to get out again as they didn't have a "valid means of leaving" !
We didn't argue too much as the customs man had a gun in his holster !
My club (Cubair at Redhill) encourages fuel draw back andf really makes flying to France (or the Channel Islands) worthwhile especially with 3 cost sharing passengers.
In the summer I flew to the Alderney fly-in. On the Saturday I flew to Dinard and they wouldn't let me through customs as I didn't have my licence with me (left it at Alderney). They wouldn't even let my passengers through (just to get a cup of coffee) as it meant they would not be able to get out again as they didn't have a "valid means of leaving" !
We didn't argue too much as the customs man had a gun in his holster !
My club (Cubair at Redhill) encourages fuel draw back andf really makes flying to France (or the Channel Islands) worthwhile especially with 3 cost sharing passengers.
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: united kingdom
RobL;
I don't think you are correct. UK customs National Co-ordination Unit does require notification of arrival from France at a non-customs airfield with details of the aircraft, passengers (who must be EU nationals to arrive at a non-customs airfield) and eta. I understand this is is not specifically for customs, but for immigration (and HM customs act as their agents). If you bring in any non-EU nationals, I think you have to arrive at an airport of entry. You could phone the National Co-ordination Unit for more info -- sorry I haven't got the phone number with me.
All of this is in addition to the normal flight plan filing.
AA.
I don't think you are correct. UK customs National Co-ordination Unit does require notification of arrival from France at a non-customs airfield with details of the aircraft, passengers (who must be EU nationals to arrive at a non-customs airfield) and eta. I understand this is is not specifically for customs, but for immigration (and HM customs act as their agents). If you bring in any non-EU nationals, I think you have to arrive at an airport of entry. You could phone the National Co-ordination Unit for more info -- sorry I haven't got the phone number with me.
All of this is in addition to the normal flight plan filing.
AA.
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 214
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From: too near London
You MUST file a flight plan going in both directions as you'll be crossing an international border.
You DON'T have to inform customs or immigration in the UK before you go, but you MUST go to a customs airfield for your first stop in France (Le Touquet is good, Calais now require 24hr notice).
You MUST give 4 hours notice to Customs and Excise when returning to the UK, by fax before you go is convenient. You can be late but you musn't be early, and you can go to ANY landing site or strip - it DOESN'T have to be a UK customs field.
You DON'T have to inform customs or immigration in the UK before you go, but you MUST go to a customs airfield for your first stop in France (Le Touquet is good, Calais now require 24hr notice).
You MUST give 4 hours notice to Customs and Excise when returning to the UK, by fax before you go is convenient. You can be late but you musn't be early, and you can go to ANY landing site or strip - it DOESN'T have to be a UK customs field.
Joined: Oct 2001
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From: Dorset, UK
At London Elstree International Airport, we are still required to complete the usual Custom's form (which gives ETA back at Elstree), & give it to the fellas in the tower with the flight plans, before trips to EU countries. Its no great hassle really.
I understood that they fax it to the relevant C & E office, so that C & E can make occasional spot checks on returning aircraft.
I understood that this is still the rule for ALL UK non-customs airfields.
I understood that they fax it to the relevant C & E office, so that C & E can make occasional spot checks on returning aircraft.
I understood that this is still the rule for ALL UK non-customs airfields.
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 265
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From: don't know, I'll ask
Duty Drawback
The form you want for duty draw back is HO60 from your local C&E. I got some from 0845 010 9000. It goes back once completed to:
Mineral Oils Reliefs Centre
Dobson House
Regent Centre
NewcastleNE3 3PF
Cheque usually back in couple of weeks max.
Mineral Oils Reliefs Centre
Dobson House
Regent Centre
NewcastleNE3 3PF
Cheque usually back in couple of weeks max.
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 293
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From: Dorchester, Dorset
Going into France
I know that it's fairly common practice to clear customs at a biggish, well known field (L2K, Calais,Reims Prunay &c &c), and then push on to your eventual destination - but it is a bit of a pain if you've got the fuel and bladder endurance to get there in one go.
It is probably entirely possible.
A heck of a lot of really tiny french fields have a customs number in their entry in the VFR flight Guides - (I use Pooleys/Delage). I've found that ringing this number at least 24 hours before ETA and giving them the details is enough to get you in. Most times they don't give a t*ss, and wonder why you're bothering them - this is because they are unaware that we're not in Shengen, and I've had to point out that they do need to know what I'm up to.
I back this up by asking nicely for the person's name on the phone and then fax them a couple of lines with regd, pob (and names), and eta. It's polite to give them another call if you have to scrub, but I've not yet had anybody waiting for me when I get there, or when I get home....
Steve R
It is probably entirely possible.
A heck of a lot of really tiny french fields have a customs number in their entry in the VFR flight Guides - (I use Pooleys/Delage). I've found that ringing this number at least 24 hours before ETA and giving them the details is enough to get you in. Most times they don't give a t*ss, and wonder why you're bothering them - this is because they are unaware that we're not in Shengen, and I've had to point out that they do need to know what I'm up to.
I back this up by asking nicely for the person's name on the phone and then fax them a couple of lines with regd, pob (and names), and eta. It's polite to give them another call if you have to scrub, but I've not yet had anybody waiting for me when I get there, or when I get home....
Steve R
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 546
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From: europe
At French airports Gendarmes, not Duanes, take a great interest in checking licence details such as is your medical in date.
My advice is don't take a colonial attitude with you to the continent, it may well backfire.
My advice is don't take a colonial attitude with you to the continent, it may well backfire.
