Which Is Easier To Spin - High or Low Wing?
Which Is Easier To Spin - High or Low Wing?
Why do it if it's not fun?
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 4,782
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From: Bournemouth
PA28-161 (Warrior) is not certified for spinning.
PA28-140 (Cherokee) is. It's quite difficult to get it to enter the spin - it won't unless you pull the yoke all the way back. Recovery is no problem.
Have never spun a Cessna, so can't compare. In fact, the only other aircraft I've spun have been dedicated aerobatic aircraft, so it would be unfair to compare them to trainers, and they've all been bi-planes, so I can't compare high-wing vs low-wing. Interesting subject though - my gut feeling is that other factors would be far more important in determining the spin characteristics than the wing position, but maybe someone else knows for sure? Ghengis?
FFF
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PA28-140 (Cherokee) is. It's quite difficult to get it to enter the spin - it won't unless you pull the yoke all the way back. Recovery is no problem.
Have never spun a Cessna, so can't compare. In fact, the only other aircraft I've spun have been dedicated aerobatic aircraft, so it would be unfair to compare them to trainers, and they've all been bi-planes, so I can't compare high-wing vs low-wing. Interesting subject though - my gut feeling is that other factors would be far more important in determining the spin characteristics than the wing position, but maybe someone else knows for sure? Ghengis?
FFF
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Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 70
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From: UK
Other aerodynamic traits change the way different aircraft spin, not high wing or low wing.
For instance, most people will put a Robin 2160 and a Slingsby 160 as similar aircraft. However, the Robin spin is fairly benign and easy to recover (although its an unusual receovery) but the Slingsby is quite excitable in comparison.
Playing with inspin or outspin aileron changes spin rates, recovery times etc. as does power on/off, spin direction etc, etc......................
There are just too many variables!
Would be interesting to know why you asked the question. Are you thinking of learning to spin or just want to see one in case it happens accidently or do precise spins for aerobatics??
For instance, most people will put a Robin 2160 and a Slingsby 160 as similar aircraft. However, the Robin spin is fairly benign and easy to recover (although its an unusual receovery) but the Slingsby is quite excitable in comparison.
Playing with inspin or outspin aileron changes spin rates, recovery times etc. as does power on/off, spin direction etc, etc......................
There are just too many variables!
Would be interesting to know why you asked the question. Are you thinking of learning to spin or just want to see one in case it happens accidently or do precise spins for aerobatics??
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 113
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From: You Kay
I asked more or less to try and clear up a gut feeling I've always had that the Cessna is more likely to bite than the PA-28 if inadvertantly mishandled.
Difficult to explain why I have this feeling - let's just put it down to basic instinct.
If I recall my POF lessons I *think* low wing aircraft had more lateral stability than high wing but I *may* be forgetting certain factors such as angle of sweep back, dihedral and anhedral etc etc....
In short I can't remember.
BM.
PS: Flew with a guy who spun a PA-28 eben though it was not certified. His justification for doing so was that they are tested for this during manufacture. Any opinion?
Difficult to explain why I have this feeling - let's just put it down to basic instinct.
If I recall my POF lessons I *think* low wing aircraft had more lateral stability than high wing but I *may* be forgetting certain factors such as angle of sweep back, dihedral and anhedral etc etc....
In short I can't remember.
BM.
PS: Flew with a guy who spun a PA-28 eben though it was not certified. His justification for doing so was that they are tested for this during manufacture. Any opinion?
Last edited by Baldie Man; 19th August 2002 at 16:25.
Joined: Apr 2001
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From: Chichester, UK
If I recall my POF lessons I *think* low wing aircraft had more lateral stability than high wing but I *may* be forgetting certain factors such as angle of sweep back, dihedral and anhedral etc etc....
Joined: Apr 2002
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From: uk
I always spin cessnas for those students who want a demonstration as part of the PPL. They are not that easy to get in but come out very smoothly. I've never spun a piper (ours aren't certified) but it is certainly true that they are a lot more stable and therefore less likely to drop a wing in a stall. All the other (aerobatic) aircraft that I have spun have been high wing too. I'm interested to hear from more experienced pilots as to whether the high/low wing makes a real difference and, if so, what is the technical explanation.
Official PPRuNe Chaplain
Joined: Apr 2001
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From: Witnesham, Suffolk
The other problem with spinning the PA28-140 is that the C of G band where spinning is authorised is extremely narrow - move your seat one notch to the rear and you might be out of (or into) the permitted area.
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2002
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From: You Kay
Interesting stuff. Maybe this thread would be answered quicker in the Tech Log?
I originally posted it in the questions forum but whoever moved it obviously thought it would be best answered here due to the fact I mentioned light aircraft no doubt.
As for high winged aircraft with dihedral - doesn't the ATR have a tiny amount and some old Fokker aircraft too?
BM.
I originally posted it in the questions forum but whoever moved it obviously thought it would be best answered here due to the fact I mentioned light aircraft no doubt.
As for high winged aircraft with dihedral - doesn't the ATR have a tiny amount and some old Fokker aircraft too?
BM.
Joined: Feb 2000
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 17,522
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From: England
I have spun in a PA-28 161 Warrior that was not cleared for spinning. This was an inadvertedent spin following a student miss-handenling a full flap power on stall exercise. Recovery was standard and easy.
High wing is easier but the actual POF explaination escapes me.
WWW
High wing is easier but the actual POF explaination escapes me.
WWW
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WWW
I recall reading (in the POH) that the PA28-161/181 is a real pussycat, except with a big rear C of G, when it can enter a flat spin and present recovery issues.
As a non-aero pilot I've never really pushed the envelope and am reassured by your posting.
As to Baldie's comment about "biting", I guess that Cessnas and Pipers nip in different ways, but any aeroplane is quite capapble of surprising in different ways.
F3G
I recall reading (in the POH) that the PA28-161/181 is a real pussycat, except with a big rear C of G, when it can enter a flat spin and present recovery issues.
As a non-aero pilot I've never really pushed the envelope and am reassured by your posting.
As to Baldie's comment about "biting", I guess that Cessnas and Pipers nip in different ways, but any aeroplane is quite capapble of surprising in different ways.
F3G
