Private Flying LAA/BMAA/BGA/BPA The sheer pleasure of flight.

EGLS Closing?

Old 29th Jul 2019, 17:50
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: southern England
Age: 61
Posts: 141
EGLS Closing?

Businesses and all based aircraft given notice to quit by 31st October.
m.Berger is offline  
Old 29th Jul 2019, 18:25
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: EBZH
Posts: 2,440
For those who wonder: EGLS <=> Old Sarum Airfield.
Jan Olieslagers is offline  
Old 30th Jul 2019, 00:34
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: The Twain
Posts: 75
Crying shame. One of the traditional airfields of UK with a history as long as your arm.

Oh to have a few million to buy it up and keep it as an airfield. Somehow there seem to be few multimillionaires in GA 🙁
anxiao is offline  
Old 30th Jul 2019, 08:12
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Down at the sharp pointy end, where all the weather is made.
Age: 70
Posts: 1,429
...so which GA airfields in the UK don't actually make a loss?

I define 'loss' as being a return anything less than if the capital employed was invested in the FTSE 100. In the case of Old Sarum, the owner claims he's put in over 1m over the years to cover losses.

Compton Abbas relies on a 30-year buildup reputation for its restaurant. There are on any given weekend more bikers than pilots visiting. On the other hand, they probably wouldn't have started to come if there hadn't been the attraction of watching the planes.

Many other airfields rely on warehousing or driving events.

At one end of the scale are farm strips where the landowner is prepared to sacrifice crop-growing space for enjoyment of a hobby. At the other end are international airports such as Heathrow and Gatwick. Examination of their books shows a more modest return than you might expect.

If smaller GA fields were capable of making money, then their landlords wouldn't be so desperate to flog them off. Most of them survive because historically the owners have an interest in the activity. When they die, the non-aviation-minded inheritors understandably want their money. Personally, I don't think re-defining them as green spaces rather than brown-field will make an atom of difference if the planning people like the site for housing or a car factory. Will Honda restore South Marston to being an airfield when they go?

In countries like France and the United States, it's the non-flying taxpayer who supports aerodromes. I can't see Grant Shapps shifting to this culture in the UK any time soon. Talking of which, he's apparently needs now to resign as chair of the APPG, as he's now Minister of Transport. Is there anyone else in Parliament interested in taking it on? Thought not.

So, is the fundamental issue that aviators are too tight to pay properly for their facilities? Elsewhere here we've read of examples of people climbing out of 50k cars for their 150 an hour flying lesson. In this part of the world, hangarage is less than half what it costs to rent a hole in the water in which to keep a boat.

TOO
TheOddOne is offline  
Old 30th Jul 2019, 09:52
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: River Thames & Surrey
Age: 70
Posts: 8,081
Originally Posted by m.Berger View Post
Businesses and all based aircraft given notice to quit by 31st October.
Look for the Old Sarum thread in 'Aviation History and Nostalgia'.
chevvron is offline  
Old 30th Jul 2019, 10:20
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Hampshire
Posts: 357
I've used Old Sarum these past 30 years and I know a little about the thinking of the current management. The advertised closure has the hallmark of an act of spite.
Capt Kremmen is offline  
Old 6th Aug 2019, 18:34
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: london uk
Posts: 362
Originally Posted by TheOddOne View Post
...so which GA airfields in the UK don't actually make a loss?

I define 'loss' as being a return anything less than if the capital employed was invested in the FTSE 100. In the case of Old Sarum, the owner claims he's put in over 1m over the years to cover losses.

Compton Abbas relies on a 30-year buildup reputation for its restaurant. There are on any given weekend more bikers than pilots visiting. On the other hand, they probably wouldn't have started to come if there hadn't been the attraction of watching the planes.

Many other airfields rely on warehousing or driving events.

At one end of the scale are farm strips where the landowner is prepared to sacrifice crop-growing space for enjoyment of a hobby. At the other end are international airports such as Heathrow and Gatwick. Examination of their books shows a more modest return than you might expect.

If smaller GA fields were capable of making money, then their landlords wouldn't be so desperate to flog them off. Most of them survive because historically the owners have an interest in the activity. When they die, the non-aviation-minded inheritors understandably want their money. Personally, I don't think re-defining them as green spaces rather than brown-field will make an atom of difference if the planning people like the site for housing or a car factory. Will Honda restore South Marston to being an airfield when they go?

In countries like France and the United States, it's the non-flying taxpayer who supports aerodromes. I can't see Grant Shapps shifting to this culture in the UK any time soon. Talking of which, he's apparently needs now to resign as chair of the APPG, as he's now Minister of Transport. Is there anyone else in Parliament interested in taking it on? Thought not.

So, is the fundamental issue that aviators are too tight to pay properly for their facilities? Elsewhere here we've read of examples of people climbing out of 50k cars for their 150 an hour flying lesson. In this part of the world, hangarage is less than half what it costs to rent a hole in the water in which to keep a boat.

TOO
You need to make sure you are comparing apples with apples there? Some Marinas may charge 4-5k per annum for a 10 meter cruiser, but you get a lot more for the money than a spot in a packed hangar at Lydd for example! So that type of "Hole in the water" must be compared to say a serviced spot in Farnborough? My boat is 12 meters and sits on a swing mooring in Queenborough harbour. There is a trot boat (Water taxi) to take you to and from your boat, showers, security and organized events etc. This costs me 950/yr! Compare that with 250/mth for a spot in Kortrijke for my little PA28! The obvious difference is that you can't build on water, so developers are not clamouring over themselves for a few acres of Medway
pistongone is offline  
Old 7th Aug 2019, 05:15
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Glens o' Angus by way of LA
Age: 56
Posts: 1,973
At one end of the scale are farm strips where the landowner is prepared to sacrifice crop-growing space for enjoyment of a hobby.
The sacrifice is far more than surrendering productive land. If you figure the average farmer will make about 150 an acre ( subsidies included) if all goes well then a 10 acre field being utilized for aviation will ‘only’ cost about 1500 per year in lost farming revenue. The real costs are incurred in the maintenance of the field and the upkeep and purchases of equipment to do the tasks properly and efficiently. I along with several private aircraft owners I know deliberately do not count the ongoing costs of owning and flying the 100 odd hours a year as it would make your eyes water, the same applies to maintaining a simple grass strip to a standard that it can be relied upon to land safely on in all but the foulest days. Every year I have either a major refurb, repair or purchase of the mowers, toppers, spreaders, rakes, rollers, harrows, aerator or tractor. The drainage which cost 20k to put in plus the cost to level the field only lasts so long then I’m back annually patching, leveling and subsoiling all the time burning diesel on a tractor that costs thousands to fix. Fortunately I have friends and fellow pilots who pitch in their time to cut the grass and other chores on a regular bases otherwise it would be a lot of effort for me do do by myself. The 5 or 10 quid some grass strip owners charge for landing on lightly used rural fields doesn’t even come close to making a dent in their costs. They, like myself, do it for the love of flying and also because they don’t want to be the guy that’s neglected the chores then have some poor student come in on a diversion going arse for elbow because the long grass got tickled up in the spats or the nose wheel dug in due to poor drainage. Most strips are maintained to a standard far above what the owner themselves actually need to operate safely from.

Based on what my grass strip costs to maintain, I shudder to think what those guys with asphalt runways & taxiways, lighting, hangars with utilities, access roads, outbuildings, security systems, gates, fences and insurance spend each year. I can see a lot more fields going the way of Old Sarum when young Jack or Jill get the call informing them their daft old uncle out at the airfield has made his last 3 pointer and George Wimpey has been on the horn talking telephone numbers.


piperboy84 is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.