Do I need a LAPL licence?

[nibble90]

Hi,
I am considering taking flight training however I came across a question that no where seams to have the answer to...
Do I need a LAPL licence before a PPL licence?

Let it be noted that I am in the United Kingdom and when talking about licences I want to fly planes not helicopters so (A)!

[fireflybob]

Do I need a LAPL licence before a PPL licence?

No. Assuming you can pass the medical and complete all the other items you can train for PPL from the beginning.

Alternatively you could train and obtain your LAPL and then do further training to obtain PPL.

[Genghis the Engineer]

You can train for scratch for any of the...

NPPL
LAPL
PPL

Most advice would be that if you are shooting for aeroplanes or helicopters (as opposed to microlights or gyroplanes) and have no medical complications preventing a class 2 medical, is that you shoot straight for the full PPL. The other licence have restrictions that don't apply to the full PPL, and unless you're either under 25 or prove to be somewhat gifted as a pilot (and even then, there are no guarantees), it will most likely take you over the 45 hours minimum of the PPL to learn to fly anyhow. Learning to fly takes as long as it does, and the specific licence you're training for doesn't change the number of hours significantly within the aircraft class.

G

[Whopity]

You can train for scratch for any of the...

NPPL
LAPL
PPL

and a CPL!

[nibble90]

Ahh, thanks everyone! Just the information I wanted to know

[airpolice]

LAPL will be the cheapest short term way to get in the air in the kind of aircraft you will learn the other stuff in.

[spRom]

Originally Posted by Genghis the Engineer

You can train for scratch for any of the...

NPPL
LAPL
PPL

Most advice would be that if you are shooting for aeroplanes or helicopters (as opposed to microlights or gyroplanes) and have no medical complications preventing a class 2 medical, is that you shoot straight for the full PPL. The other licence have restrictions that don't apply to the full PPL, and unless you're either under 25 or prove to be somewhat gifted as a pilot (and even then, there are no guarantees), it will most likely take you over the 45 hours minimum of the PPL to learn to fly anyhow. Learning to fly takes as long as it does, and the specific licence you're training for doesn't change the number of hours significantly within the aircraft class.

G

Take Genghis advice, go for the PPL. You will end up with a licence with less restrictions. And paying the same money as for the LAPL. even if a priori seems cheaper. Note that the 45 hours requirement is the extreme minimum that not much people are able to fly a plane safely. The examiner is not going to care too much if you are doing LAPL or PPL, they just want to see that you are a safe pilot. And this normally takes more than 45 hours. Around 50 hours I'd say.

[airpolice]

Don't forget the cost of a PPL medical.... every year.

LAPL & NPPL are done by a self declaration instead.

[sharpend]

Originally Posted by airpolice

Don't forget the cost of a PPL medical.... every year.

LAPL & NPPL are done by a self declaration instead.

One can now use the self-declaration for a PPL. The restrictions are primarily non EASA, UK only

[airpolice]

One can now use the self-declaration for a PPL. The restrictions are primarily non EASA, UK only

Every day's a school day!

Looks ideal for Bulldogs.

[IcePack]

If you have an easa ATPL, but only a class 2 medical. Can you legally fly light aircraft or do you need a LAPL? (UK)

[fireflybob]

If you have an easa ATPL, but only a class 2 medical. Can you legally fly light aircraft or do you need a LAPL? (UK)

EASA ATPL includes LAPL privileges (as a matter of interest EASA PPL currently does not include LAPL privileges) so as long as you have a valid medical and the requisite hours you may exercise the privileges of the LAPL.

[muffin]

Originally Posted by airpolice

Don't forget the cost of a PPL medical.... every year.

LAPL & NPPL are done by a self declaration instead.

You cannot self declare for a LAPL. It is an EASA licence and medical self declaration is not allowed. However the LAPL medical exam is simpler than the Class 2 and lasts longer (at my age anyway).

[TheOddOne]

EASA ATPL includes LAPL privileges (at a matter of interest EASA PPL currently does not include LAPL privileges) so as long as you have a valid medical and the requisite hours you may exercise the privileges of the LAPL.

As airpolice says, every day's a school day.

My imperfect understanding is that a LAPL implies single engine piston. I thought that if you had an ATPL, you still needed a SEP RATING in order to fly a say, Cessna 150. If you choose to exercise the LAPL privileges of an ATPL, does that bypass the requirement for SEP rating?

Interesting about the EASA PPL not including LAPL privileges. We've had folk thinking they can fly under LAPL in their 2nd year of medical, 'cos it says so on their certificate. Wrong at the moment...

TOO

[fireflybob]

My imperfect understanding is that a LAPL implies single engine piston. I thought that if you had an ATPL, you still needed a SEP RATING in order to fly a say, Cessna 150. If you choose to exercise the LAPL privileges of an ATPL, does that bypass the requirement for SEP rating?

For LAPL privileges I don't believe that is the case - you only need to satisfy the experience requirements (including the one hour with an instructor). If you don't have the experience requirements you can "re qualify" for them under the supervision of a flying instructor.

The privileges of your licence will only remain valid if you have completed, in the last 24 months, as pilot of an aeroplane or TMG:

At least 12 hours flight time as PIC, including 12 take-offs and landings; and
Refresher training of at least 1 hour of total flight time with an instructor.
If you do not meet these requirements you will need to:

Complete a proficiency check with an examiner before you exercise the privileges of the licence; or
Complete the additional flight time or take-offs and landings to meet the requirements above, flying dual or solo, under the supervision of an instructor.

[IcePack]

Thanks fireflybob. My ame seemed to think EASA had restricted the ATPL to only being valid with a class 1 medical. As opposed to the old uk one which allowed a downgraded ATPL to fly light aircraft.

[MaxR]

Originally Posted by muffin

You cannot self declare for a LAPL. It is an EASA licence and medical self declaration is not allowed. However the LAPL medical exam is simpler than the Class 2 and lasts longer (at my age anyway).

Well, not for initial issue of the licence for EASA aircraft but, according the the CAA website, a medical declaration (from 25th August 2016) is an affirmation of your medical ‘fitness to fly’ and may be used to exercise the privileges of a EU Part-FCL LAPL to fly non-EASA aircraft.

So, not initially but from then on to fly Annex II, with the provisions given in the link below.

http://www.caa.co.uk/General-Aviatio...rivate-pilots/

[muffin]

Originally Posted by MaxR

Well, not for initial issue of the licence for EASA aircraft but, according the the CAA website, a medical declaration (from 25th August 2016) is an affirmation of your medical ‘fitness to fly’ and may be used to exercise the privileges of a EU Part-FCL LAPL to fly non-EASA aircraft.

So, not initially but from then on to fly Annex II, with the provisions given in the link below.

Medical requirements for private pilots | UK Civil Aviation Authority

That seems to clarify it. My comments were based on the situation as I knew it prior to August 25th. Unfortunately as I have an LAPL(A) and LAPL(H) and an EASA helicopter I still need the LAPL medical.

[spRom]

Originally Posted by airpolice

Don't forget the cost of a PPL medical.... every year.

LAPL & NPPL are done by a self declaration instead.

of but that's only if they're 50 years old or older.

In Switzerland the cost of a class 2 certificate is around 300-400 euros. So yes, going for the lapl makes sense. I don't know the price in the uk, but I guess it'd be the same.

Originally Posted by muffin

You cannot self declare for a LAPL. It is an EASA licence and medical self declaration is not allowed. However the LAPL medical exam is simpler than the Class 2 and lasts longer (at my age anyway).

maybe the dumbest question in the world.. if it's an easa licence and the self declaration doesn't work, does that mean that the issuing authority is not the local CAA but EASA itself.