requirements for flying single engine jets

[Flyingcope]

Im currently working on getting my PPL. I would like to be able to fly single engine jets after completing at some point in the UK.

I have no idea what endorsements I need ontop of the PPL. Does anybody know or even have experience?

[LOMCEVAK]

Flyingcope,

I assume that you are referring to ex-military types that are operated under CAP632 (e.g. Jet Provost). These are all Annex II aircraft that are flown under national regulations and require a UK licence and not a Part.FCL one (because EASA does not recognise the types and therefore does not issue a type rating). An Aircraft Type Rating Exemption (ATRE) is then required for each type. An initial submission is made to the CAA for a training exemption which must include the proposed training syllabus. Once this has been approved and the training completed a full exemption is applied for. An application for renewal of the ATRE is then required annually, and may be re-issued based on hours on type.

Whilst I admire and can understand your enthusiasm to fly this class of aircraft, unless you manage to gain significant experience of high performance, manoeuvrable aircraft then do not underestimate the amount of training that you would require in order to be issued with a ATRE. Good luck!

[noflynomore]

Or the stupendous expense of even a horrid little JP!

[LOMCEVAK]

All Permit to Fly aircraft operated under CAP632 are VFR only. I am trying hard but cannot think of any C of A single engine jets on the UK register!

[PaulisHome]

Strictly I don't need a license at all to fly my single engine jet.

But it's entirely possible that it's not the type of single engined jet that the OP was talking about.



HPH Sailplanes UK | HpH Sailplanes UK ? A new dimension in gliding

Paul

[Mustapha Cuppa]

So a licence is not required to fly a sailplane?

[Prop swinger]

Not yet (in the UK.)

[maxred]

He may be purchasing a new Cirrus jet. Interesting that people immediately jumped to a conclusion on ex military types. So on another assumption that it is possibly one of the new generation Jets, I would suggest that it will be experience that will ultimately count. So, after PPL, IRr, or IR, with a night rating, and at least 250hrs under your belt. Naturally you could technically go straight on them, but for the sake of longevity, I would not advise that. If you have the pockets, the producers offer full training packages, as you purchase. Certainly worth looking into. Good luck with your PPL.

[xrayalpha]

Or just get a jetbug!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elh4djwGrX0

nice flames at 1:52 in!

Delta wing, retractable gear and a jet thingy with flames coming out the back....

What more do you want?

Might not even need a licence as it is foot launched!

[maxred]

Brilliant. As I watched the video, I had a very strange vision of you in one, floating over the fence of 23.....and setting the trees alight.

[chevvron]

Originally Posted by noflynomore

Or the stupendous expense of even a horrid little JP!

Referred to by certain Farnborough TPs as a 'constant thrust variable noise' aircraft

[Flyingcope]

I assume that you are referring to ex-military types that are operated under CAP632 (e.g. Jet Provost).

Yes I'm looking at ex RAF jets.

Would this be strictly VFR flying

Yes

These are all Annex II aircraft that are flown under national regulations and require a UK licence and not a Part.FCL one (because EASA does not recognise the types and therefore does not issue a type rating). An Aircraft Type Rating Exemption (ATRE) is then required for each type.

How does this work do I have to do my licence twice? the annex 2 thing really confuses me.

[LOMCEVAK]

I am not sure how the Part.FCL and UK license aspects work for PPLs. I suggest that you ask wherever you are doing your training. For commercial licenses, you just tick a box on the application form and pay more money! There is no extra training; it is just a paperwork exercise. NB that some of the ratings applicable to a Part.FCL license (eg. aerobatic) are not required on a UK license.

With respect to Annex II aircraft, don't worry at this stage. Simplistically, you need an ATRE rather than a formal type rating for turbine powered aircraft.

[Flyingcope]

With respect to Annex II aircraft, don't worry at this stage. Simplistically, you need an ATRE rather than a formal type rating for turbine powered aircraft.

so basically do my PPL get some hours apply for training and an ATRE for that aircraft and i dont need any other ratings on the licence.?

[MrAverage]

Maybe not, but you will definitely need deep pockets for adequate insurance.......

[Flyingcope]

definitely need deep pockets for adequate insurance

not looking to buy one. There are a few places in the uk that rent them as part of a training school system from my research.

[sycamore]

Fly/op, The Annex2 referred to can be found under EASA regulations,and generally refers to aircraft that may be ex-mil,for which there is not a `type rating` available,so ,one has to have an `Exemption` from the ANO to fly them. The operation of such aircraft is governed by `CAP632`,the CAA Document which specifies the hoops and loops that one has to jump thru` to fly such aircraft.So I would suggest a thorough read to understand it.It defines the criteria for minimum hours,training syllabus by an `acceptable `organisation,bearing in mind that there are several such groups /organisations in the UK,acceptable instructors,technical exams and flight tests,whilst one has a `Training` Exemption.Only after that can one apply for a full Exemption. However,one can do a couple of `familiarisation` sorties(which can be counted`),where one can be assessed as to attitude,enthusiasm,ability,personality,etc to fly such aircraft.They are not,`flipflop and t-shirt` environments...you wear the approved mil.safety equipment and understand mil.style rules,especially in aircraft with live ejection seats/parachutes.
Whilst some may denigrate the `horrid J-P`Jet Provost`,I think given an opportunity ,they would be ever-so-grateful for a trip in one now!!
At the present time,I would suggest you concentrate on getting your PPL,and getting experience and `awaremanship` about all aspects of flying,to the best of your ability,and wish you well.....Syc....

Keep the dreamm................

[India Four Two]

Whilst some may denigrate the `horrid J-P`Jet Provost`,I think given an opportunity ,they would be ever-so-grateful for a trip in one now!!

sycamore,

Exactly! Four years ago, I had several flights in a Vampire T11 in NZ. Fantastic fun, even in a jet with less power than a JP. The flying was easy - easier than flying a Cessna (as long as there was no emergency) - "Just fly it like a 250 kt motorglider".

The difficult part is paying for the fuel - 1000 litres per hour or half a pint per second in old money. "It's called a DH Goblin because it gobbles fuel!"

flyingcope,
I agree with sycamore's comments. Concentrate on getting experience and 'awaremanship' (I like that term). When handling the aircraft becomes second nature and you can switch types with ease, then start with the jets. Good luck and have fun!

[India Four Two]

That is in the territory of fuel burn of the airliner I fly.. that is just nuts!

True, but can you do this in your airliner?

[Chase_BHX]

Originally Posted by TangoAlphad

Not intentionally...

'Tex' Johnson did in the Dash 80 / Boeing 707.