Small wheel controversy!
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 4,777
Likes: 9
From: Blighty
The two most fun aeroplanes in my logbook - a BAe Hawk and Scottish Aviation Bulldog both had a training wheel at the front. Close behind, the Chipmunk and Stinson Voyager both have a tailwheel.
Dan - Whilst I don't recall such an unequivocal opinion when you flew the Z242L
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 208
Likes: 0
From: Dubai
Joined: Jan 2008
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 650
Likes: 45
From: Canada
Let's face it - some of the "most fun" aircraft don't even have wheels....
As I say, whatever gets people flying!
Moderator
Joined: Feb 2000
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 14,480
Likes: 178
From: UK
If it was tandem seating, it'd be close to perfect!
G
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,977
Likes: 0
From: Glens o' Angus by way of LA
Doesn't matter what you fly, tailwheel, nose wheel, centre wheel, skids, skis or floats. In this day and age with avgas costing a fortune, airfields getting housed over we should consider ourselves lucky to be able to line up, power in and wait for that excellent moment we leave terra firma and do what we love, FLY!
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 234
Likes: 0
From: Silicon Hills
Well, some folks would say that if it doesn't have a round engine manufactured by P&W, or Curtis Wright, it's just a toy.
DHC-2 was fun, but actually, a T-34 with an IO-550 is a blast. I've also got 50 minutes at the controls of a T-39, which was also a joy to fly. (no, we did NOT fly it straight and level.)
DHC-2 was fun, but actually, a T-34 with an IO-550 is a blast. I've also got 50 minutes at the controls of a T-39, which was also a joy to fly. (no, we did NOT fly it straight and level.)
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 4,777
Likes: 9
From: Blighty
There's a guy I know who thinks most taildragger pilots are sissies.
He has a Europa monowheel.
He has a Europa monowheel.
I quite liked the Chipmunk, I just think that the Bulldog is a much nicer aeroplane. Better view, easier to manage, better power:weight... If it was tandem seating, it'd be close to perfect!
Why haven't we been able to evolve training aircraft at the same rate as the rest of the industry? Could be a good subject for a paper!
Joined: May 1999
Aviation Qualifications: ATP+Mil
Posts: 27,402
Likes: 858
From: Quite near 'An aerodrome somewhere in England'
Dan, you were fortunate enough at Swinderby to have several runways from which to fly, so the crosswind issue was less of a problem. As a student I flew Chippies at White Waltham and again, plenty of runways and even better, all were grass.
At RAF Abingdon even with 2 runways at right angles, there were days when the Bulldogs could fly, but the Piston Engined Agressor Squadron AEF cowboys were grounded.
Flying with the left hand didn't seem to present any difficulties to our students when I was QFI-ing.
When the MoD flogged off the Chippies, it was suggested that I should acquire one for the station flying club. Much to my regret, I refused - we only had one RW and I was also pretty sure that someone would probably overstress, someone else would over-rev and quite a few would probably groundloop as there was only one RW.... A Chippie is fine as a privately-owned aeroplane looked after by doting owners familiar with the breed, but too much of a risk for a club owned aeroplane. We also considered a Bulldog - until we thought about the maintenance costs and fuel burn.
But both the Chipmunk and Bulldog were infinitely better military trainers than the T-67 or das Teutor!
At RAF Abingdon even with 2 runways at right angles, there were days when the Bulldogs could fly, but the Piston Engined Agressor Squadron AEF cowboys were grounded.
Flying with the left hand didn't seem to present any difficulties to our students when I was QFI-ing.
When the MoD flogged off the Chippies, it was suggested that I should acquire one for the station flying club. Much to my regret, I refused - we only had one RW and I was also pretty sure that someone would probably overstress, someone else would over-rev and quite a few would probably groundloop as there was only one RW.... A Chippie is fine as a privately-owned aeroplane looked after by doting owners familiar with the breed, but too much of a risk for a club owned aeroplane. We also considered a Bulldog - until we thought about the maintenance costs and fuel burn.
But both the Chipmunk and Bulldog were infinitely better military trainers than the T-67 or das Teutor!
Moderator
Joined: Feb 2000
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 14,480
Likes: 178
From: UK
On that last point, I most certainly agree.
At every level, from the Tinano onwards, the RAF just abandoned anything that looked like assessment and procurement best practice. There may have been good political reasons for this with the Tincano itself - but those two and the Vigilant were all masterpieces of mis-acquirement by people playing at what should have been someone's core professional activity.
G
At every level, from the Tinano onwards, the RAF just abandoned anything that looked like assessment and procurement best practice. There may have been good political reasons for this with the Tincano itself - but those two and the Vigilant were all masterpieces of mis-acquirement by people playing at what should have been someone's core professional activity.
G
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 4,777
Likes: 9
From: Blighty
The choice of aircraft is always political. The replacement for the Chippy and Bulldog in the JEFTS contract was always going to be about the total package and not just the aircraft. The T67 probably would not have been the choice had it been based on aircraft alone. Mind you, I'm not sure how Huntings became the choice of provider, except on price.
The JP replacement was specified as a turboprop - there were only ever going to be 2 contenders. The choice was political and in the end, I don't think it was a bad one. By the time I got to fly the Tucano, most of the issues had been sorted out (we were up to the Mk16 version of the Engine Electronic Control!) and in the end, the RAF ended up with a good training aircraft. It's certainly better than the JP, and from my few flights in a PC9, I get the impression there is little to chose between them - except that I consider the Tuc to be a slightly better training environment - particularly compared to the Swiss built PC9s with their engine control.
Had the procurers listened to the RAF, we would have probably ended up with something like the S211.
Speaking of the political procurement of the Tucano, the aircraft were built my Short's mostly Roman Catholic workforce and when the aircraft were delivered from the factory, they were left on a remote stand on the other side of the airfield for four weeks just in case they had a bomb built into them! (The longest duration timer available to the IRA was 28 days allegedly!
The JP replacement was specified as a turboprop - there were only ever going to be 2 contenders. The choice was political and in the end, I don't think it was a bad one. By the time I got to fly the Tucano, most of the issues had been sorted out (we were up to the Mk16 version of the Engine Electronic Control!) and in the end, the RAF ended up with a good training aircraft. It's certainly better than the JP, and from my few flights in a PC9, I get the impression there is little to chose between them - except that I consider the Tuc to be a slightly better training environment - particularly compared to the Swiss built PC9s with their engine control.
Had the procurers listened to the RAF, we would have probably ended up with something like the S211.
Speaking of the political procurement of the Tucano, the aircraft were built my Short's mostly Roman Catholic workforce and when the aircraft were delivered from the factory, they were left on a remote stand on the other side of the airfield for four weeks just in case they had a bomb built into them! (The longest duration timer available to the IRA was 28 days allegedly!
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,663
Likes: 0
From: Gone
Not sure that I understand the nonsense about the location of the 'little wheel'.
Flying is flying and each type has its own pleasures.
I loved the Cub for a local fun fly, but a serious touring tool 4/5 up, she wasn't.
Anything that will fly is good news.
Flying is flying and each type has its own pleasures.
I loved the Cub for a local fun fly, but a serious touring tool 4/5 up, she wasn't.
Anything that will fly is good news.
Avoid imitations
Joined: Nov 2000
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 15,116
Likes: 1,091
From: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
Speaking of the political procurement of the Tucano, the aircraft were built my Short's mostly Roman Catholic workforce and when the aircraft were delivered from the factory, they were left on a remote stand on the other side of the airfield for four weeks just in case they had a bomb built into them! (The longest duration timer available to the IRA was 28 days allegedly!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 939
Likes: 1
From: UK
If you want to land in odd places an aeroplane with the little wheel at the back, like a Pilatus Porter might well be good. Otherwise one with the wheels placed sensibly for runway landing and which disappear from view when not required is much better.