Jodel D150 Mascaret
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Jodel D150 Mascaret
Since having flown the D140 Mousqetaire I'm quite interested in Jodel aircraft.
For a while I've already been looking for an economical travel aircraft for two persons with a long range and reasonable useful load. After initially considering UL aircraft such as the Dynamic WT9, now the D150 Mascaret has caught my eye due to its superb all-round specs (at least on paper).
Does anybody have experience with this model and could give some advice?
For instance:
Can the performance numbers (cruise 110 kts at 22 lph) be trusted on a mid-time engine and prop?
I'm a bit worried about the general age and large amount of airframe hours on the fleet (50 years, 2-3000 hours are typical) -- especially as we're talking about wood and fabric.
Is there any definite end of life for these types, or can they be economically maintained ad infinitum? Are there enough maintenance shops in mainland Europe (e.g., France or Germany) that still work on them?
Current Jodel owners, what's your typical overhaul cost, and what are typical maintenance issues with these types?
Is it costly to add a Mogas STC to this EASA Annex II aircraft with Continental O-200 engine?
Also, does anybody have a PDF copy of the D150 aircraft and maintenance manual?
For a while I've already been looking for an economical travel aircraft for two persons with a long range and reasonable useful load. After initially considering UL aircraft such as the Dynamic WT9, now the D150 Mascaret has caught my eye due to its superb all-round specs (at least on paper).
Does anybody have experience with this model and could give some advice?
For instance:
Can the performance numbers (cruise 110 kts at 22 lph) be trusted on a mid-time engine and prop?
I'm a bit worried about the general age and large amount of airframe hours on the fleet (50 years, 2-3000 hours are typical) -- especially as we're talking about wood and fabric.
Is there any definite end of life for these types, or can they be economically maintained ad infinitum? Are there enough maintenance shops in mainland Europe (e.g., France or Germany) that still work on them?
Current Jodel owners, what's your typical overhaul cost, and what are typical maintenance issues with these types?
Is it costly to add a Mogas STC to this EASA Annex II aircraft with Continental O-200 engine?
Also, does anybody have a PDF copy of the D150 aircraft and maintenance manual?
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My knowledge of 150s is nil but I own a 1051 which is essentially the same construction.
A mid time engine and prop should last you 10-20 years before overhaul as long as you use it regularly. The performance may decrease slowly over time but not dramatically. Expect what the book says.
Wood glue deteriorates over the years. Modern glue seem to last forever. It is likely that the fabric has not lasted 50 years. it will be recorded in the log book when it was last changed. At the fabric change the wooden structure should have been inspected. Again this will be recorded in the aircraft's log book.
I was told to look for rot in the structure when I bought mine. Gravity sends moisture to the low points on the aircraft...elevators, tail, aft of the wings and the aft longerons. Gently pinch the wood with your fingers. Softness indicates rot. There are wee drainage holes in the underside that need to be kept clear of mud and debris.
Properly looked after wood and fabric will outlive you but a dry hangar is essential.
My engine is not an O-200 but they are extremely good reliable engines. The rules for experimentals/homebuilts are nowhere near as strict as for certified aircraft. You need to talk to these people to ask the same questions:
EAS Experimental Aviation of Switzerland
Experimental Aviation
Look after the tailwheel.
Because I don't know the rules in Switzerland I cannot comment on the cost of an STC. I suspect there is not one, the EAS have sorted that for all homebuilders.
Finally all Jodels fly lovely and the Mascaret (which I have never flown) has the reputation as being the best.
Do your homework and talk direct to the homebuilders association in Switzerland
A mid time engine and prop should last you 10-20 years before overhaul as long as you use it regularly. The performance may decrease slowly over time but not dramatically. Expect what the book says.
Wood glue deteriorates over the years. Modern glue seem to last forever. It is likely that the fabric has not lasted 50 years. it will be recorded in the log book when it was last changed. At the fabric change the wooden structure should have been inspected. Again this will be recorded in the aircraft's log book.
I was told to look for rot in the structure when I bought mine. Gravity sends moisture to the low points on the aircraft...elevators, tail, aft of the wings and the aft longerons. Gently pinch the wood with your fingers. Softness indicates rot. There are wee drainage holes in the underside that need to be kept clear of mud and debris.
Properly looked after wood and fabric will outlive you but a dry hangar is essential.
My engine is not an O-200 but they are extremely good reliable engines. The rules for experimentals/homebuilts are nowhere near as strict as for certified aircraft. You need to talk to these people to ask the same questions:
EAS Experimental Aviation of Switzerland
Experimental Aviation
Look after the tailwheel.
Because I don't know the rules in Switzerland I cannot comment on the cost of an STC. I suspect there is not one, the EAS have sorted that for all homebuilders.
Finally all Jodels fly lovely and the Mascaret (which I have never flown) has the reputation as being the best.
Do your homework and talk direct to the homebuilders association in Switzerland
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Thanks Oldpilot55, very useful information!
I'm curious why you refer to homebuilts / experimentals? So far my plan was to look for a factory-built Jodel (i.e., Annex II aircraft) -- would that still fall under "experimental"? (It would probably be registered in France, Germany, or the UK, not Switzerland.)
If I may ask -- what's your experience with maintenance costs and availability of maintenance facilities? (E.g., where would you have it repaired in case you discover rotten wood in your structure, or replace a patch of fabric?)
I'm curious why you refer to homebuilts / experimentals? So far my plan was to look for a factory-built Jodel (i.e., Annex II aircraft) -- would that still fall under "experimental"? (It would probably be registered in France, Germany, or the UK, not Switzerland.)
If I may ask -- what's your experience with maintenance costs and availability of maintenance facilities? (E.g., where would you have it repaired in case you discover rotten wood in your structure, or replace a patch of fabric?)
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Thanks Steve.
Most Mascarets have a 100hp O-200 engine and 113 kts cruise at 75% power / 22 lps. So assuming a similar BSFC and aerodynamic efficiency your power settings seems to be at around 100hp * 75% / 160hp ~ 50% power. Is that roughly right?
Most Mascarets have a 100hp O-200 engine and 113 kts cruise at 75% power / 22 lps. So assuming a similar BSFC and aerodynamic efficiency your power settings seems to be at around 100hp * 75% / 160hp ~ 50% power. Is that roughly right?
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Wooden aeroplanes are relatively easy to maintain. There are many organisations in the UK that can repair them, and I suspect throughout Europe. So far, touch wood, I've not had to repair any wooden part of the structure.
I could be wrong but most Mascarets in the UK are operated under LAA rules as homebuilts. My 1051, although built as a production aircraft, is an orphan with no one owning the type certificate and is now an LAA aircraft.
Different countries have different rules. Personally I prefer LAA aircraft because the maintenance regime is simpler and costs are lower.
I could be wrong but most Mascarets in the UK are operated under LAA rules as homebuilts. My 1051, although built as a production aircraft, is an orphan with no one owning the type certificate and is now an LAA aircraft.
Different countries have different rules. Personally I prefer LAA aircraft because the maintenance regime is simpler and costs are lower.
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Operating costs
Jodel owners: What are your typical annual maintenance costs, and hourly variable costs (including engine and prop fund)?
Are my assumptions below roughly correct?
Fixed / maintenance costs:
* 100-hour inspection: wild guess GBP 1000 per year on average?
* Annual: GBP 1000 per year on average with high standard deviation
* 50-hour inspection: Can do self (in UK or Germany)? GBP 300 per year?
* Bureaucratic stuff: national permit to fly, radio license, ... about GBP 1000 per year
(Hangarage, insurance, etc omitted as they're highly individual.)
=> About GBP 3500 fixed costs (excluding hangarage and insurance).
Variable costs:
* Assuming 25 lph Avgas / Mogas mix. Conservatively, Avgas GBP 2.5 per litre and Mogas GBP 1.5 per litre, so about GBP 2 per litre for a conservative 50-50 mix, gives GBP 50 per hour in fuel.
* Oil and other consumables: less than GBP 3 per hour.
* Engine overhaul: A zero-hour O-200 seems to cost about $15k, so about $11 per hour given TBO 1800 hours.
* Prop overhaul: Now sure about the Evra prop, maybe $5k every 2000 hours (so conservatively $5 per hour)?
=> Conservatively about GBP 65 variable costs.
Total cost per hour when flying 100 hours: GBP 90 (GBP 1000 reduction in fixed cost due to merging of annual and 100-hour inspection), excluding hourly cost of hangar and insurance.
Are my assumptions below roughly correct?
Fixed / maintenance costs:
* 100-hour inspection: wild guess GBP 1000 per year on average?
* Annual: GBP 1000 per year on average with high standard deviation
* 50-hour inspection: Can do self (in UK or Germany)? GBP 300 per year?
* Bureaucratic stuff: national permit to fly, radio license, ... about GBP 1000 per year
(Hangarage, insurance, etc omitted as they're highly individual.)
=> About GBP 3500 fixed costs (excluding hangarage and insurance).
Variable costs:
* Assuming 25 lph Avgas / Mogas mix. Conservatively, Avgas GBP 2.5 per litre and Mogas GBP 1.5 per litre, so about GBP 2 per litre for a conservative 50-50 mix, gives GBP 50 per hour in fuel.
* Oil and other consumables: less than GBP 3 per hour.
* Engine overhaul: A zero-hour O-200 seems to cost about $15k, so about $11 per hour given TBO 1800 hours.
* Prop overhaul: Now sure about the Evra prop, maybe $5k every 2000 hours (so conservatively $5 per hour)?
=> Conservatively about GBP 65 variable costs.
Total cost per hour when flying 100 hours: GBP 90 (GBP 1000 reduction in fixed cost due to merging of annual and 100-hour inspection), excluding hourly cost of hangar and insurance.
Flying a DR 1050 on UK LAA Permit to Fly, the Group has 6 members each paying £50 per month for hangarage, insurance, and payment to LAA for Permit. We pay £60 per hour wet, but landings are extra. We're making a good hourly profit towards engine fund and fabric replacement. We do most ( often all) of our Permit work. The Inspector examines the aircraft about a month before the permit expires, and tells us what is required. He then returns and does the Permit Inspection. We do the airtest, and send off the documents to the LAA. Within days, we have the new permit. Total cost in the last 2 years was low hundreds.
We are give tasks to be done over the year, and get them done for the next year's Inspection. We have very little unexpected downtime.
Before going on Permit, we had months of downtime, several thousand pound bills, and were struggling to build an engine fund.
We are give tasks to be done over the year, and get them done for the next year's Inspection. We have very little unexpected downtime.
Before going on Permit, we had months of downtime, several thousand pound bills, and were struggling to build an engine fund.
I own a share in a Jodel DR100A (which is currently up for sale - a lovely aircraft!).
When we renewed the permit in June it took us less than two days to perform the maintenance schedule, Our inspector then carried out the tasks we couldn't do - cable tensions and compressions - and just charged us £100 to sign off the paperwork. A further £200 to the LAA and our permit was renewed within days.
It really is economic flying!
When we renewed the permit in June it took us less than two days to perform the maintenance schedule, Our inspector then carried out the tasks we couldn't do - cable tensions and compressions - and just charged us £100 to sign off the paperwork. A further £200 to the LAA and our permit was renewed within days.
It really is economic flying!
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Is it costly to add a Mogas STC to this EASA Annex II aircraft with Continental O-200 engine?
Esso Super Unleaded is ethanol free in most of the country apart from the South West, we use it in our 1050
We also have Airworld test kit, and find regular unleaded is alcohol free from the Inverness depot. Some local filling stations get supplied from the south, and that contains alcohol. Sea tanker supplied fuel is said to be alcohol free. Almost always Tesco Elgin is alcohol free. It makes a big difference to our cost per hour.
