Question for commercial or high hour IMC private pilots
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I've had a few bits of light entertainment with equipment failure in IMC. I had the pitot static freeze up a couple of times, but with working vacuum and electric systems and power indications it's not a big problem.
I once had the AI fail on a PA 28 and then made the mistake of engaging the autopilot...."..
I once had the AI fail on a PA 28 and then made the mistake of engaging the autopilot...."..
Join Date: Jul 2008
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ACR7 Approach
For the benefit of those of us to have lived sheltered lives, can someone explain what an ACR7 approach is? Googling didn't provide much help although I infer it is some sort of radar approach.
As sharpend wrote earlier, IF was indeed taught in the venerable Chipmunk and I was one of those who received such training in the early '70s when I trained for my Preliminary Instrument Flying Grading (PIFG) at University Air Squadron. The main difference between PIFG training and IMCR training was that the RAF concentrated on sound basic IF skills, whether on full or limited panel. Unusual attitudes (we termed them Unusual Positions) were considerably more demanding than any civil IR requires - the reason being that a student could get find himself falling out of some aerobatic manoeuvre and suddenly in IMC. The AH would often topple, so the Turn and Slip was invariably used for UP recovery and it was essential to cage the DI before deliberate UP training. Once back in straight and level flight, re-synching the DI to the wet compass wasn't that easy as the compass had to be carefully reset (it was on the cockpit floor in front of the control column) whilst maintaining S&L flight - then reset and uncage the DI.
The only radio aid we had was a single 10-channel VHF set. So maintaining a mental picture of where you were whilst being vectored around by ATC became a core skill. Approaches were limited to PAR, SRA or, if you were very unlucky and there was no nearby ATC radar unit, VDF.
25 years later I taught basic IF in the Bulldog. Initially it was much the same as it had been in the Chipmunk, but the gyro instruments were a little better. Again, until the early 1990s we only had a basic crystal UHF radio with about 10 channels at best, but we also had a standby 118-136 MHz VHF set. Then came a very welcome mod. which provided VOR/DME, ILS and a full 225-400 MHz UHF - and even a transponder! No longer did I have to rely on UDF and VDF cross-cuts to know where I was above 8/8 cloud! The VOR/DME was really only used as a fixing aid, but I also taught students VOR tracking and VOR/DME holding. I developed a basic radio navex which my students flew dual; if I was happy with their performance, I would then send them off to do the same thing solo. One day I sent off one of my girls to fly the route above 8/8 cloud, then back for a PAR as the cloud base was within her limits. My more conservative colleagues were surprised that I'd authorised her to fly the exercise, but when she came back she said that it had been good to do something more challenging than yet more aerobatics in the local playpen and how good it felt to have been trusted in such a way.
To my mind, far too much IMCR training seems geared towards playing airliners in spamcans rather than acquiring sound core IF skills. Although I do recall one UAS student who, it seems, hadn't done much 'actual' IF work, most had been under a visor. It was obvious that he was cheating during UP recoveries, so I found some nice solid cloud and forced the little bugger to apply the techniques correctly - he did so and his general IF improved as a result.
There was some reluctance by my QFI colleagues to fly aeros or formation tailchasing above 8/8 in case the AH toppled. Bunch of wimps! Why did they think we were required to fly limited panel let downs as part of the annual IRT?
Even EASA has woken up to the fact that many current people-tube minders cannot seem to cope with unusual attitude recoveries these days even in VMC. So consideration is now being given to greater emphasis on training for such events at an early stage of flying training......
....as the RAF has always done!
The only radio aid we had was a single 10-channel VHF set. So maintaining a mental picture of where you were whilst being vectored around by ATC became a core skill. Approaches were limited to PAR, SRA or, if you were very unlucky and there was no nearby ATC radar unit, VDF.
25 years later I taught basic IF in the Bulldog. Initially it was much the same as it had been in the Chipmunk, but the gyro instruments were a little better. Again, until the early 1990s we only had a basic crystal UHF radio with about 10 channels at best, but we also had a standby 118-136 MHz VHF set. Then came a very welcome mod. which provided VOR/DME, ILS and a full 225-400 MHz UHF - and even a transponder! No longer did I have to rely on UDF and VDF cross-cuts to know where I was above 8/8 cloud! The VOR/DME was really only used as a fixing aid, but I also taught students VOR tracking and VOR/DME holding. I developed a basic radio navex which my students flew dual; if I was happy with their performance, I would then send them off to do the same thing solo. One day I sent off one of my girls to fly the route above 8/8 cloud, then back for a PAR as the cloud base was within her limits. My more conservative colleagues were surprised that I'd authorised her to fly the exercise, but when she came back she said that it had been good to do something more challenging than yet more aerobatics in the local playpen and how good it felt to have been trusted in such a way.
To my mind, far too much IMCR training seems geared towards playing airliners in spamcans rather than acquiring sound core IF skills. Although I do recall one UAS student who, it seems, hadn't done much 'actual' IF work, most had been under a visor. It was obvious that he was cheating during UP recoveries, so I found some nice solid cloud and forced the little bugger to apply the techniques correctly - he did so and his general IF improved as a result.
There was some reluctance by my QFI colleagues to fly aeros or formation tailchasing above 8/8 in case the AH toppled. Bunch of wimps! Why did they think we were required to fly limited panel let downs as part of the annual IRT?
Even EASA has woken up to the fact that many current people-tube minders cannot seem to cope with unusual attitude recoveries these days even in VMC. So consideration is now being given to greater emphasis on training for such events at an early stage of flying training......
....as the RAF has always done!
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Question for commercial or high hour IMC private pilots
It seems to me the key points of the question are "comfortable" and "heavy IMC" - whatever that means - I assume a planned flight in continuous IMC, not just a chance encounter with a pop-up cloud or transit through a cloud layer.
For myself (being a coward, maybe a bit rusty on IR flying and not wishing to scare myself), some form of auto camel would be appreciated (this could take the form of a second crew member).
Once camel is engaged, charts can be conveniently read, frequencies changed and new plans made without the risk of loss of control.
Of course one would then need to know the input requirements of the auto camel. This maybe independent or the (failed) Attitude Indicator (in which case it's not much good) or if a simple wing-leveler it is normally the (electric) TC. Nav inputs from Garmin would also be helpful, assuming the heading bug on the DI has failed. I'm not sure if VOR tracking would be available, does this use the DI?.
As far as limited panel goes, much depends on the instruments in the particular aircraft, these can be well damped or rather wobbly. I would tend to regard limited panel as survival mode only.
To summarise, we need to know the aircraft fit-up and if electric/ vacuum driven (this can vary), then the "comfort" of continuing or recognising a potential "survival mode" can be determined and appropriate changes to the flight plan made (call for help).
An interesting question for the average light aircraft.
flyme.
For myself (being a coward, maybe a bit rusty on IR flying and not wishing to scare myself), some form of auto camel would be appreciated (this could take the form of a second crew member).
Once camel is engaged, charts can be conveniently read, frequencies changed and new plans made without the risk of loss of control.
Of course one would then need to know the input requirements of the auto camel. This maybe independent or the (failed) Attitude Indicator (in which case it's not much good) or if a simple wing-leveler it is normally the (electric) TC. Nav inputs from Garmin would also be helpful, assuming the heading bug on the DI has failed. I'm not sure if VOR tracking would be available, does this use the DI?.
As far as limited panel goes, much depends on the instruments in the particular aircraft, these can be well damped or rather wobbly. I would tend to regard limited panel as survival mode only.
To summarise, we need to know the aircraft fit-up and if electric/ vacuum driven (this can vary), then the "comfort" of continuing or recognising a potential "survival mode" can be determined and appropriate changes to the flight plan made (call for help).
An interesting question for the average light aircraft.
flyme.
Of course today is very much different to the 60s. Then we had no MOT, no calculators, no Sat Nav, no breathalizer etc etc. Today is different. Health & safety & political correctiveness rule alongside the accountant.
I remember Bruce Latten sharpening up my steeps turns (60 degrees of bank) in a Folland Gnat over the Irish Sea. On instruments at 50 feet above the waves! After that I did not lose 50 feet in a turn! That set me up subsequently for programming the NavWass in a Jaguar at 540 knots, 250 feet AGL.
I also remember low level night navigation exercises in the Chippy! No map reading possible at night over the North York Moors so it was the veritable true bearings that fixed us. Not always possible at 500 ft agl.
We were mad! Silly billies.
I remember Bruce Latten sharpening up my steeps turns (60 degrees of bank) in a Folland Gnat over the Irish Sea. On instruments at 50 feet above the waves! After that I did not lose 50 feet in a turn! That set me up subsequently for programming the NavWass in a Jaguar at 540 knots, 250 feet AGL.
I also remember low level night navigation exercises in the Chippy! No map reading possible at night over the North York Moors so it was the veritable true bearings that fixed us. Not always possible at 500 ft agl.
We were mad! Silly billies.
