Improving efficiency / speed at the start of my flight?
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,291
Likes: 2
From: GLASGOW
This is of course where the world of difference between owning your own aeroplane, and jumping in to the 'club' aeroplane kicks in.
My view has always been that it is an A, B,C,D, building block mentality to checks. If you use the same routine, before, and after your last flight, and you own the aeroplane, then everything should be as you left it. But let's check anyway......
Use the same mentality in the club aircraft, but double check everything. I always found it amazing when flying group, or club aircraft, the disarray some folk could leave an aeroplane in. Even the time when someone had been out to test the radio, and the next guy pitched up to a flat battery, because the radio, master, had been used for over an hour, and then left on for two days
I still run through my check lists religiously, file the flight plan at home, if one required, and check weather before I get to the field. As mentioned earlier, no need to rush it.
One thing to watch out for. Your doing your walk round, getting ready to leave, when someone comes up to you to have a chat....now that can put you out of your stride. Once left my mobile phone on the elevator, prior to a display. Found it on the grass on my return,but it could have been a bit worse..
My view has always been that it is an A, B,C,D, building block mentality to checks. If you use the same routine, before, and after your last flight, and you own the aeroplane, then everything should be as you left it. But let's check anyway......
Use the same mentality in the club aircraft, but double check everything. I always found it amazing when flying group, or club aircraft, the disarray some folk could leave an aeroplane in. Even the time when someone had been out to test the radio, and the next guy pitched up to a flat battery, because the radio, master, had been used for over an hour, and then left on for two days
I still run through my check lists religiously, file the flight plan at home, if one required, and check weather before I get to the field. As mentioned earlier, no need to rush it.
One thing to watch out for. Your doing your walk round, getting ready to leave, when someone comes up to you to have a chat....now that can put you out of your stride. Once left my mobile phone on the elevator, prior to a display. Found it on the grass on my return,but it could have been a bit worse..
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 359
Likes: 0
From: Vienna
One thing to watch out for. Your doing your walk round, getting ready to leave, when someone comes up to you to have a chat....now that can put you out of your stride.
Regarding the OP: flying is not a speed contest, and you're probably not on a scramble mission. Good and timely preparation has its merits, but once near or in the airplane, take it slowly. Fast Finger Freddie and/or rushed preflight or inflight checks are extremely bad companions in aviation.
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 3,077
Likes: 1
From: Oop North, UK
How many hours do think the aircraft can fly when you take off with the oil on the minimum mark?
Yes, most modern aircraft will be fine departing on min, but not recommended, and there are older aircraft where the oil consumption is more of a consideration than the fuel!!
Last edited by foxmoth; 4th May 2014 at 07:55.
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 497
Likes: 0
From: EU
BTW, Are people always doing Weight & Balance for SEP? I mean a 172 or PA-28 or similar? Seriously?
After some unpleasant surprises over the years, both privately and at work, for me the first item on this list is: "go to aeroplane". A flying school or rental aeroplane may not even be there, have a flat battery, a flat tyre, no papers onboard or some very obvious fault that makes it unflyable (I experienced all the items on that list at least once). Discovering that after having spent an hour with preparations can ruin your day even more.
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,663
Likes: 0
From: Earth
in terms of hours gained I'm still a fresh PPL (A) holder (I learned in the UK) with only a few solo hours under my belt post-skills test.
Patience will be well rewarded young man. Continue doing things by the book as you've been taught .... a few dozen hours later and it'll all become second nature and you'll wonder what you ever came here moaning about !
Remember what it was like the few weeks after you'd just past your driving test ? Driving around the mean streets alone without your instructor and the security afforded by the "stay away" big L plates ? Well its the same with flying.
Whatever you do, don't be tempted to cut corners.
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 326
Likes: 0
From: Perth, WA
I wouldn't be too worried about being slow at your early stage of flying, but the goal should be continuous improvement, perhaps using some of the ideas other posters have contributed. The main thing is to have a structured approach, so that the must-do items are covered off unambiguously. As an aircraft owner, and assuming a large part of the flight planning has been done the day before a major trip, for me that means starting with the aeroplane and doing a proper daily inspection with fluid checks, fuel drains, etc.
While slow and steady is OK, be wary of undirected faffing. Better to consciously learn from your shortcomings and, if necessary, steal and adapt what you see working for people with whom you like flying. I used to marvel at how easy the good pilots with whom I flew made cross country flying. I could see it was all down to preparation and clear thinking on the day and, over time, I've tried to likewise achieve a good standard. Just because you're a PPL doesn't mean you can't be totally professional in your flying!
I think that the fact you recognize the issue indicates that you'll probably make good progress. In my observation, not all pilots do see the problem and it's not uncommon to see recreational flyers of years standing still having issues with task prioritization, cockpit organization, etc. It's ironic but true that all the discipline ultimately leads to a sense of freedom: with enough directed practice you reach a point where you can do the important planning and aircraft-related tasks swiftly and accurately, with the result that the actual flying becomes even more enjoyable.
One interesting observation I've noted is that the business of getting their flying together has really helped some self-confessed chronic faffers in other aspects of life. There are no doubt some interesting things going on but, from an outsider's perspective, the effect is certainly obvious.
While slow and steady is OK, be wary of undirected faffing. Better to consciously learn from your shortcomings and, if necessary, steal and adapt what you see working for people with whom you like flying. I used to marvel at how easy the good pilots with whom I flew made cross country flying. I could see it was all down to preparation and clear thinking on the day and, over time, I've tried to likewise achieve a good standard. Just because you're a PPL doesn't mean you can't be totally professional in your flying!
I think that the fact you recognize the issue indicates that you'll probably make good progress. In my observation, not all pilots do see the problem and it's not uncommon to see recreational flyers of years standing still having issues with task prioritization, cockpit organization, etc. It's ironic but true that all the discipline ultimately leads to a sense of freedom: with enough directed practice you reach a point where you can do the important planning and aircraft-related tasks swiftly and accurately, with the result that the actual flying becomes even more enjoyable.
One interesting observation I've noted is that the business of getting their flying together has really helped some self-confessed chronic faffers in other aspects of life. There are no doubt some interesting things going on but, from an outsider's perspective, the effect is certainly obvious.
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,991
Likes: 8
From: UK
At times I can't believe how incredibly complicated we've made it to safely operate a light aircraft.
Whilst broadly speaking I am in favour of the use of checklists, lists, "standard procedures", mnemonics and the like the pendulum seems to have swung too far in this direction to the detriment of using common sense and some original thought when required.
Good pilots are looking for ways of reducing the workload and not increasing it. Work smart and not hard and KISS - Keep It Simple Stupid!
It's a slight digression but when instructing I find myself having to spend more and more time speaking about "checklist philosophy". There's a lot more to safely operating an aircraft than just blindly following a set of procedures.
A checklist is there to ask the pilot the question "Have you done this?" and not "This is how you do it!". One simple example of this are the immediate critical actions after start. Typically these are checking the starter warning light has extinguished, the oil pressure is rising and setting 1200 RPM (as appropriate to type). These checks should be done from memory rather than having head buried in a checklist whilst the revs go leaping up to circa 1700 RPM with a cold engine whilst said pilot laboriously plods throughout the checklist. Having completed the actions we then refer to the checklist to ensure that nothing has been omitted. This same philosophy can also be applied to preparation before flight i.e. do the actions and then refer to a list to make sure you have considered all items.
Many commercially produced checklists I find are appallingly written in this respect with items which are in conflict with the POH on the aircraft.
Speed and efficiency come through understanding (i.e. why are we doing this now etc), competence and regular practice. As has been said previously I wouldn't be overly concerned with speed. My observation is that those who rush things often end up taking longer. As my father used to teach "Hurry slowly".
Whilst broadly speaking I am in favour of the use of checklists, lists, "standard procedures", mnemonics and the like the pendulum seems to have swung too far in this direction to the detriment of using common sense and some original thought when required.
Good pilots are looking for ways of reducing the workload and not increasing it. Work smart and not hard and KISS - Keep It Simple Stupid!
It's a slight digression but when instructing I find myself having to spend more and more time speaking about "checklist philosophy". There's a lot more to safely operating an aircraft than just blindly following a set of procedures.
A checklist is there to ask the pilot the question "Have you done this?" and not "This is how you do it!". One simple example of this are the immediate critical actions after start. Typically these are checking the starter warning light has extinguished, the oil pressure is rising and setting 1200 RPM (as appropriate to type). These checks should be done from memory rather than having head buried in a checklist whilst the revs go leaping up to circa 1700 RPM with a cold engine whilst said pilot laboriously plods throughout the checklist. Having completed the actions we then refer to the checklist to ensure that nothing has been omitted. This same philosophy can also be applied to preparation before flight i.e. do the actions and then refer to a list to make sure you have considered all items.
Many commercially produced checklists I find are appallingly written in this respect with items which are in conflict with the POH on the aircraft.
Speed and efficiency come through understanding (i.e. why are we doing this now etc), competence and regular practice. As has been said previously I wouldn't be overly concerned with speed. My observation is that those who rush things often end up taking longer. As my father used to teach "Hurry slowly".
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,113
Likes: 2
From: 23, Railway Cuttings, East Cheam
A checklist is there to ask the pilot the question "Have you done this?" and not "This is how you do it!". One simple example of this are the immediate critical actions after start. Typically these are checking the starter warning light has extinguished, the oil pressure is rising and setting 1200 RPM (as appropriate to type). These checks should be done from memory rather than having head buried in a checklist whilst the revs go leaping up to circa 1700 RPM with a cold engine whilst said pilot laboriously plods throughout the checklist.
However, I still follow the checklist, because being human, I will forget something important at some stage or another.
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,991
Likes: 8
From: UK
I don't think anyone has a problem with that (other than the checklist plodders as you mention). The 'After start' checklist as you say is actually a two or three second scan around the relevant bits that are invariably much the same for any SEP aircraft; lights out that need to be out, oil pressure, revs, wigglies and sucking. You can then have a look at the checklist. The checklist (I'm assuming this is what you are saying) isn't a 'this is how to fly an aircraft and if you don't do things in this order you will die', it's just a reminder of the functions you should already know as a competent pilot.
However, I still follow the checklist, because being human, I will forget something important at some stage or another.
However, I still follow the checklist, because being human, I will forget something important at some stage or another.
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 326
Likes: 0
From: Perth, WA
It's the clarity of thought and action that's important, rather than the exact way it's achieved. My own belief is that committing the simplest appropriate check lists to memory represents a worthwhile commitment to one's flying. Eyes down, labouring point by point over a written checklist on mid-downwind is not a good look.
The funny thing is that after a while you can almost predict the standard of the flying by taking in a pilot's behaviour as he/she gets to the holding point. I did my AFR (two yearly review) a couple of weeks ago and the test officer mentioned afterwards that she can usually predict outcomes in the first minute or two. If you bumble around doing the preflight, start etc it's a pretty fair bet that's the general approach to your flying.
I again commend the OP's awareness of his situation and his wish to improve.
The funny thing is that after a while you can almost predict the standard of the flying by taking in a pilot's behaviour as he/she gets to the holding point. I did my AFR (two yearly review) a couple of weeks ago and the test officer mentioned afterwards that she can usually predict outcomes in the first minute or two. If you bumble around doing the preflight, start etc it's a pretty fair bet that's the general approach to your flying.
I again commend the OP's awareness of his situation and his wish to improve.
Thread Starter
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 31
Likes: 0
From: UK
Hi everyone,
Thank you so much for the honest, constructive replies, including those that were less forgiving (tecman - I certainly don't want to give anybody reasons to doubt me / my ability before I've even gotten off the ground - good advice)! These were exactly the responses I was looking for...
I think the ideas of employing common sense and trying to keep things simple are good points to keep in mind, and I particularly like the idea of having a short and simple mental checklist of what I need to cover at each point (sorry - can't remember who posted that).
Re checklist usage: I memorised all checks done whilst airborne a long time ago, but agree my "ground checks" (if you like) could be smartened up a bit. As some of you mentioned, it would probably be a better idea to run through all ground checks from memory (which would have the benefit of making me think what I'm doing next and why), but confirm each section is complete by running through the checklist items at the end of each section. After all, there's nothing worse than carrying out checks blindly, without any thought as to why such an item needs attention.
Whilst it is true that I'm hour building in prep for the CPL, I wonder if becoming familiar with short-cut phone apps, GPS and aircraft autopilot, etc might not be such a bad idea? Clearly, I don't want to lose confidence in my ability to navigate through Dead Reckoning, etc but equally I'm sure it would benefit me in the long run to become familiar with other "devices" that people rely on in the real world (the GA pilots on my ground course, for example, use GPS apps "on the line", and laughed when I asked if they referred to their charts, stop-watch, etc on everyday flights).
Thanks again,
A Biggles
P.S. Oddly, I find one of the harder things to judge is how long I will need at the school where I'm hiring out an aircraft currently, between the point where I file the flight plan ETD, and getting to the aircraft in good time. Because of the way the school does things, I can't A-check the aircraft until I've done all the ground work, and I can't do any of the ground work until I've filed the flight plan. So, becoming more efficient and organised means I can feel more confident in the amount of time I have available to me, and less in a rush to depart before my flight plan expires.
Thank you so much for the honest, constructive replies, including those that were less forgiving (tecman - I certainly don't want to give anybody reasons to doubt me / my ability before I've even gotten off the ground - good advice)! These were exactly the responses I was looking for...
I think the ideas of employing common sense and trying to keep things simple are good points to keep in mind, and I particularly like the idea of having a short and simple mental checklist of what I need to cover at each point (sorry - can't remember who posted that).
Re checklist usage: I memorised all checks done whilst airborne a long time ago, but agree my "ground checks" (if you like) could be smartened up a bit. As some of you mentioned, it would probably be a better idea to run through all ground checks from memory (which would have the benefit of making me think what I'm doing next and why), but confirm each section is complete by running through the checklist items at the end of each section. After all, there's nothing worse than carrying out checks blindly, without any thought as to why such an item needs attention.
Whilst it is true that I'm hour building in prep for the CPL, I wonder if becoming familiar with short-cut phone apps, GPS and aircraft autopilot, etc might not be such a bad idea? Clearly, I don't want to lose confidence in my ability to navigate through Dead Reckoning, etc but equally I'm sure it would benefit me in the long run to become familiar with other "devices" that people rely on in the real world (the GA pilots on my ground course, for example, use GPS apps "on the line", and laughed when I asked if they referred to their charts, stop-watch, etc on everyday flights).
Thanks again,
A Biggles
P.S. Oddly, I find one of the harder things to judge is how long I will need at the school where I'm hiring out an aircraft currently, between the point where I file the flight plan ETD, and getting to the aircraft in good time. Because of the way the school does things, I can't A-check the aircraft until I've done all the ground work, and I can't do any of the ground work until I've filed the flight plan. So, becoming more efficient and organised means I can feel more confident in the amount of time I have available to me, and less in a rush to depart before my flight plan expires.
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 326
Likes: 0
From: Perth, WA
AB, the question about technology versus basics is a pretty difficult one in practice, especially since you have CPL and ATPL aspirations. Most of us do use the technology that's available but, in my estimation, you also have to be totally confident in your ability to revert back to pen and paper, and hand flying.
My approach is to use a good computer-based planning package, and to use an iPAD for back-up in-flight navigation. I consciously choose to have a map and stretchy ruler (don't ask!) as my full time tools, and enjoy glancing at the iPAD/GPS to confirm waypoint estimates etc. The trick is to use the technology to improve my mental techniques. Would I do this if I were a CPL doing paying trips? Probably not every trip, but probably often enough to convince myself that I wasn't kidding myself about my abilities.
Just on a practical level, technology does fail of course. For example, summers are pretty hot here in WA and on a recent cross country my iPAD decided to go into over-temp shutdown, a well-known effect. No practical impact on the flight though: the marked up map, paper plan (and, rather too luxuriously, a panel GPS) gave seamless reversion. I do see plenty of people - particularly those in our Recreational Aviation community - who bet the farm on the iPAD or some other system staying alive.
Having said all that, you are clearly trying to build a number of career skills, including being an efficient CPL operator. Most likely that requires practising both the basics and the IT-based solutions. Same with the auto-pilot: to use it safely, you need to build familiarity while retaining the ability to hand-fly the aeroplane in all circumstances. The balance you strike on these decisions may depend on how much flying you're doing. If it's minimal, I'd suggest that concentrating on the basics should take priority. If you're doing a lot of hours, vary your routine a bit. One of the great things about being the PIC is that you get to make the choices
My approach is to use a good computer-based planning package, and to use an iPAD for back-up in-flight navigation. I consciously choose to have a map and stretchy ruler (don't ask!) as my full time tools, and enjoy glancing at the iPAD/GPS to confirm waypoint estimates etc. The trick is to use the technology to improve my mental techniques. Would I do this if I were a CPL doing paying trips? Probably not every trip, but probably often enough to convince myself that I wasn't kidding myself about my abilities.
Just on a practical level, technology does fail of course. For example, summers are pretty hot here in WA and on a recent cross country my iPAD decided to go into over-temp shutdown, a well-known effect. No practical impact on the flight though: the marked up map, paper plan (and, rather too luxuriously, a panel GPS) gave seamless reversion. I do see plenty of people - particularly those in our Recreational Aviation community - who bet the farm on the iPAD or some other system staying alive.
Having said all that, you are clearly trying to build a number of career skills, including being an efficient CPL operator. Most likely that requires practising both the basics and the IT-based solutions. Same with the auto-pilot: to use it safely, you need to build familiarity while retaining the ability to hand-fly the aeroplane in all circumstances. The balance you strike on these decisions may depend on how much flying you're doing. If it's minimal, I'd suggest that concentrating on the basics should take priority. If you're doing a lot of hours, vary your routine a bit. One of the great things about being the PIC is that you get to make the choices
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 10,804
Likes: 1
to be honest I have never seen in a incident report
"the pilot carried out excessive pre flight planning and aircraft check"
yes you can go like stink but then there is always the chance you forget something.
I legged it into work to take an aircraft to maint. Grabbed a VFR chart and headset threw it into the back and did a pre flight check then flew for an hour. When arriving the engineers started taking the piss about how many times I had checked my chart on the way there.
Turns out I had grabbed the PPL Nav exam chart which isn't much use in Scotland.
"the pilot carried out excessive pre flight planning and aircraft check"
yes you can go like stink but then there is always the chance you forget something.
I legged it into work to take an aircraft to maint. Grabbed a VFR chart and headset threw it into the back and did a pre flight check then flew for an hour. When arriving the engineers started taking the piss about how many times I had checked my chart on the way there.
Turns out I had grabbed the PPL Nav exam chart which isn't much use in Scotland.
