Flying in Germany - Advice
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Flying in Germany - Advice
Hi,
I am interested in doing some flying in Europe this summer, particularly to Germany.
Does anyone have any useful advice on where to find more information? Useful organisations to contact?
I imagine there must be a fair few here who have flown into Aero Friedrichshafen over the years.
Apologies for not being more specific, but I am at the very begining of my investigations and any pointers gratefully received.
Thanks,
JT
I am interested in doing some flying in Europe this summer, particularly to Germany.
Does anyone have any useful advice on where to find more information? Useful organisations to contact?
I imagine there must be a fair few here who have flown into Aero Friedrichshafen over the years.
Apologies for not being more specific, but I am at the very begining of my investigations and any pointers gratefully received.
Thanks,
JT
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Hi James,
I fly here a fair bit of the time, what do you need to know? If you can be specific what you're looking for, maybe I can help, just PM me.
The first thing is which I note is that flying here is easier with just 3 Flight Information Services - Bremen, Langen and Muenchen Information (albeit with different frequencies). The good thing about these guys is that rarely do they refuse a traffic service - can I withstand the temptation to pose the question "what is the point of a basic service"?? Yes, I can......
The main issue you'll have is getting AIPs, they aren't published free of charge, the DFS charges for them - however if you know where you will be flying to, most airfields publish their aip on their website. Notable is that the AIPs actually show the circuit to be flown - so stick to these because at certain airfields - Bonn Hangelaar is the biggest stickler - if you don't fly in accordance with the published AIP *exactly*, they will summons you for noise infringements. If this happens to you, there's apparently a solution: claim you were taking avoiding action - avoiding a bird strike....
If you're flying to a lot of airfields, it might be worthwhile considering the "Landegutscheinheft" - it's 2 little booklets, one for north, one for south, which allows 3 landings at certain airfields and this can give some cost savings. Hannover and Paderborn / Lippstadt are listed, so it's not just the smaller airfield involved.
Notams, filing flightplans (when flying VFR only necessary when crossing international borders - with the exception of Austria where you don't have to file plans) can be found here - access is free after registration....
As said, anything else, let me know....
I fly here a fair bit of the time, what do you need to know? If you can be specific what you're looking for, maybe I can help, just PM me.
The first thing is which I note is that flying here is easier with just 3 Flight Information Services - Bremen, Langen and Muenchen Information (albeit with different frequencies). The good thing about these guys is that rarely do they refuse a traffic service - can I withstand the temptation to pose the question "what is the point of a basic service"?? Yes, I can......
The main issue you'll have is getting AIPs, they aren't published free of charge, the DFS charges for them - however if you know where you will be flying to, most airfields publish their aip on their website. Notable is that the AIPs actually show the circuit to be flown - so stick to these because at certain airfields - Bonn Hangelaar is the biggest stickler - if you don't fly in accordance with the published AIP *exactly*, they will summons you for noise infringements. If this happens to you, there's apparently a solution: claim you were taking avoiding action - avoiding a bird strike....
If you're flying to a lot of airfields, it might be worthwhile considering the "Landegutscheinheft" - it's 2 little booklets, one for north, one for south, which allows 3 landings at certain airfields and this can give some cost savings. Hannover and Paderborn / Lippstadt are listed, so it's not just the smaller airfield involved.
Notams, filing flightplans (when flying VFR only necessary when crossing international borders - with the exception of Austria where you don't have to file plans) can be found here - access is free after registration....
As said, anything else, let me know....
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Make sure you have all the required aircraft and pilot licensing documentation with you.
Ramp checks are not uncommon and I have seen British pilots unable to take off due to not being able to documentation not being in order.
Be sure to have the aircraft noise certificate with you, it will save you money on landing fees.
I have also heard of the ramp checkers asking to see the load sheet for the flight, while not strictly necessary for private flight I keep a selection of computer generated load sheets in the aircraft to cover most likely scenarios and the production of one of these would no doubt supply enough info to keep the box tickers happy.
Ramp checks are not uncommon and I have seen British pilots unable to take off due to not being able to documentation not being in order.
Be sure to have the aircraft noise certificate with you, it will save you money on landing fees.
I have also heard of the ramp checkers asking to see the load sheet for the flight, while not strictly necessary for private flight I keep a selection of computer generated load sheets in the aircraft to cover most likely scenarios and the production of one of these would no doubt supply enough info to keep the box tickers happy.
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I guess the load sheet for a small private aircraft would be a written Weight and Balance calculation, but what is a Noise Certificate?
Is this something all aircraft have that I am not aware of, or something special we would need an engineer to come an assess for us?
-JT
Is this something all aircraft have that I am not aware of, or something special we would need an engineer to come an assess for us?
-JT
AFAIU the "noise certificate" is a Germany only thing; as I fly on a type with no German type certificate it seems I can never get one. Mind you, the Fritzen will allow me to enter, but I will pay a slightly higher fee at a few aerodromes. Luckily, most have a fixed rate for microlights and don't even ask for the noise certificate.
Regarding Friedrichshafen: I never did it myself, seeing my dislike for crowds and for commercialism; but I read more than once that flying in during the fair is not a trivial exercise. I think it is not the best idea for a first try. Should you absolutely want to visit the fair, flying, then I recommend you look into alternate aerodromes nearby.
Rather, find yourself a quiet field that suits your plane and your piloting skills, and wait for a day of really good weather. Many fields in Germany have eateries on site, some even quite famous, and generally quite affordable. If the morning drabble lifts, you can fly there before noon, have a nice lunch, and fly back relaxed in the afternoon - if you do not depart from the Hebrides or such.
Be warned that many German field are at the top of a hill, which helps a good deal against waterlogging; but the first sight may be daunting. Spectacular (to me) are Mount Royal EDRM (in the eye of a meander of the river Mosel) and Koblenz EDRK (wineyards falling down from just across the access road - Greek restaurant is irreproachable). Check out internet photography to get your own ideas!
Regarding Friedrichshafen: I never did it myself, seeing my dislike for crowds and for commercialism; but I read more than once that flying in during the fair is not a trivial exercise. I think it is not the best idea for a first try. Should you absolutely want to visit the fair, flying, then I recommend you look into alternate aerodromes nearby.
Rather, find yourself a quiet field that suits your plane and your piloting skills, and wait for a day of really good weather. Many fields in Germany have eateries on site, some even quite famous, and generally quite affordable. If the morning drabble lifts, you can fly there before noon, have a nice lunch, and fly back relaxed in the afternoon - if you do not depart from the Hebrides or such.
Be warned that many German field are at the top of a hill, which helps a good deal against waterlogging; but the first sight may be daunting. Spectacular (to me) are Mount Royal EDRM (in the eye of a meander of the river Mosel) and Koblenz EDRK (wineyards falling down from just across the access road - Greek restaurant is irreproachable). Check out internet photography to get your own ideas!
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the lack of a free AIP is indeed a pity. However, you will often find the VFR approach charts published on the WEB-sites of some fields. The IFR-charts are available through Eurocontrol anyway. In addition there is a WEB-site that has got mini VFR approach charts: AIRPORT Flughafen Flugplatz Pilot
Steve mentioned the Flight Information Service (Bremen, Langen, Munich). Bremen is frequently overloaded and does not provide basic information services due to workload. This is almost never happening in the Langen of Munich sectors (might be different during the weekend of Tannkosh). FIS does talk Germany and English. Typically you tell them: call sign, type of aircraft, route, position, and altitude. You be getting a generic squawk code (370x in the Langen sector). FIS will not give any clearances to e.g. cross a Charly airspace but will coordinate such things with RADAR. They may forward a clearance from RADAR to you or hand you over. They will also close your flight plan if you tell them that you have got the airfield in sight and that your landing is secured (saves you a call). You may want to register with the Germany ATC-WEB-site (https://secais.dfs.de/pilotservice/home.jsp?lang=en) You can file flight plans and get NOTAMs, etc.
Most small airfields to only talk German (on the radio) to you by default. However, try English even if the AIP say German only. Most of the "Fritzens" that do the ATC on small field speak enough English to get you down.
There only a few airfields that are inside a class D/CTR-airspace (e.g. Mannheim, Braunschweig, ...). Most of the small fields are uncontrolled airfields. However, I are not allowed to land without having a "Flugleiter" on side. There are a few fields that do feature an automated "Flugleiter", which will reply to your initial call and give you active runway + Wind. Some of the German "Flugleiters" do however behave as if their field would be in a class D/CTR-airspace. Don't let them fool you: you are the PIC, you take the decisions and a Flugleiter does only have to provide information such as Wind, traffic information, etc.
Airspace: there is Charly airspace from FL100 an higher (slightly higher near the alps). Airspace Golf is normaly from 0 to 2500 AGL, unless otherwise specified (0...1700 AGL or 0...1000 AGL near CTRs). Most of German VFR airspace is class Echo. There are very few restricted or danger areas. FIS will tell you if they are active or not.
so much about "Flying in Germany in a nutshell"
Happy landings in Germany
Mark
Steve mentioned the Flight Information Service (Bremen, Langen, Munich). Bremen is frequently overloaded and does not provide basic information services due to workload. This is almost never happening in the Langen of Munich sectors (might be different during the weekend of Tannkosh). FIS does talk Germany and English. Typically you tell them: call sign, type of aircraft, route, position, and altitude. You be getting a generic squawk code (370x in the Langen sector). FIS will not give any clearances to e.g. cross a Charly airspace but will coordinate such things with RADAR. They may forward a clearance from RADAR to you or hand you over. They will also close your flight plan if you tell them that you have got the airfield in sight and that your landing is secured (saves you a call). You may want to register with the Germany ATC-WEB-site (https://secais.dfs.de/pilotservice/home.jsp?lang=en) You can file flight plans and get NOTAMs, etc.
Most small airfields to only talk German (on the radio) to you by default. However, try English even if the AIP say German only. Most of the "Fritzens" that do the ATC on small field speak enough English to get you down.
There only a few airfields that are inside a class D/CTR-airspace (e.g. Mannheim, Braunschweig, ...). Most of the small fields are uncontrolled airfields. However, I are not allowed to land without having a "Flugleiter" on side. There are a few fields that do feature an automated "Flugleiter", which will reply to your initial call and give you active runway + Wind. Some of the German "Flugleiters" do however behave as if their field would be in a class D/CTR-airspace. Don't let them fool you: you are the PIC, you take the decisions and a Flugleiter does only have to provide information such as Wind, traffic information, etc.
Airspace: there is Charly airspace from FL100 an higher (slightly higher near the alps). Airspace Golf is normaly from 0 to 2500 AGL, unless otherwise specified (0...1700 AGL or 0...1000 AGL near CTRs). Most of German VFR airspace is class Echo. There are very few restricted or danger areas. FIS will tell you if they are active or not.
so much about "Flying in Germany in a nutshell"
Happy landings in Germany
Mark
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into Aero Friedrichshafen over the years
Ask the Luftaufsicht there about the procedure, they will be able to help.
[email protected] or phone +497541284120
see also here:
General Aviation :: Bodensee-Airport Friedrichshafen
