Bolkow Junior
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Bolkow Junior
I'm thinking of getting a Bolkow Junior when I sell my Auster. Has anybody got experience of operating a Junior off grass? The strip I currently use is 550m long.
Any general info about handling and performance is welcome.
Any general info about handling and performance is welcome.
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I looked at buying a Junior some time ago, the only reason I didn't was I'm too large for it. My kneecaps were jammed against the underside of the dashboard. Not very comfortable after 20 minutes or so.
There is a Junior forum, probably you can get more detailed info there:
Boelkow 208C JUNIOR: German Oldtimer plane
There is a Junior forum, probably you can get more detailed info there:
Boelkow 208C JUNIOR: German Oldtimer plane
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There was one based on our strip, 620metre grass, never a problem as far as I recall, till it turned upside down in the mud & was discovered to have serious issues with cracks in a tailplane mounting that were more common than had been thought, not caused by the upside down thing.(other a/c similar).
Any general info about handling and performance is welcome.
Bjorn Andreasson was working on Convair jets with very thin wings when he designed the prototype. Maybe some of that came through in the design.
Last edited by Silvaire1; 25th Feb 2013 at 17:54.
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If you have a look at the PocketFMS forum, there is a guy called "Stu" who is UK based and flies his Balkow Junior all around Europe.
He's a very nice guy and I'm sure would be happy to answer your questions if you contacted him.
dp
He's a very nice guy and I'm sure would be happy to answer your questions if you contacted him.
dp
Bjorn Andreasson was working on Convair jets with very thin wings when he designed the prototype. Maybe some of that came through in the design.
As for interior dimensions, the Bo 208C variant should provide a few extra centimetres over the earlier versions.
Some years ago, a Czech company had plans for a Rotax 912 powered microlight variant of the Junior and displayed a prototype at the "AERO" exhibition in Friedrichshafen/Germany.
Allegedly, Björn Andreassons plans for the MFI-9 (the progenitor of the Junior) are still available if you want to build one yourself...
Thread Starter
Thanks for all the info people, sounds like I need to go and sit in one to see if 6' and 15 stone (1.83m / 95kg) fits comfortably!!
Dublinpilot, I'll joing the forum and have a chat with Stu. Thanks for the tip.
Dublinpilot, I'll joing the forum and have a chat with Stu. Thanks for the tip.
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There isn't a lot of width either, if my memory is correct. Worth sitting in one to see! I remember banging elbows with my instructor.
I did my initial training in one. The throttle on the left and the electric flaps on the centre panel made juggling the Y shaped stick interesting but I enjoyed flying it. Semi-aerobatic too - although not with a passenger.
I don't remember it being under powered - but then thats all I knew at the time (and had a very long runway to play on).
Need to be careful to avoid tail strikes and the wheels are quite small (plus mine had spats). Might want to remove the spats if going to be operating constantly on grass...
Its also an EASA aircraft (if I remember rightly) and ours had a CofA rather than a permit. Don't know if that matters to you.
I did my initial training in one. The throttle on the left and the electric flaps on the centre panel made juggling the Y shaped stick interesting but I enjoyed flying it. Semi-aerobatic too - although not with a passenger.
I don't remember it being under powered - but then thats all I knew at the time (and had a very long runway to play on).
Need to be careful to avoid tail strikes and the wheels are quite small (plus mine had spats). Might want to remove the spats if going to be operating constantly on grass...
Its also an EASA aircraft (if I remember rightly) and ours had a CofA rather than a permit. Don't know if that matters to you.
Thread Starter
Hmm, I thought they could be aerobatted two up. If they can't then there's no point in having one. I'll have to dig out the weights allowed.
They seem to be a mixed bag regarding certification; there's at least one on an EASA ARC on the German reg but based in the UK and there's also at least one with UK reg on an LAA Permit. Again, for me an LAA Permit is the way to go as I have a CAA "Licence for life" and have no intention (at the moment) of converting it to an EASA licence.
They seem to be a mixed bag regarding certification; there's at least one on an EASA ARC on the German reg but based in the UK and there's also at least one with UK reg on an LAA Permit. Again, for me an LAA Permit is the way to go as I have a CAA "Licence for life" and have no intention (at the moment) of converting it to an EASA licence.
A 1964 Flying Magazine test on the new Junior here, including some discussion of aerobatics...
Flying Magazine - Google Books
(I also got a kick out of the Bede BD-1 article, what eventually became the Yankee)
Flying Magazine - Google Books
(I also got a kick out of the Bede BD-1 article, what eventually became the Yankee)
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Love that mag! They don't do 'em like that no more. Did you spot the add for a $16,000 Spitfire?
Flew a Junior many years ago with purchasing in mind. Disappointed with a number of things inc the unfamiliar yoke, the unbalanced control forces and even then the eye watering cost of some replacement parts.
Like so many a/c I didn't buy it's one I now regret.
Good luck.
SGC
Flew a Junior many years ago with purchasing in mind. Disappointed with a number of things inc the unfamiliar yoke, the unbalanced control forces and even then the eye watering cost of some replacement parts.
Like so many a/c I didn't buy it's one I now regret.
Good luck.
SGC
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A brief Google search yields a link to this German forum. Apparently, the Bölkow Junior indeed doesn't have the most spacious cockpit of it's class. With regard to take-offs from grass strips, user Armin Mueller writes 'The only drawback is the somewhat lame take-off performance. 600 m of grass should better be available.' Thomas Endriss confirms 'As you have mentioned correctly, there are no short field take-off characteristics. I only go below 600 m of grass when there are no obstacles in the departure sector.'
There is a manual on the website KeesM has found. It's in German, but you won't need a translator to read the take-off performance tables on page 43 of the PDF. In case you need one, I'd be happy to help.
There is a manual on the website KeesM has found. It's in German, but you won't need a translator to read the take-off performance tables on page 43 of the PDF. In case you need one, I'd be happy to help.
Last edited by hvogt; 6th Mar 2013 at 22:31. Reason: changed link
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What many people don't know is that the MFI-9's, or Bolkow later, is a warbird with proven action history. CG von Rosen, the Swedish flying count, brought a number of them down to Biafra and used them to bomb and attack targets in Nigeria in the liberation war, as well as fly mercy missions. They did some damage to MIG's and other aircraft, especially in Port Harcourt. Sturdy little aircraft.
CG von Rosen was later killed in Africa involved in another mercy project. Bit of a Swedish eccentric, but also a great humanitarian. A nobleman with a heart and who put his money where his mouth was. Not too many of them around.
Carl Gustaf von Rosen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
CG von Rosen was later killed in Africa involved in another mercy project. Bit of a Swedish eccentric, but also a great humanitarian. A nobleman with a heart and who put his money where his mouth was. Not too many of them around.
Carl Gustaf von Rosen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Last edited by AdamFrisch; 7th Mar 2013 at 00:51.
I used to fly one about 20 years ago - I have fond memories of a nice aircraft. Very repsonsive controls, not bad for aerobatics and with nice handling - although not well harmonised in the classic sense. However, a bit underpowered, very cramped for larger pilots, the Y stick is not to everyone's taste and it has relatively high wing loading - which means it doesn't have startling short field performance.
Stewart Luck is the guy you want to talk to.
People used to say the Beagle Pup 100 was underpowered too with the same powerplant, that was usually because they were used to Cessna 150s also with the same powerplant but much lower wing loading, so I would guess the same would apply to the Junior.
Personally I found the Pup 100 a delight to fly being much more responsive to the controls and much easier to land as it didn't float!
The 'Juniors' used in Biafra, as far as I recall, were much modified with strengthened airframe, high mounted tailplane, more powerful engine, and underwing hardpoints for weaponry. I think they were designated MFI-15 rather than MFI-9.
Always wanted to try one (and its 'lookalike' the ARV Super 2) but never got round to it.
People used to say the Beagle Pup 100 was underpowered too with the same powerplant, that was usually because they were used to Cessna 150s also with the same powerplant but much lower wing loading, so I would guess the same would apply to the Junior.
Personally I found the Pup 100 a delight to fly being much more responsive to the controls and much easier to land as it didn't float!
The 'Juniors' used in Biafra, as far as I recall, were much modified with strengthened airframe, high mounted tailplane, more powerful engine, and underwing hardpoints for weaponry. I think they were designated MFI-15 rather than MFI-9.
Always wanted to try one (and its 'lookalike' the ARV Super 2) but never got round to it.
Last edited by chevvron; 7th Mar 2013 at 11:26.
Thread Starter
hvogt, thanks for the link to the manual which prescribes a very precise 214m take off roll with 450m to clear the proverbial 50ft (15m) obstacle. I know the usual caveats of ace pilot, new aircraft etc apply to the numbers but they don't, on the face of it, prevent ops from a 550m strip with a downslope.
DeltaV, I'd assumed that the Junior was an Annex II aircraft as it was on a LAA Permit to Fly. Aren't Permit aircraft, by definition, either Annex II or kitbuilt? On the other hand the Cessna 170 is an Annex II aircraft but isn't on a Permit. Confused? I am!!
Biafra Babies in action here
and here
DeltaV, I'd assumed that the Junior was an Annex II aircraft as it was on a LAA Permit to Fly. Aren't Permit aircraft, by definition, either Annex II or kitbuilt? On the other hand the Cessna 170 is an Annex II aircraft but isn't on a Permit. Confused? I am!!
Biafra Babies in action here
Last edited by LowNSlow; 7th Mar 2013 at 11:40.
I fly from a 600 meter strip and used to share hangar space with a Junior. He never seemed to have a problem and later went on to win the Schneider Trophy in it. I flew with him a couple of times and I think there is a little more room in my Airtourer. This has the advantage of being Annex 2, is aerobatic and despite mine only having 115 hp, it got off the strip (solo) in about 250 metres in the very wettest/boggiest part of the Winter. There's one for sale on AFORS at the moment which might be worth a look.
The 'Juniors' used in Biafra, as far as I recall, were much modified with strengthened airframe, high mounted tailplane, more powerful engine, and underwing hardpoints for weaponry. I think they were designated MFI-15 rather than MFI-9.
The MFI-15/-17 was a later development with essentially only the looks in common with the MFI-9. Amongst others, it's bigger, has a more powerful engine (200 hp), a T-tail and two single sticks. It was produced in series by SAAB and is in use with the Danish (had a flight in one many years ago...
), Norwegian and Pakistani Air Forces (where it was also manufactured locally). There are a few civilian examples around, including a neat "experimental" example currently on sale on planecheck.com
The 'Juniors' used in Biafra, as far as I recall, were much modified with strengthened airframe, high mounted tailplane, more powerful engine, and underwing hardpoints for weaponry. I think they were designated MFI-15 rather than MFI-9.
Edit - EDMJ, we posted at the same time... Sorry for that!
Last edited by Silvaire1; 7th Mar 2013 at 14:21.