France and Pontoise
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Thank you Fuji; do you also maybe know LFOQ and LFPM airports? (they would be more convenient for our final destination) - on aeroport.fr they say they are open to GA and have avgass - but do you maybe have been there?
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I've been to Toussus several times. I usually walk to the RER and take the train into Paris, but there are taxis if you are patient.
Flying in is not a problem if you have the Paris area chart and the Toussus plate. Watch out for the "no fly" times.
The procedure used to be "overhead Rambouillet VOR" but that is now NOT advised.
Coming from the UK, talk to Lille who will look after you well. Clear customs at Le Touquet or Lille - there are none at Toussus nowadays.
Flying in is not a problem if you have the Paris area chart and the Toussus plate. Watch out for the "no fly" times.
The procedure used to be "overhead Rambouillet VOR" but that is now NOT advised.
Coming from the UK, talk to Lille who will look after you well. Clear customs at Le Touquet or Lille - there are none at Toussus nowadays.
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Does't stop bizjets going direct to Toussus from Biggin Hill - according to the departures board there 
According to a Citation pilot I know (non UK) anything can be arranged if the client pays. He didn't know the fee but thought it would be several hundred €.
According to a Citation pilot I know (non UK) anything can be arranged if the client pays. He didn't know the fee but thought it would be several hundred €.
another technique...
For Paris, I use St.Cyr - great airfield and very easy to then get into the city. The surrounding airspace is busy, but nothing too complicated.
From the UK, the trick is to file to Rouen (for your PPR Customs), then once you are talking to TWR ask if they are there. If not, ask him (nicely, ideally in French) if you can just fly through the overhead and for him to close the flight plan for you.
Generally they are not there, and the answer is 'bien sur" - so no landing, fees, time lost etc. The flightplan is closed, continue to wherever you want in France...
"If you don't ask..."
Cheers, Sam.
From the UK, the trick is to file to Rouen (for your PPR Customs), then once you are talking to TWR ask if they are there. If not, ask him (nicely, ideally in French) if you can just fly through the overhead and for him to close the flight plan for you.
Generally they are not there, and the answer is 'bien sur" - so no landing, fees, time lost etc. The flightplan is closed, continue to wherever you want in France...
"If you don't ask..."
Cheers, Sam.
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Last time I looked, Rouen lost its Customs too. Have they managed to revoke this?
Your suggested tactic is a good one but IMHO one needs to be judicious in its use. I mention a variant of it here. In fact I planned to use it on a trip to France which I cancelled this morning, to return to the UK from a certain "no longer Customs" airport halfway down France, by filing for e.g. LFAT and then diverting. This is IMHO impossible to question afterwards because you can say you did it due wx or whatever. Anyway, nobody seems to care re exit Customs; not even the Greeks. But I would not do it going into France (or some other country) because you then have to lie about your departure airport, which is, ahem, for those with balls of solid brass. The d1ckhe*d appearing on the bottom of page 1 here did that, among other things, into Switzerland. I am just happy that he did not do it in an N-reg; not the sort of thing GA needs, really....
It is better to do a touch and go to get into Schengen, but you need the co-operation of somebody in the tower
I wonder how long it will be before the French realise how they have shafted some high net worth tourist trade
Even Courchevel lost its Customs.
Your suggested tactic is a good one but IMHO one needs to be judicious in its use. I mention a variant of it here. In fact I planned to use it on a trip to France which I cancelled this morning, to return to the UK from a certain "no longer Customs" airport halfway down France, by filing for e.g. LFAT and then diverting. This is IMHO impossible to question afterwards because you can say you did it due wx or whatever. Anyway, nobody seems to care re exit Customs; not even the Greeks. But I would not do it going into France (or some other country) because you then have to lie about your departure airport, which is, ahem, for those with balls of solid brass. The d1ckhe*d appearing on the bottom of page 1 here did that, among other things, into Switzerland. I am just happy that he did not do it in an N-reg; not the sort of thing GA needs, really....
It is better to do a touch and go to get into Schengen, but you need the co-operation of somebody in the tower
I wonder how long it will be before the French realise how they have shafted some high net worth tourist trade
Even Courchevel lost its Customs.
Last edited by peterh337; 24th Aug 2012 at 13:02.
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I wonder how long it will be before the French realise how they have shafted some high net worth tourist trade
Trips for lunch on the Quai Henri IV at Dieppe don't count.
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You evidently don't revolve in the right company
I know a man who had a little plane (like mine). Without selling it, he bought a TBM700. Without selling that he bought a new TBM850.
He quite liked flying to Courchevel, and other places.
I can understand the rationale behind dropping "Customs PNR" from some sleepy airport in middle-east-ish flat-country France (even that is faulty because Customs virtually never turned up anyway so the cost was close to nil) but Courchevel?
One possible explanation for what the French did is that the Customs setup there was really a massive scam, like what Fleet Street used to run in the 1970s (with an individual appearing on the payroll under multiple names, and the unions were so powerful that the Inland Revenue gave them an amnesty), and the only way the French Govt was able to deal with it was by Maggie-sized chops.
I know a man who had a little plane (like mine). Without selling it, he bought a TBM700. Without selling that he bought a new TBM850.
He quite liked flying to Courchevel, and other places.
I can understand the rationale behind dropping "Customs PNR" from some sleepy airport in middle-east-ish flat-country France (even that is faulty because Customs virtually never turned up anyway so the cost was close to nil) but Courchevel?
One possible explanation for what the French did is that the Customs setup there was really a massive scam, like what Fleet Street used to run in the 1970s (with an individual appearing on the payroll under multiple names, and the unions were so powerful that the Inland Revenue gave them an amnesty), and the only way the French Govt was able to deal with it was by Maggie-sized chops.
Last edited by peterh337; 24th Aug 2012 at 19:20.
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Courchevel? Even if you friend had a mountain rating, I bet there are not many UK pilots that do. That's why I think the economic impact is negligible.
https://www.sia.aviation-civile.gouv...2007_23_EN.pdf
Anyway, I would not be surprised if Hollande reverses the decisions on some aerodromes and does not go through with the plan to reduce Customs facilities even further.
https://www.sia.aviation-civile.gouv...2007_23_EN.pdf
Anyway, I would not be surprised if Hollande reverses the decisions on some aerodromes and does not go through with the plan to reduce Customs facilities even further.
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The impact in the round must be miniscule. How many private flights are there into courchevel in a season from the uk? Never the less for those of us that enjoy trips to france it is nuisance and doubtless in consequence some will go less or not at all. I hope the french reconsider.
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I hope the french reconsider.
However, this probably has more to do with (local) political pressure, than sound economic policy. After all, the hordes of UK microlighters who will descend on Abbeville next weekend on their journeys to and from the Blois show, normally only spend their euros on fuel and a snack.
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Paris airports
That Pontoise (as the third largest airport for private and business aviation in the Paris region) no longer has customs is a loony decision only a truly idiotic French government could make. In addition,. to double down on the stupidity LFPM - Paris Villaroche (Melun) the 2nd largest airport for business are in the entire Ile de France region also lost it's customs. So you now have pretty much a monopoly situation for anything bigger than a PC12 of Le Bourget.
Interesting, so why would a major World capital city restrict access for the business aviation class to a single airport, when they have two other good airports at diametrically opposite sides of the capital city and offering under 1 hour road access into the centre.?
Could it be the C word? Is there an inherent corruption in the system one wonders. ADO, a private company has the monopoly of traffic. So why would the government favour a private entity over a state owned entity (LFPM) ? It makes no sense unless you see the way senior staff move freely between private entity and State employment and the friendships and back slapping and no down brown envelopes under the table for all this. Anyway, that's an opinion...it ties in with the know facts....but isn't backed with any formal proof of course.
Interesting, so why would a major World capital city restrict access for the business aviation class to a single airport, when they have two other good airports at diametrically opposite sides of the capital city and offering under 1 hour road access into the centre.?
Could it be the C word? Is there an inherent corruption in the system one wonders. ADO, a private company has the monopoly of traffic. So why would the government favour a private entity over a state owned entity (LFPM) ? It makes no sense unless you see the way senior staff move freely between private entity and State employment and the friendships and back slapping and no down brown envelopes under the table for all this. Anyway, that's an opinion...it ties in with the know facts....but isn't backed with any formal proof of course.
The suspicion might well be correct, and if so will be impossible to prove, of course.
But what's the use of reviving this thread after a full twelve years?
Anyway, for visiting Paris from most European countries the High Speed Train is to be preferred over any aeroplane, private or public. Making the point slightly moot.
But what's the use of reviving this thread after a full twelve years?
Anyway, for visiting Paris from most European countries the High Speed Train is to be preferred over any aeroplane, private or public. Making the point slightly moot.
Last edited by Jan Olieslagers; 7th May 2024 at 18:52.
