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Old 5th Aug 2012, 17:07
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Engine Checks

A thread to continue the discussion from the forced landing thread, about "cause of failure checks" for a partially failed engine in flight and about the use of a typical engine restart check list.

A restart check list to me is for the purpose of restarting a stopped engine and that is it, however it does raise the question about what you would do if there is an engine problem where the engine continues to operate, and there is some crossover between that and an in-flight restart.

Big Pistons Forever wrote:
What checklist are you going to use to deal with a situation like the mag failure ?
There isn't a check list for that, so most of us I think would look at the available instruments and listen to the engine sound to try and work out where the problem was. Would anybody at this point start fiddling with controls or maybe selecting a field or nearby airfield for a precautionary landing and communicating that accordingly?

Since Big Pistons Forever mentioned in the forced landing thread that he teaches a "cause check" for engine problems, I'd like to invite him to detail that here as it would quite likely be useful to many of us.
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Old 5th Aug 2012, 18:14
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Perhaps a simple check list for a rough running engine along the lines of:
  • Mags on both
  • Fuel pump on
  • Fuel quantity (change tank)
  • Carb heat hot or select alternate air
  • Oil pressure / Oil temperature check, if low pressure / hot then shut down.
  • Vibration - if high shut down (before you cant see instruments
  • Visible oil - if its obscurring the wind screen shut down before you cant see
  • Fire - shut down, enter engine fire drills.
ABOVE ALL - concentrate on flying the aircraft rather than diagnosing the problem, don't be distracted from flying the aircraft
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Old 5th Aug 2012, 18:16
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The restart checklist for the machine I have handy is split into two;
Starter motor restart
Airspeed 70kn
Fuel tap open
Fuel pump on
Throttle setting ½
Mags “both”
Starter on

Or for Dire restart
Airspeed >135kn
Fuel tap open
Fuel pump On
Throttle setting ½
Mags “both”

If I have an engine issue at altitude I scan left to right checking all controls and gauges that have an impact on the engine. I then take appropriate action.

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Old 5th Aug 2012, 18:48
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A venerable Ancient once imparted to me that 'Balls to the wall, crossfeed on, boost pumps on' will get you out of the majority of messes when low and/or without much time to fire up the old brain.
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Old 5th Aug 2012, 18:54
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I can never imagine I'd have enough mental energy to even try and diagnose an engine that suddenly gave up on me. Flying the aircraft under unusual conditions, even if they were amply trained and retrained for, AND finding a suitable field AND landing there with minimal damage will be more than enough to keep me occupied. Let alone reassuring a possible passenger.

If ever it happens to me, I intend to not even try to restart, unless everything else looks perfectly bright. Or perhaps if a fellow pilot were in the other seat.
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Old 5th Aug 2012, 18:57
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Off hand, I think few if any non-fuel-related issues will allow an engine to be restarted.

One obscure one is of you get a single duff magneto but which is still firing, at the wrong point. This will cause a potentially extremely rough running engine, so switching to the L or R mag is worth a try.

Otherwise, assume it is fuel, so... check fuel cock is on one tank or the other, electric fuel pump on, carb heat out (on a carb engine), alternate air out (on a FI engine).

Switching tanks can be tricky, because there will be a delay before the engine restarts, which has caused some people to switch back to the original (empty) tank, after which the bit of fuel from the non-empty tank comes through, "confirming" your belief that you are on the right tank now
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Old 5th Aug 2012, 18:58
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If the engine is running incredibly roughly and vibrating like crazy, rather than slavishly checking mags on 'both' consider turning one off at a time. If the timing has slipped on one it will run very rough if both are on. Identify the duff one and it'll run perfectly well on the good one.
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Old 5th Aug 2012, 19:01
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Fuel pump on, and assuring fuel flow should be done after assuring that there is no fire.

If it's on fire, you don't want to be putting more fuel to it, you should be closing firewall cutoffs before anything else, and just looking for a place to force land.
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Old 5th Aug 2012, 19:05
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If the engine is running incredibly roughly and vibrating like crazy
this poor beginner will shut it down before it shakes itself apart from the airframe - a certain way to disaster.
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Old 5th Aug 2012, 19:14
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It would take - oohhh - about a second to knock one mag off. If your problem is that the timing on one has slipped the engine will suddenly run as smoothly as ever and you can get on with your day.
Or you can panic, shut the engine down and then look for somewhere to force-land.
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Old 5th Aug 2012, 19:22
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Also remember if there is carb ice making rough running when you put the carb heat on it may get a bit worse before it gets better as the ice clears through...
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Old 5th Aug 2012, 20:19
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Oil pressure / Oil temperature check, if low pressure / hot then shut down.
I would be wary of shutting down the engine until landing is assured- UNLESS the engine was trying to rip itself out of the airframe OR fire. or another good reason.

I'd also not shut down based upon engine instrumentation alone unless landing was assured though I would look for a suitable spot to land immediately and set myself up for a landing.
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Old 5th Aug 2012, 20:24
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Somebody (I forget who) told me "scan the panel from bottom right (the left/right/both/off control) anticlockwise until you've sorted it".

In my one partial engine failure I watched the instructor (several continents away from the person who told me this) do just that, and it worked.
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Old 5th Aug 2012, 22:01
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An engine needs three things to run; fuel, air and sparks.

I check those things in that order so that means fuel - change tanks pump on etc. Air - Select hot or ram or filter or something appropriate and different. Sparks - are the mags on both or is there a possibility that one bad mag is dragging the engine down in which case selecting a single mag might be a good idea. This is a simplified and rapid check which will fix many engine related problems but still leave enough capacity to fly the aeroplane.

3 Point

Last edited by 3 Point; 5th Aug 2012 at 22:01.
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Old 5th Aug 2012, 23:19
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3 point, my idea too. Although I start checking "air" first, as this check includes the carb heat. And carb heat is something that needs to be done immediately, otherwise there won't be any heat left.
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Old 6th Aug 2012, 01:03
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Fuel, Air, Spark is my checklist.
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Old 6th Aug 2012, 01:49
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Before answering 500 mans question I think I need to put a bit of context to my answer. What I am talking about is what I teach for the PPL student or low time PPL pilot. Since this group by definition does not have the benefit of a lot of experience a framework of procedures IMO is of significant practical value in helping them deal with abnormal situations.

So first we have to talk about the most likely scenario that a PPL will experience. It is not a sudden total engine failure with no warning, it will most likely be engine roughness and/or a reduction in engine power. The engine will still be running and producing enough power for the aircraft to maintain altitude, but the pilot feels that there is something definitely wrong.

The school I teach part time at flies C 172P's and for this scenario I expect them to go to the emergency checklist where I have added a checklist for engine roughness/Reduction in engine power. I want the student to methodically work through the checklist so that they don't forget anything.

It goes like this


Engine Roughness/Reduction in Engine Power

-Carb heat.........................................Full On for at least 30 sec
-Primer..............................................Full in and locked
-Engine gauges...................................Check
Note 1: if severe carb ice exists engine will initially run very rough until ice has cleared)

Note 2: If high oil temperature or low oil pressure is noted go to that checklist

If problem persists

-Carb heat........................................Cold
-Mixture ...........................................Full rich then lean to max RPM

If problem persists

- Mags............................................Select right and left mag individually
(Note if engine roughness is more pronounced on one mag select the other mag or both, whichever gives smoothest operation)

----------------Land at nearest suitable airport------------------------

If problem persists

- Fuel selector.................................Left for 2 mins

If problem persists............................Right for 2 mins

---------------Land at nearest suitable airport-------------------------

In addition to to this I have emphasized the importance monitoring the engine instruments in flight. Instructors now periodically and without warning cover the oil temp/press gauges and make sure the students know where the needle is actually pointing. (In the green is not a good enough answer ).

With respect to abnormal oil press/temp indications, these can indicate an developing mechanical internal engine failure potentially resulting in a total engine failure. This is the least likely cause of an engine failure but they do happen. The good news is there will almost always be some warning. Any internal misalignment or failure will almost always result in metal rubbing. This will cause a rapid rise in oil temperature with the oil temp gauge pegging at its maximum value. A dramatic drop in oil pressure will quickly follow. Any engine showing these signs should be presumed to be in danger of imminent total failure and appropriate actions to land ASAP should be taken. The only caveat is an open circuit in the oil temp wiring will cause the oil temp needle to peg at the highest temp. However in this case the oil pressure will be normal so it is likely just the gauge. However a landing at the nearest suitable airport would be prudent.

The next level of checks (Again for a C 172P) is a memory "cause check" intended to restore power when the engine fails or is producing so little power that the aircraft will not maintain altitude and with the aircraft more than 1000 feet AGL. If the aircraft is below 1000 feet then no cause check is done and the pilot concentrates on flying the aircraft to a survivable touch down point.

After establishing the gliding attitude and pointing the aircraft at the nearest survivable forced landing area.

Carb heat.......Full on
fuel ..............Both tanks
Mixture .........Full Rich
Mags.............Both/left/right/both

This check can be done in about 5 seconds if practiced. By that I mean every couple of flights you make a point of going through the sequence touching each control to build muscle memory.

If the reason the engine failed was caused by a mistake you made ( eg missing a build up of carb ice, running a tank dry, forgetting to enrichen the mixture and then adding a bunch of throttle) then these simple actions will restore power and instead of potentially wrecking a perfectly serviceable airplane after you smashed it into a field when the engine stopped, you will restore power, and fly away vowing never to do that again.

Don't forget that the accident statistic show that up to 80 % of the engine failures are caused by the actions or in actions of the pilot. The Cause check won't save you if you have run out of gas but it will save you from some other mistakes that are not all that hard to make.

Finally I also discuss the high altitude engine failure. This is one where you are cruising along more then 5000 feet above ground and you suffer a failure or gross loss of engine power. After doing the cause check and all the other appropriate actions preparing for the forced landing, assuming you are well placed for the field it may be possible to do some more advanced troubleshooting. A variety of carburetor/fuel injection failures can result in the engine only running at certain throttle or mixture settings. So consider going to mid range throttle setting and starting from full rich and then slowly leaning towards ICO. If that doesn't work go back to full rich and starting from full throttle slowly retard the throttle. Is that doesn't work try giving the engine a shot of prime. If the engine starts and then dies you can get some power back by setting a low throttle setting and continually pumping the primer. The little bit of power you can get may provide a useful stretch to the glide. However I must emphasize that these techniques must not get in the way of flying the aircraft and should be instantly abandoned if you start feeling pressured by trying to trouble shoot and manage the forced approach.

Finally I have presented the checks meant for a C 172P. They apply to most light GA aircraft except for C 172R or S models or other aircraft with fuel injected engines so for these aircraft where the check says carb heat insert "alternate air" and for low wing aircraft like Pipers and Grummans where the check says fuel to both, insert fuel.... change tank and boost pump on.

So 500 man, I Hope that answers your question.

Last edited by Big Pistons Forever; 6th Aug 2012 at 02:00.
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Old 7th Aug 2012, 12:47
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Thanks for all the contributions!

'Balls to the wall, crossfeed on, boost pumps on'
That's an easy one to remember! I like it.

Switching tanks can be tricky, because there will be a delay before the engine restarts, which has caused some people to switch back to the original (empty) tank, after which the bit of fuel from the non-empty tank comes through, "confirming" your belief that you are on the right tank now
Good point. Waiting 2 mins on a tank would probably feel like forever so I can quite believe some pilots might not stick to that. It also makes me wonder about flight attitude. If you have unusable fuel presumably there are attitudes where you can still pick up the last bit of usable fuel?

So 500 man, I Hope that answers your question.
Thanks for that BPF.

Looking at potential engine related problems, I've scraped together the following list which are all problems listed in various POHs and the Lycoming engine operations manual. These are all things which a pilot can get some indication of in flight and possibly do something about. It's not a complete list by any means so feel free to add to it, but if we are thinking about a check list for engine related issues we should consider what problems can occur and what indications there may be. The fixes are only suggestions so don't take them as absolute gospel!

Idle roughness - Sometimes accompanied by a loss of power which can lead to stoppage in slow flight. Caused by an excessively rich idle fuel flow.

Fix - Leaning the mixture may improve roughness or be required to restart.

Engine driven fuel pump failure - Sudden reduction in fuel flow immediately followed by a total loss of power.

Fix - Switch on the boost pump.

Insufficient fuel - Oops!

Fix - Change tanks if you can!

Excessive fuel vapour - On injected engines may cause fuel flow variations and power surges which may lead to power loss. More likely to occur while taxiing.

Fix - Boost pump on, adjust mixture for smooth operation and if the problem continues try changing tanks.

Contamination - Most likely water which may cause fluctuating RPM, power loss or even stoppage. Other than noticing it I don't think there is much that can be done about it in flight.

Fix - Better preflight?

Lycoming:
Experience indicates that draining should be accomplished before refuelling, because fuel servicing mixes the water and fuel, and the water may not have settled to the bottom of the tank until the airplane is airborne.
Spark plug fouling - Caused by carbon or lead deposits forming mainly due to excessively rich mixtures. Identified by an obvious power loss running on an individual magneto.

Fix - Appropriate leaning should resolve this in flight.

Magneto malfunction - Sudden engine roughness or misfiring.

Fix - Select each magneto individually to identify the culprit and select the good magneto only. Different power or mixture settings may enable continued operation on both magnetos.

Intake ice/ carburettor ice - impact or refrigeration ice leading to rough running, power loss or stoppage.

Fix - With an injected engine use alternate air to bypass the blockage and carburettor heat on a carburetted engine (30s - 2min).

Q. If you had intake icing and had switched to alternate air, at what point would you consider switching back? Or would you at all?

Broken or deformed baffles/ seals/ cowl flaps - Reduction in cooling air around the engine. Higher than normal CHT or oil temperature. Possibly leading to pre-ignition (over heating spark plug barrels).

Fix - Reduce temperature by either en-richening the mixture, reducing power, or opening cowl flaps, or a combination of all three.

Oil loss - High oil temperature accompanied by low pressure likely means a failure is imminent. Likewise high oil pressure caused by a blocked breather tube may lead to a crankshaft nose seal rupturing and a spectacular loss of oil.

Fix - None

Interesting side note about preventing freezing in breather tubes which extend into the airflow (from Lycoming):
It is normal practice for the airframe manufacturer to provide some means of preventing freeze-up of the crankcase breather tube. The breather tube may be insulated, it may be designed so the end is located in a hot area, it may be equipped with an electric heater, or it may incorporate a hole, notch or slot which is often called a “whistle slot.”

Detonation - May be caused by leaning at high power settings and is unlikely to be noticeable unless severe.

Pre-ignition - Usually indicated by roughness, backfiring and a sudden increase in CHT.

Fix - (from Lycoming Engine Operations Manual)
The best temporary in-flight methods for correcting preignition and detonation are to reduce the cylinder temperature by retarding the throttle, enriching the mixture, opening cowl flaps if avail*able, or a combination of all of these.
That's all I've got time for, but one last note of interest from Lycoming:
Interpreting Your Engine Instruments


The present-day piston engine instruments used in the typical general aviation airplane are not precision laboratory instru*ments. We exclude the turbine and jet-powered aircraft from this discussion and will consider only piston engines, recognizing that the more expensive pressurized twin-engine models may also be exceptions. If one was to observe an irregular reading of one engine instrument, it calls for a cross-check on all other instruments, and not relying on one instrument as a basis for a decision affecting flight.
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Old 7th Aug 2012, 13:49
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One other note...An engine monitor, like the EDM830 we have fitted is also very valuable. If the Oil P went zero yet the EDM showed normal, then I'd consider it an indication problem.

Likewise if (for example) one cylinder starts to get hot or oil temp exceeds the pre-defined red-line limits we entered (or any other paramater being monitored exceeds a max or min limit) then we have a big red light which starts flashing on the panel. We can then cross check the EDM with primary instruments and if both agree then it is very quick to realise that there is an actual problem rather than a gauge problem. I highly recommend a decent engine monitor.

(plus you can download the data after a flight and keep a historical trend of each parameter. Useful for examining you engine's health over time).
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Old 7th Aug 2012, 14:52
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500 Man

To your list you can add

Abnormally high Oil Temperature/Cylinder Head Temperature: If the temperature is high but stable, open cowl flaps (if fitted), mixture full rich, increase airspeed (if climbing). If the oil temperature is steadily increasing and past the redline with a major drop in oil pressure then as I mentioned above you should consider the engine likely to fail and land ASAP.
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