Who keeps aircraft logbooks under EASA?
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Cilboldentune, Britannia
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Well until its established who eventually takes responsibilty for issuing the ARC (part G/I), maintenance companies will have to ensure that they cover all issues and implications of safety compliance. For instance could a C172 owner elect not to have their seat belts changed if they were good condition?
I cannot see how there won't be additional cost in submitting the GMB!
I cannot see how there won't be additional cost in submitting the GMB!
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: England
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I can't disagree with much in posts 25, 26 & 27 above, but the reality in UK EASAland (and the original question was about logbooks in EASAland) is that the rules exist which require the aircraft to be managed.
Either by the Owner/Pilot or by an organisation approved to do it.
As I said earlier, if an Owner does it for himself he can avoid all the costs of having someone do it for him, and there's no reason he shouldn't choose to do just that - and if he gets himself suitably qualified he can also avoid the charges made by other qualified people (LAEs) he may ask to do the actual maintenance tasks.
But many Owners either don't have those skills or the inclination to get the necessary qualifications (presumably they have other things they'd rather do with their time, and why not?).....hence the alternative of asking a company or organisation or even your mate who knows how, to do it for you. If you choose to ask someone to help, why is it unreasonable to pay for their efforts?
And no, I don't sell ANY annuals for $200 - and couldn't even get close, but then we are discussing and operating under EASA rules not FAA (and no, I'm not interested in a 'my rules make safer aircraft' discussion, because it's a pointless thing to do) - if someone wants to play in this park these are the rules to follow - if you don't like the rules, either play in a different park or get in at the NPA stage and make your case for the rules to be changed - let me know how you get on :-)
But I do have some N-Reg (and G-Reg) Customers who don't want me to manage their aircraft but still want me to tell them what's due, or can I tell them about/send them a copy of this or that - to me that's rather like asking a restaurant to let you eat your own food at their tables
...
Regarding what you might have to change under GMP - please just look at the requirements - all you have to do is assess the various recommendations from the different OEMs and make a reasoned decision about what's right for YOUR aircraft, then put those into YOUR maintenance programme.
If Mr Cessna suggests you change the seat belts at 10 years, while Am-Safe suggest on condition - your aircraft may fly 1500 hours/year and be parked outside in all weathers, or it may only be used 50 hours/year and be kept in a cool dry dark hangar - make your own judgement and put that in your MP. THEN you must stick to it, because you must follow the MP....and if circumstances change, then amend your MP to suit.
All you have to do then is keep an eye on the ADs, SBs etc and make similar assessments and decisions, and have your friendly spanner-bender do the jobs for you.
YOU can make your aircraft as over- or under-maintained as you can get past the CAA - or....
If you'd like me to do it for you I can do that, but I have to eat too, so please don't be offended if I ask you to pay me for my time and efforts (I didn't make the rules, I'm just trying to help you follow them, and I repeat, if you don't like these rules you can change the place you play or change something else until you get the result you want)
....but if you're going to ask me to do it for you, I know very well that, should something unfortunate happen, you'll be banging on my door right quick wanting to know why, so you'll forgive me for trying my best to incorporate every chance to make you safer - even if more safety costs more money (you do remember that, don't you? it's why NASA's budget is/was so high) - but if you DON'T want me to change your seatbelts, simply tell me (in writing please) and I can hold on to that just in case we end up having to show why we didn't..... if you see what I mean
And because it's not long till Christmas, and it's my 50th post since 2001, I'll now waive my 50 guinea consultation fee (see, I even reduced it from 250 before waiving it!)
Be safe
Either by the Owner/Pilot or by an organisation approved to do it.
As I said earlier, if an Owner does it for himself he can avoid all the costs of having someone do it for him, and there's no reason he shouldn't choose to do just that - and if he gets himself suitably qualified he can also avoid the charges made by other qualified people (LAEs) he may ask to do the actual maintenance tasks.
But many Owners either don't have those skills or the inclination to get the necessary qualifications (presumably they have other things they'd rather do with their time, and why not?).....hence the alternative of asking a company or organisation or even your mate who knows how, to do it for you. If you choose to ask someone to help, why is it unreasonable to pay for their efforts?
And no, I don't sell ANY annuals for $200 - and couldn't even get close, but then we are discussing and operating under EASA rules not FAA (and no, I'm not interested in a 'my rules make safer aircraft' discussion, because it's a pointless thing to do) - if someone wants to play in this park these are the rules to follow - if you don't like the rules, either play in a different park or get in at the NPA stage and make your case for the rules to be changed - let me know how you get on :-)
But I do have some N-Reg (and G-Reg) Customers who don't want me to manage their aircraft but still want me to tell them what's due, or can I tell them about/send them a copy of this or that - to me that's rather like asking a restaurant to let you eat your own food at their tables
...
Regarding what you might have to change under GMP - please just look at the requirements - all you have to do is assess the various recommendations from the different OEMs and make a reasoned decision about what's right for YOUR aircraft, then put those into YOUR maintenance programme.
If Mr Cessna suggests you change the seat belts at 10 years, while Am-Safe suggest on condition - your aircraft may fly 1500 hours/year and be parked outside in all weathers, or it may only be used 50 hours/year and be kept in a cool dry dark hangar - make your own judgement and put that in your MP. THEN you must stick to it, because you must follow the MP....and if circumstances change, then amend your MP to suit.
All you have to do then is keep an eye on the ADs, SBs etc and make similar assessments and decisions, and have your friendly spanner-bender do the jobs for you.
YOU can make your aircraft as over- or under-maintained as you can get past the CAA - or....
If you'd like me to do it for you I can do that, but I have to eat too, so please don't be offended if I ask you to pay me for my time and efforts (I didn't make the rules, I'm just trying to help you follow them, and I repeat, if you don't like these rules you can change the place you play or change something else until you get the result you want)
....but if you're going to ask me to do it for you, I know very well that, should something unfortunate happen, you'll be banging on my door right quick wanting to know why, so you'll forgive me for trying my best to incorporate every chance to make you safer - even if more safety costs more money (you do remember that, don't you? it's why NASA's budget is/was so high) - but if you DON'T want me to change your seatbelts, simply tell me (in writing please) and I can hold on to that just in case we end up having to show why we didn't..... if you see what I mean
And because it's not long till Christmas, and it's my 50th post since 2001, I'll now waive my 50 guinea consultation fee (see, I even reduced it from 250 before waiving it!)
Be safe
Last edited by Coriolis; 8th Mar 2012 at 20:25.
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